E36 Compact Engine Swap (1.6 - 2.8)
Moderator: martauto
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jaistanley
- E30 Zone Addict
- Posts: 2517
- Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: Coventry and Essex
I have a cross brace like that from the ZMRoadster I broke....
I should be able to fit to the e30 do you think?
Jai
I should be able to fit to the e30 do you think?
Jai
Intake & BBTB Upgrade
The M52B28 engine is restricted to 193bhp. This was done due to German insurance regulations. By replacing the intake manifold with one from an M50 the restriction can be lifted, taking the bhp to over 200.
The M50 intake needs significant amount modification to fit the M52. I purchased a kit from Alpina527 on http://www.e36coupe.co.uk. This included the modified M50 manifold and a BBTB (big bore throttle body, this has a wider opening and allows more air through). This is a super kit, very clear instructions and it all fits together really well!
The change has made a noticeable difference to the engines performance! From about 4.5k rpm up there is really big boost!
The following picture shows the restriction on M52 manifold. The green line shows the m52 intake size, the blue line shows the size of the m50 manifold.
On the left you can see the M50 intake manifold and on the right the M52 manifold. There is a significant difference!
On the left is the original throttle body and the right is the BBTB.
The next three pictures show the original intake, no intake then new intake.
The M52B28 engine is restricted to 193bhp. This was done due to German insurance regulations. By replacing the intake manifold with one from an M50 the restriction can be lifted, taking the bhp to over 200.
The M50 intake needs significant amount modification to fit the M52. I purchased a kit from Alpina527 on http://www.e36coupe.co.uk. This included the modified M50 manifold and a BBTB (big bore throttle body, this has a wider opening and allows more air through). This is a super kit, very clear instructions and it all fits together really well!
The change has made a noticeable difference to the engines performance! From about 4.5k rpm up there is really big boost!
The following picture shows the restriction on M52 manifold. The green line shows the m52 intake size, the blue line shows the size of the m50 manifold.
On the left you can see the M50 intake manifold and on the right the M52 manifold. There is a significant difference!
On the left is the original throttle body and the right is the BBTB.
The next three pictures show the original intake, no intake then new intake.
Last edited by RichS on Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Andy that's impressively gutted since we saw it! 
It was nice to meeting you and have a good chat, I look forward to reading the article in when it comes out 
It was nice to meeting you and have a good chat, I look forward to reading the article in when it comes out 
As Patrick said, was great to meet you, got some great backgrounds for my pc
I gave that tuning place you suggested, near Thruxton, a call about having a remap made. They were at Silverstone for the day so need to call again at some point.
I gave that tuning place you suggested, near Thruxton, a call about having a remap made. They were at Silverstone for the day so need to call again at some point.
BTW did you keep the old interior, engine, struts and bits? You could have a buyer next time I'm down! I just bought a 1995 N 316i Compact for £475 off Ebay and spent a whole day cleaning up the interior when yours was probably a lot better!
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mrfuzzyfelts
- E30 Zone Newbie
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:00 pm
Just dome this conversion.. Took me 2 days all in all....
Only thing left now is to do the Exhaust!
Good thread! Helped me anyway
Had to also change the ARB on mine.. Thought id mention it incase anyone else has the same thing, then engine sat on the old one... The 328 one is much lower.
Only thing left now is to do the Exhaust!
Good thread! Helped me anyway
Had to also change the ARB on mine.. Thought id mention it incase anyone else has the same thing, then engine sat on the old one... The 328 one is much lower.
Dyno Run & ECU Remap
After the engine modifications I decided to have the ECU remapped to take full advantage of the changes. I took the car to West Tuning by Thurxton for a custom remap.
The key goal was to increase the power in the mid range and stop over and under fuelling through the power curve. The result of these changes help to improve the drivablity, it does not go for maximum bhp.
The following video shows the first run before the remap. This shows what effect the m50 intake manifold and big bore throttle body had on the engine.
First run video (right click > save as)
Once the first dyno run was completed the ecu software was downloaded, unfortunately my ECU turned out to be one a very limited run, it has slightly different hardware & software. This meant the remap had to wait until software's check sum number could be confirmed. As a result the remap was done on the next day and I was not present so there is no video, however I do have a printout of the results.
