Whats with the IS and sport?

[e30bmlover]

over a 1k easy..... but it has been done properly. genuine parts none the less....

you could have had a BK 2.7 for that money

i didnt want a 2.7 i wanted a 2.5. if i wanted a 2.7 i would have had one built.** edit** im not going to rule out a 2.7 build........... but thats something for me to blow my '' fun '' money on another time

[pacerpete]

over a 1k easy..... but it has been done properly. genuine parts none the less....

you could have had a BK 2.7 for that money

i didnt want a 2.7 i wanted a 2.5. if i wanted a 2.7 i would have had one built.

Don't believe the wife ,size DOES matter !

[Alyman]

Just to throw another spanner in the works...

What about fully loaded 325ise models?

The silver car in my sig left the factory with "sport" leather, a 3.91 LSD, sport gearbox, rear pop out windows, battery in the boot, OBC, Air con, ABS etc. It then spent some time at Rossiters where presumably the ACS kit, suspension, steering wheel etc were added. In this sense, the car has not been put together by an amateur, all the work was done at the factory/dealers.

The only difference I can see between that car and an early sport is that mine is missing a maplight mirror and black headlining (and obviously a tech 1 kit in place of the one it has).

Despite this, that car did not cost me "sport money" nor will it ever be worth as much as a sport. Simply because there are 5 letters "missing" on the V5 (doesn't bother me personally, I doubt the car will ever see another owner).

But I think it raises an interesting aspect to the argument - there must be quite a lot of well specced 325ise models out there, that not only have the goodies that set a sport aside from the pack, but that also have the "factory" pedigree that seems to be important to people.

[bss325i]

Just to throw another spanner in the works...

What about fully loaded 325ise models?

The silver car in my sig left the factory with "sport" leather, a 3.91 LSD, sport gearbox, rear pop out windows, battery in the boot, OBC, Air con, ABS etc. It then spent some time at Rossiters where presumably the ACS kit, suspension, steering wheel etc were added. In this sense, the car has not been put together by an amateur, all the work was done at the factory/dealers.

The only difference I can see between that car and an early sport is that mine is missing a maplight mirror and black headlining (and obviously a tech 1 kit in place of the one it has).

Despite this, that car did not cost me "sport money" nor will it ever be worth as much as a sport. Simply because there are 5 letters "missing" on the V5 (doesn't bother me personally, I doubt the car will ever see another owner).

But I think it raises an interesting aspect to the argument - there must be quite a lot of well specced 325ise models out there, that not only have the goodies that set a sport aside from the pack, but that also have the "factory" pedigree that seems to be important to people.

Yours is a very high specced car with the added bonus of the AC schnitzer parts so will be of higher value than the average 325i but to be honest a spec as high as yours is not that common.

[e30bmlover]

i would have a schnitzer kitted e30 over a sport.... its my next plan!!!! sssssssssssh!!!

[Dave_M3]

And I've seenmany Non-sport E30s with Check-control panels too.

The thing about the 318iS being a baby M3...
I'd call it a baby M3 sometimes kinda in a joking way but to be honest...

It's more of a baby 325-sport more than anything else that just happens to handle better beacause of the smaller engine. Added bonuses are it being a more modern engine, it is more efficent and can be just as quick as some 325s

I'd like to have a proper sport too along with my iS, but I just couldn't justify the prices they are making.
And the iS's are just as bad over here which are making the same money as a genuine sport

Saying that: In Ireland, quite a few people would pay around 4-5K for an E30 if it had an M-tec kit, Alpinas and an LSD. Be it a 316 or a 325-Sport

[bss325i]

You think sports are making silly money? Now this person IS a dreamer lol!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1990-H-BMW-3-Seri ... dZViewItem

[e30bmlover]

lmao, i cant argue with that! what a @ucking joker!

[e30bmlover]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/261941.htm
now thast allot of car for the money!

[bss325i]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/261941.htm
now thast allot of car for the money!

Agreed, that is good value!

[Dave_M3]

40,000miles!

Thats one car I would pay 6K for

There was a 320iS on PH abit back for 4K iirc

[Oversteer]

That's a great car!
The engine revs more than the 2.3 and it's almost as powerful. The car has a shorter diff and it's lighter around 100kg!
Some say it's quicker than a M3 200hp! I only can say it feels a lot quicker!

Here in Portugal we had the 320is series for 3 years, 90, 91 and 92.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Yo7xyzjcZw

[Gussy]

Quicker than an M3? In a straight line perhaps.

Also - power schmower. People always seem to forget they are down about 22 ft / lbs of torque over the 2.3

[rebelcruiser]

bob_s well you have got it spot on in your sig you are a genral pikey.

[Rosc0PColtrane]

Say £1200 for a tidy e30 base model

What about the cost of your 320i?

Not sure what you are getting at with this question mate?

