get your own car. I would never co-own a track day car.tlee wrote:You're right, I think I should attend the Bedford day coming up in February and try to blag some pax laps (or even a drive!) of the two different cars. The only problem is my friend (the co-owner) is kind of set on the 328i and he won't be in the country at the end of Feb so won't be able to join in the car assessment/fun in Feb.
E30 vs E36 track day car?????
Moderator: martauto
What's your reasoning? I personally can't see any downsides at all. You share the toy, you split the cost and responsibility, you take the hit if one or the other crashes the car.UweM3 wrote:get your own car. I would never co-own a track day car.
If the project were big budget I can see problems arising but as it is, it's a relatively low cost project.
I've had the same in discussions. That difference seems to point to an E36 needing coilovers compared to an E30 only needing cheap springs and shocks to get to the same level of handling.lancelot wrote:I once had a similar conversation with Geoff Steel about the merits of an E30 v and E36. While we were discussing M3's, he basically said that it was a lot easier to make a good car from an E30 than an E36. The '36 required more work and money to get to the same level, but overall had more potential if you really went to extremes.
Hi
we have both at present a E30 318is rally car and a E36 325i autocross car/ track car, the E30 on RWD Challange suspension ect is nimble and good fun to drive, the E36 is quite alot heaver but more power given a choice i would have the E30 but that is my choice, I have found parts for the E36 are expensive.
I am coming around to the opinion that the E36 325 24V engine into a E30 is the best way to go. what we need is some one to market a kit.
John
we have both at present a E30 318is rally car and a E36 325i autocross car/ track car, the E30 on RWD Challange suspension ect is nimble and good fun to drive, the E36 is quite alot heaver but more power given a choice i would have the E30 but that is my choice, I have found parts for the E36 are expensive.
I am coming around to the opinion that the E36 325 24V engine into a E30 is the best way to go. what we need is some one to market a kit.
John
because two people always means two opinions. And if you can't afford it on your own to start with, how can you suddenly if you crash it?tlee wrote:What's your reasoning? I personally can't see any downsides at all. You share the toy, you split the cost and responsibility, you take the hit if one or the other crashes the car.UweM3 wrote:get your own car. I would never co-own a track day car.
If the project were big budget I can see problems arising but as it is, it's a relatively low cost project.
I don't know if it's me or if I'm getting stressed vibes from you but anyway, there is not a case of 'can't afford it'. The split budget is something that has been set as a figure where I am happy to be spending each year as a bit of fun and so won't matter if it goes tits up. Without the split budget it was too difficult to have the fun I want but at a price where I am happy to fritter away.UweM3 wrote:because two people always means two opinions. And if you can't afford it on your own to start with, how can you suddenly if you crash it?tlee wrote:What's your reasoning? I personally can't see any downsides at all. You share the toy, you split the cost and responsibility, you take the hit if one or the other crashes the car.UweM3 wrote:get your own car. I would never co-own a track day car.
If the project were big budget I can see problems arising but as it is, it's a relatively low cost project.
As for differences of opinion, that is true but at this level of fun, those differences are going to be easy to sort out. If it were big budget, then yes, the differences will count for a lot.
my apologise if I came across stressed or rude or whatever. Wasn't intended, just running out of time sometimes and my replies are getting too short. Promise to do better in the future 
Of course it's a matter of opinions, you do what you are happy with. Didn't mean to knock it. It's just that I have seen situations like this many times and everything is fine till the first big bang. What I was trying to say was, if one of the owners is smashing the car and has to pay out the other it will cost you the same money that having the car on your own. I would rather have a cheaper car and have it on my own, than sharing it.
There will alway be that trackday where A wants to go but B doesn't or A had a wonderful session in the dry and B always draws the short match and is driving in wet. I am not even talking about the (maybe) different driving styles and opinions about the setup/tryes/brakes.
Just my 2p
friends again?
Of course it's a matter of opinions, you do what you are happy with. Didn't mean to knock it. It's just that I have seen situations like this many times and everything is fine till the first big bang. What I was trying to say was, if one of the owners is smashing the car and has to pay out the other it will cost you the same money that having the car on your own. I would rather have a cheaper car and have it on my own, than sharing it.