Below is the first run, second image shows the completed remap.
red - original
blue - the first pass of the remap
green - final remap
Stock M52 2.8
193 bhp 280nm torque
M50 maniflold & BBTB
220 bhp 295nm torque
Remap
236 bhp 313.2nm torque
(click for bigger)
After remap
After the engine modifications I decided to have the ECU remapped to take full advantage of the changes. I took the car to West Tuning by Thurxton for a custom remap.
The key goal was to increase the power in the mid range and stop over and under fuelling through the power curve. The result of these changes help to improve the drivablity, it does not go for maximum bhp.
The following video shows the first run before the remap. This shows what effect the m50 intake manifold and big bore throttle body had on the engine.
First run video (right click > save as)
Once the first dyno run was completed the ecu software was downloaded, unfortunately my ECU turned out to be one a very limited run, it has slightly different hardware & software. This meant the remap had to wait until software's check sum number could be confirmed. As a result the remap was done on the next day and I was not present so there is no video, however I do have a printout of the results.
Below is the first run, second image shows the completed remap.
red - original
blue - the first pass of the remap
green - final remap
Stock M52 2.8
193 bhp 280nm torque
M50 maniflold & BBTB
220 bhp 295nm torque
Remap
236 bhp 313.2nm torque
(click for bigger)
After remap
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tristan325
- E30 Zone Regular
- Posts: 570
- Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 11:00 pm
- Location: LEEDS LEEDS LEEDS
What a great thread! Well written and lot's of lovely piccies!
Thanks for the recommendation. Roy did exactly the right thing, make the car as drivable as possible not just strive for the highest bhp.Andyboy wrote:Very nice too. Old Westy knows how to map a car and he gets very good results. And he owes me a pint now - glad my recommendation worked out for you.
236 bhp - still want to fart about with an old 2.7 M20 then boys?
Thank youtristan325 wrote:What a great thread! Well written and lot's of lovely piccies!
New Wheels
A while ago I encountered a pot hole on a B road while driving at night. As a result two of my wheels were damaged. Despite having them rebalanced I still had vibrations.
After putting it off a long while I decided to get some new wheels. Although I really liked my original wheels I chose to go with something else as a replacement.
A while ago I encountered a pot hole on a B road while driving at night. As a result two of my wheels were damaged. Despite having them rebalanced I still had vibrations.
After putting it off a long while I decided to get some new wheels. Although I really liked my original wheels I chose to go with something else as a replacement.
Stunning. Absolutly stunning. Looking like a first class job
Andy
Andy
M50B25NonVanos & M52B28Vanos Heads for sale. Pm Me.
Unfortunately the coilovers stick out too far so the edge of the front tyres rub against the bottom spring pads; the below image shows the difference between coilover and regular. It needs about a 9mm space on the wheel to clear, that causes a bunch of other problems with rubbing elsewhere. If I were to raise the suspension it would probably need to go to stock height for the bottom of the spring & adjuster to clear.
Its very close, my previous wheels were 225/45/17 on 7j's and the new ones are also 225/45/17 but on 8j's that extra 2.54cm causes problems.
To solve the problem I decided to replace the whole suspension with Koni dampers & Eibach springs. In addition to solving the rubbing problem the new suspension setup will make the ride more comfortable.
Since everything has to disassembled I decided it would be a good idea to change all of the front ball joints at the same time. The easiest way to do this is to just replace the lower wishbones and track rod ends, rather than having the old ball joints pressed out and new ones installed. As a small upgrade I decided to get e30 wishbones; the e30 ball joints are in a metal sleeve rather than plastic; this makes them last longer & improve the feel of the road, on the down side you lose a little comfort as you feel everything through the wheel.
Koni Dampers & Eibach springs
I decided to restore to the top plate for the springs. They only had a little surface rust, but a good coating of paint can't hurt.
All of the parts ready for assembly. I decided to get new top mounts to get everything up to new standard.
