? Help removing car in Surrey - No spark, ECU query

Post Sat Jan 25, 2020 2:34 pm

My '89 325i s standard car, wouldn't start and after charging batteries and checking fuses, called the AA.

Current Situ :
They took the car to Barkers Motor Works who have said there's no output from the ECU. (Thursday)
On Friday I went and got another one from ABW in Essex and took to the BMWorks garage but they said it didn't start the car.
They are convinced it is the ECU.
I've now got a replacement ECU from ABW rushing it's was to BMWorks for Monday from a known working 325i, and another I bought from ebay which claims to 'work'.
All the right numbers of 0261 200 173

Wiring than ECU ?
However I'm suspicious it maybe wiring! If I get my car back I can test each wire one by one. Not something I relish of course but it should locate the error. I have a friend with an ECU tester device and if I can get that then I can more easily test each pin.

Parking Issue
There's a car parking issue at this garage now that British Rail have clamped down on parking by their fence.
The garage propose they put my car into storage for a week from Tue pm, as they can't continue to work on my car as they are really busy. I do appreciate that they have fitted my car into their busy schedule, to try to diagnose the fault.
However their 'recovery to Storage and back' is £160 / wk. The 'recovery' being 2 x £70 for a 10 mile journey !
I find it unfair to charge me, and it being pretty excessive.

So I'm wondering :
a) (Just a Chance?) if anyone might help me move my car back to Morden in Surrey from Haslemere or elsewhere ...
b) (Really cheeky to ask!!) if anyone in Surrey can go to the garage with their 325i and swap ecu 's to test my car's ecu, and to see if mine works in their car to prove if mine is genuinely at fault.
I know ECU's can fail but it is rare.
d) anyone got a tow bar ? (I have one in Scotland and can get it sent down if needed.) But Tuesday 28th is moving day one way or another if the ECU replacements don't fix it immediately!

Post Sat Jan 25, 2020 3:08 pm

I doubt very much if two/three(?) ECUs could all be faulty. This guide may be of use:

https://www.e30zone.net/e30wiki/index.p ... oubleshoot

How long has the car been out of use? It's probably worth checking the usual culprits, namely the injector loom socket under the inlet manifold, and engine-to-body earth strap is OK.

Post Sat Jan 25, 2020 4:02 pm

Thank you Speedtouch for the quick reply .... the fault finding chart is helpful but without the car I can't check anything further.

At this minute only the original and 1 extra ECU has failed to start the car.

I don't have the car so cannot check anything but I can tell you
1) the AA did check the relay (good) and the coil tested and all good. Checked earths - all good. He also sprayed that started (FailStart or ?) through the butterfly valve but it still failed to start.
2) batteries are good (car and the back up one)
3) I don't know the injector loom socket under the manifold. I'll check the Bentleys ...

I can certainly go through that cleaning and checking list, once I have it back. Perhaps the garage has or haven't tested/checked all or most of that, I would hope they have! But if they found the ECU claims an output fault, I'm guessing they will then 'stop' believing that they've found the culprit.
However many of the possible issues could be playing a part and will get checked in time.

The car wasn't used much for almost 2yrs from Oct '17 as I badly broke my ankle and was only properly driving again from about June last year.
The car broke a rocker on the way back to the Highlands in late Aug last year, and it took the young local mechanic 2 months to sort it out !! So I only had the car back barely a week, before driving south to Morden via Essex. I am worried that he had a lot of the engine exposed to the elements during that 8 wk period!
As I say I had noticed that the starting was taking longer. Nothing sounded 'wrong' but it just took longer to 'take'/fire.
I was then away for neigh a month and when I went to start the car it wouldn't run.

Post Sat Jan 25, 2020 6:49 pm

Sounds like you need to establish whether or not you're getting sparks at the plugs and fuel being delivered, i.e., does the fuel pump work?

Also, did the AA check the fuel pump relay or the ECU one?