There will alway be that trackday where A wants to go but B doesn't or A had a wonderful session in the dry and B always draws the short match and is driving in wet. I am not even talking about the (maybe) different driving styles and opinions about the setup/tryes/brakes.
Just my 2p
friends again?
No worries Uwe. I see your points totally. There will be some fun arguments ahead - the first of which will be which coilovers to go for!Don't know whether to buy KW variant 3 or make a stretch to Billy PSS9 or just go cheaper with Eibach Pro Street.
Have you considered GAZ? They guy at GAZ is the former LEDA man. I few M3's I know run on GAZ and they are all happy. A rear single adjustable shock is £45+VAT! and is fully rebuildable or can be changed to any of your needs. Try that with Billy's.tlee wrote:
Don't know whether to buy KW variant 3 or make a stretch to Billy PSS9 or just go cheaper with Eibach Pro Street.
GAZ doesn't do a rear coilover for the E36, but you can ask TrackM3 about his AST suspension he bought recently......£Â£Ã‚£Ã‚£ (well over 1K£ I think)
Thanks for reminding me about AST. I remember this company from my Impreza days. I can't believe I let them slip through the net! From memory they have 3 kits with the top spec, remote reservoir version costing over £2K. The medium kit should be in the region of the Billy and KW price.
I've done the co own thing with a very good mate, & for the exact reasons of using it on difernet days & the potential for well you broke that bit so you pay etc it wasnt ideal, before that we shared my own track car, with him contributing for maintenace on each track day & specific upgrades etc like we want halfs on cage etc & for us it was we both later decided after the co own trial, a far better arangement.
I'm back to owning the car 100% now & for us it does work a lot better, the co owning is great for keeping the costs down tho as running a track car really does get expensive even on a humble base car, but its the diferent ideas & difernt budgets of those invloved that can cause issues, if one does 2 track days in it & the other 7 & the engine/gearbox blows how you split the cost etc & also if one of you lets another mate (whos no part of the share) drive & it blows with him driving well it can just get a bit messy
Ref shocks, for non M e36 Id go the GAz route too, cant for M3 tho as they dont make them, I'm koni eibach on the e30 but for e36 im temped by Tein actually, a mate is a dealer & I can get v good deals on it.
I'm back to owning the car 100% now & for us it does work a lot better, the co owning is great for keeping the costs down tho as running a track car really does get expensive even on a humble base car, but its the diferent ideas & difernt budgets of those invloved that can cause issues, if one does 2 track days in it & the other 7 & the engine/gearbox blows how you split the cost etc & also if one of you lets another mate (whos no part of the share) drive & it blows with him driving well it can just get a bit messy
Ref shocks, for non M e36 Id go the GAz route too, cant for M3 tho as they dont make them, I'm koni eibach on the e30 but for e36 im temped by Tein actually, a mate is a dealer & I can get v good deals on it.
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cheers for the information on your experiences. It's all good to know. As it stands I've offered my mate a number of options from a straight 50:50 ownership through to he owns and I 'rent' option. I see the pros and cons of each and I don't mind which option he chooses hence giving him the choice.
On the car front, I sealed the deal today on a nice boston green 328i Sport which I pick up on Monday. I can't wait to get it out on track!
On the car front, I sealed the deal today on a nice boston green 328i Sport which I pick up on Monday. I can't wait to get it out on track!
Go the E36 route, the E30 is averaging 20 years old and most are struggling with rust. A decent E30 is now dearer than an E36. The E36 doesn't cost much more than an E30 to get to a decent track spec. Removing weight costs you nothing. Fibre glass panels, suspension, brakes etc are the same or simular cost whether they be E30 or E36.
The E36 has fully adjustable suspension (except caster) as standard and if you get the alignment set up correctly you'll be driving round the E30s all day long.
The E36 has fully adjustable suspension (except caster) as standard and if you get the alignment set up correctly you'll be driving round the E30s all day long.