My 320i cabby was a 60,000 miler with full BMW service history. My bro said it's the driest second hand car he'd seen 5 years ago. The guy claimed it had M tech suspension, cannot remember if I'm the second or third owner.

He wanted 5k for it. The roof had started to tear, I paid 3,900.

Why didn't I buy a 325? I bought the car before finding this place, mate had a 320i about 5 years before I bought mine, I loved it, loved the sound, the smooth engine. I wasn't really looking for a motor but this was too good to refuse. Got a good deal in the end and nearly 5 years trouble free motoring, apart from replacing master and slave cylinders for the clutch.

If that's not what you meant, then sorry for the rambling!!

[lance1a]

The most expensive or highest specced car in a particular model will almost always be the most desireable, almost, because in certain markets the lighter and least specced cars are worth just as much (Porsche GT3 etc).
If you have converted your std car to sport spec, then it's simply because you like the look and either couldn't find one you could afford, or you bought a good std car and converted it from there. So what? The genuine article will have the higher value due to being genuine, and if a huge price gap opens up between the two then that suits me as I like the std one just fine. But if you want to take a std one and put all the bits on it, then that's all it is....a std one with all the bits. 'Snobbery' exists in order to make us want better things, if we were all happy as Larry then this discussion wouldn't be happening. I can appreciate a mint std car just as much as a mint Sport, and just as much as a mint 316E. As long as it's a very well kept E30 why all the in-fighting?

[bss325i]

Say £1200 for a tidy e30 base model

What about the cost of your 320i?

Not sure what you are getting at with this question mate?

My 320i cabby was a 60,000 miler with full BMW service history. My bro said it's the driest second hand car he'd seen 5 years ago. The guy claimed it had M tech suspension, cannot remember if I'm the second or third owner.

He wanted 5k for it. The roof had started to tear, I paid 3,900.

Why didn't I buy a 325? I bought the car before finding this place, mate had a 320i about 5 years before I bought mine, I loved it, loved the sound, the smooth engine. I wasn't really looking for a motor but this was too good to refuse. Got a good deal in the end and nearly 5 years trouble free motoring, apart from replacing master and slave cylinders for the clutch.

If that's not what you meant, then sorry for the rambling!!

It was aimed at e30bmlover.

[Rosc0PColtrane]

ok mate

[bss325i]

Ie he spent £1000 on puting a standard 2.5 in his 320i when as you stated say £1200 for a tidy base 325i.

[Rosc0PColtrane]

I think debating his engine swap is best left to the relevant thread. I entirely agree with his rationale, even if it's a round the houses and probably more expensive way of doing it.

[fuzzy]

Belive me its not badge snobbery.

To put it simply is a fake peice of art worth the same as the real thing? No

Is there any badge snobbery in that? No

Its just one is fake and one is real.

but what about when 95% of the 'fake' is as real as the original? what does it boil down to?
im not knocking anyones personal choice here ,theres no "in fighting" just debate,i fully understand the feeling of having something that you consider to be the best but for me and many others its an overinflated price to pay for not much difference when the majority of the rep and the genuine are the exact same parts . its not at all like comparing a standard sierra gl to a 4x4 cosworth.

[Bob_S]

bob_s well you have got it spot on in your sig you are a genral pikey.

well I think your response is wholly in-appropriate

[fuzzy]

Ie he spent £1000 on puting a standard 2.5 in his 320i when as you stated say £1200 for a tidy base 325i.

if you know your car well and have already replaced many parts then it can be more sensible to stick with the one you know well.

[bss325i]

but for me and many others its an overinflated price to pay for not much difference

Have you read the previous posts on the cost of building a replica? The price difference is not that great.

[fuzzy]

but for me and many others its an overinflated price to pay for not much difference

Have you read the previous posts on the cost of building a replica? The price difference is not that great.

no i didnt mean in building a replica i just meant settling with a good well sorted 325i instead of a sport.

[Jon_Bmw]

I hear the sounds of people flogging a dead horse. 320juicelover what do you know about your 325 engines history?

[tomstickland]

Cars are just a pile of bits. When they factory fit an LSD it's the same part as if someone came along later and put the LSD on a non-LSD car. The sport model is just an E30 with some changes. You can make the changes at any time. People like to delude themselves. I'd agree that the out-of-factory car will be worth more and some people have a warm feeling inside knowing that it was like that when new. Practically speaking though it really doesn't make any difference.

[bss325i]

Yawn! This thread is dead.

[Simon13]

i think the point most of the sport bashers are missing is the large amount of work and money it takes to make a standard 325i into a sport. A diff change isn't a 5 minute job and £250 for an LSD. Changing to a sport gearbox without a ramp isn't funny. lets hope the clutch is in good shape. Neither is buying a genuine kit and getting a good matching spray job. Nice bbs rims £200 the list goes on......