Its very close, my previous wheels were 225/45/17 on 7j's and the new ones are also 225/45/17 but on 8j's that extra 2.54cm causes problems.
To solve the problem I decided to replace the whole suspension with Koni dampers & Eibach springs. In addition to solving the rubbing problem the new suspension setup will make the ride more comfortable.
Since everything has to disassembled I decided it would be a good idea to change all of the front ball joints at the same time. The easiest way to do this is to just replace the lower wishbones and track rod ends, rather than having the old ball joints pressed out and new ones installed. As a small upgrade I decided to get e30 wishbones; the e30 ball joints are in a metal sleeve rather than plastic; this makes them last longer & improve the feel of the road, on the down side you lose a little comfort as you feel everything through the wheel.
Koni Dampers & Eibach springs
I decided to restore to the top plate for the springs. They only had a little surface rust, but a good coating of paint can't hurt.
All of the parts ready for assembly. I decided to get new top mounts to get everything up to new standard.
Last edited by RichS on Thu Aug 02, 2007 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Here you can see the difference between the e36 and e30 wishbones.
All done
New ride height is a little higher than before. It's far more comfortable on the road due to the progressive front springs.
Thanks to the new ball joints the steering feels like new, its very direct and responsive.
All done
New ride height is a little higher than before. It's far more comfortable on the road due to the progressive front springs.
Thanks to the new ball joints the steering feels like new, its very direct and responsive.
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james_obryan
- E30 Zone Newbie
- Posts: 103
- Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2007 11:00 pm
It might be a bit late but 330 brakes should fit and are much better than the 328 brakes.
Also, no such thing as a S52 engine in euro just S50B30 and S50B32. S50B32 with the 6 speed box is arguably as economical as my e30 325 / slightly worse than a e36 328 but not noticable unless you boot it.
What level of eisenmann backbox is that sport or race as it looks quite large!
Oh, TIG welding for exhausts my friend, not MIG but as long as its not blowing yet it should be okish.
One last thing, dyno should have been in 5th gear and not 3rd, those figures are meaningless, what you want is RWHP, unless you know the % drivechain loss that the used to guess?
Also, no such thing as a S52 engine in euro just S50B30 and S50B32. S50B32 with the 6 speed box is arguably as economical as my e30 325 / slightly worse than a e36 328 but not noticable unless you boot it.
What level of eisenmann backbox is that sport or race as it looks quite large!
Oh, TIG welding for exhausts my friend, not MIG but as long as its not blowing yet it should be okish.
One last thing, dyno should have been in 5th gear and not 3rd, those figures are meaningless, what you want is RWHP, unless you know the % drivechain loss that the used to guess?
Excellent install and very nice car.
The dyno was done in the correct gear for that type of dyno.
Ray West knows what he is doing.
Evo-S
The dyno was done in the correct gear for that type of dyno.
Ray West knows what he is doing.
Evo-S
Thanks for the comments
The 328 brakes are fine for normal road use. Once the pads or rotors have worn through I may consider upgrading the front to 330 ones.
The back box is a sport box, its actually for 323ti and uses the same box as the z3 2.8 only difference is the location of the hangers. I didn't want a loud exhaust I just wanted to add nice deep rumble to the sound.
As for the results from the remap the I think the important thing is the relative difference from before and after. If the actual flywheel BHP figure is plus or minus a bit doesn't really matter to me. After the work was done I felt a very noticeable improvement. Ray focused on boosting the mid range torque rather than getting the absolute highest possible BHP figure.
The 328 brakes are fine for normal road use. Once the pads or rotors have worn through I may consider upgrading the front to 330 ones.
The back box is a sport box, its actually for 323ti and uses the same box as the z3 2.8 only difference is the location of the hangers. I didn't want a loud exhaust I just wanted to add nice deep rumble to the sound.
As for the results from the remap the I think the important thing is the relative difference from before and after. If the actual flywheel BHP figure is plus or minus a bit doesn't really matter to me. After the work was done I felt a very noticeable improvement. Ray focused on boosting the mid range torque rather than getting the absolute highest possible BHP figure.