Post Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:18 pm

It's extremely unlikely that there's anything wrong with your original ECU, let alone the replacement ones!!
Did the engine fire at all when sprayed with ether into the throttle body?
If not, the most likely reason that there's no output from the ECU is that there's no input. Crank position sensor is the first thing that should have been checked. After that the electrical supplies to the ECU should have been checked and confirmed.
This is such a basic engine by modern standards that any real mechanic should be able to tell why it's not starting in an hour or two at the most.

Post Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:03 am

Speedtouch the AA chap established that he got no sprak out of the spark plug he tried.
Fuel pump works.

Post Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:15 am

Thanks Brianmoooore, yes I agree, They're so far into approx 1.5hrs of disgnostics. All I've got from the service chap who's relaying info from teh main chap is that there is power to the ecu btu no output.
I'm not sure if that means no output to all wires or a selection (if thats even posisble)?
I've tried to source another 325i locally today and did find one but it's a show one. It mgiht be possible to get my ecu and take it to him though. That hasn't been ruled out.
No the engine didn't fire but when he sprayed the stuff he wasn't really getting it aligned properly with the valve and I wondered how much spray was truly getting in. So I felt it wasn't as good as it ought to have been.
The crank sensor was new not that long ago (mileage wise). However I don't know what tests they have and haven't done.
Once I have it back I can go through it all.
I now have a transported pencilled in for Tue to return it to me if the ecu's coming fail and if they haven't further solved it by Tue pm. Personally I was very disappointed that he didn't make the time to talk to me even if was briefly. Maybe I'll email them for a list of all the test results ?
Only I don't want to 'upset' them as they have fitted my car into their busy schedules!

Post Sun Jan 26, 2020 10:59 am

AuroraMagic wrote: ↑
Sun Jan 26, 2020 1:15 am
The crank sensor was new not that long ago (mileage wise).

In that case I'd be carefully inspecting where the cable that runs from it passes behind the water pump pulley. If not fixed properly here, the cable can easily be cut into by the pulley.

Post Sun Jan 26, 2020 11:41 pm

Brianmoooore Yes it was checked when the AA chap was with me... we had some fun tracing it but did succeed. We didn't check the plug itself was totally connected fully, (it had been working fine) but it all looked secure and intact.
I can of course re-check it more thoroughly when I get the car back.

Post Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:04 pm

Garage has rung and the car is working. Yeaaayy!

The ecu arrived, but they've now more than doubled their bill due to onging work.
They state that : "Engine ECU found to be faulty and providing no output to the ignition coil causing starting fault. Recommend replacement ECU or ECU repair moving forward"

I'm thinking they have found a wiring fault to the coil then ?
I can of course try the other ecu and the original too of course! (Unless theyve changed the chips over.
And I could take apart my old one and see if it's damp damaged etc ...

Post Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:04 pm

Thank you all for all of your help!

It is much appreciated.

Post Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:37 pm

AuroraMagic wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:04 pm

They state that : "Engine ECU found to be faulty and providing no output to the ignition coil causing starting fault. Recommend replacement ECU or ECU repair moving forward"

Which almost certainly translates as "we finally noticed the blindingly obvious cause of the problem, fixed it at zero parts cost, but decided to cover our arses to ensure we get paid for all the time we wasted".

Post Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:17 pm

Anyway, they got it going, and that's the main thing.

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 1:36 am

Brianmoooore wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 27, 2020 1:37 pm

AuroraMagic wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 27, 2020 12:04 pm

They state that : "Engine ECU found to be faulty and providing no output to the ignition coil causing starting fault. Recommend replacement ECU or ECU repair moving forward"
Which almost certainly translates as "we finally noticed the blindingly obvious cause of the problem, fixed it at zero parts cost, but decided to cover our arses to ensure we get paid for all the time we wasted".

Yep and since then I 've now tried the 'faulty' ECU's and both start the car! Hummm .... sounds like the above is a very real possibility.
I am delighted that it's going... I just wish I knew what they had done!