Changing to a black headlining properly is no sunday afternoon job, all the glass out, sunroof and if you don't have opening rear quarters well they don't come out easily.

When you try to do most of this yourself you can appreciate the effort it takes. Or you can come to the sensible conclusion that it is indeed p!ssing in the wind. Factor into the equation all the usual E30 problems and 5k plus for a good factory car seems a very sensible option for an easy life and come resale time.

Having owned a 318iS and a sport at the same time good ones are nice things and much better than a boggo 318,320 or normal 325. The only thing that comes close is a well specced 2dr 325iSE really and they are just as rare.

An M3 is for want of a better phrase a much more difficult car to live with, they need to be revved and stir the gears alot more than a 2.5. Chalk and cheese as they say and they appeal to different folks.

We should ban these threads!

[bss325i]

Just one last spin on this thread, what about motorsport convertibles? Top money for one of these is 9k which is double what a well specced 325i convertible is worth and people harp on about 'genuine motorsport cabs' more than anything else!

Code 796 and all that!

[kuntz_de]

now at 7 pages which explains nothing which the "clued up" forum members dint already know, it just shows different opinons and this often reflects how deep our pockets are.

a sport is more desirable than any 325i se or speced up 325i, and it will always command a premium. end of.

any one notice how IS's are going up in value, the reason is they are different to the norm, a limited edition
the same aplpies to e30 M3 and 320is's. i recal 6 years ago, when a very very nice sport evo was £10,000 to £12500 now they are £15,000 to £25,000

some other regular e30's comanding "strong" money are un abused original well speced examples. the variation in value of these cars is amazing at times, but its often down to overall condition

eg a 325i touring, clean unmarked body works in good colour ( diamond black or lachs silver) solid mechanicly with good options eg air con, sports trim or leather and 15" BBS's which some one will value at £500 ( posibly a wana be breaker ) may in reality be wowrth £2000 to some one else, but only if its good one. but in reality its the dogs which need £1000 spending on them are are the £500 cars for sale. people buy them thinking they are good value which may need a few things doing, but in reality they realise they should have spent a bit more on decent example.

on other example for you all to ponder,
2 e30's, i'll use 325i sports in this example, similar milage, same reg, same trim options, both have FSH, dealer and specialist etc but one is sterling silver and one is briliant red.........

which one will sell quicker ? which one will sell for a higher price ? a simple example with simple answer.

this is the same for all special editions cars , the GTI 25 aniversary edition mk4 golfs command a premium, RS 500's , and in the BMW range evo 2 e30 m3's, e36 2.8 sports, e36 m3 GT, e46 CSL's, not much splits these cars from the originals they are based on but always command more money. some are only cosmetic changes but some have different engine "bolt ons"

its the way the market is and its the way it will always be. live with it.

buy what you you want, do what you want with it, spend your money any way which makes you happy.

[e30bmlover]

I hear the sounds of people flogging a dead horse. 320juicelover what do you know about your 325 engines history?

it was a 130kmile engine, it had been stood for a few months, i bought it from less2303 for the princely sum of £150+£50 carrige.
the engine came with a afm( painted red!!), ecu and a k+n filter
i rang my first mecahnic and said i wanted the oil leaks sorted on the b20, he came back and said it had about 4 leaks in total inc one from behind the cam belt. so he said he would put the b25 in. he came and took the head off, acid dipped it and had it pressure tested( it passed with flying colours) and rebuilt the head replacing every seal and gasket on the way(i shit you not!) and also a rocker, he then started dragging his heels.....so i got the head back from him.
i then found stephan bmw in dereham thanks to a zoner. ralph has a good reputation for bmw's around here, he has been working on them since the late 70's. i told ralph to take this job on as if it was a @ucked engine. he stripped the head for a second time checking the work that the other bloke done. no compalaints. after ralph had done with the head he started on the bottom end, long story short he re shelled it and said the engine was in very good order..... i will take his word for it.
so it dosent really matter what the engines history is, everything was checked and was way within tolorance, hence one of the rockers not meeting the required standard and being changed(so iv been told)]i guess i was lucky and got a sound engine.

[Geeman]

So... after all that, we've come to the conclusion that a Sport IS better than a standard 325i and worth the extra money... as it IS cost prohibitive to go and 'build' a replica yourself, as we've seen from the list of parts needed and the labour charges to fit and paint whatever's needed.

*sigh*

Can we now close the subject?

I win.

[Morat]

I think the "premium" reflects the rarity. So many doggy old sports have rusted out from behind their bodykits that they're getting hard to find in good order.

[Rosc0PColtrane]

I think the "premium" reflects the rarity. So many doggy old sports have rusted out from behind their bodykits that they're getting hard to find in good order.

That's probably the best reasoning on this thread, why did you wait 7 pages to post it mate??