My S50 swap.. Progress and questions

[Jhonno]

As in the hose from the header to the bottom, hose from the Y pipe to the top? (sorry for bein thick )

[Jhonno]

Just thought of another thing... When you relocate the dipstick it is now only bein held at the bottom n wobbles about? How have people secured it at the top again also? Not really looked into this yet just noticed it..

[ste]

Is there a sollution for using one of these rads with the header tank built in (a la 325i E36)? I'd like to save space/make the engine bay neat so they look like a good idea. I'm sure they'll cool enough (pretty sure)

I'm using a new E36 328i radiator for exactly that reason. Header tank built into the rad and a tidier engine bay.

[Jhonno]

Ste - i think that works fine with the M50/52's but according to Ian the S50's run hotter and need the bigger rad.. I was goin to use the same idea, but Ian advised me against it for the S50 route

[GermanGorilla]

Hi,

Not sure that the combined Rad / Expansion Tank would be a good
idea on the S50 B32.

Like Ian says, it runs hot.

In running quite hot it requires all the expansion it can get, with the
inlet of the expansion tank, ideally being 50 mm above the the inlet
to the Rad.

If not you can suffer bad circulation, erratic cooling and even burst
coolant pipes.
Read the English version on ''E30.de'' for similar problems when doing
the S38 Convesion.

I would seriously recommend the Rod Bolts though.
www.priracing.com 80.75 including VAT,
stock code 201-6102- ARP 2000 Pro Series.

Make sure the dipstick is secured/located properly to the engine.

Regards,

The Gorilla.

[Jhonno]

how hard is it to drop the sump with engine in situ? tempted with the rod bolts now.. hadnt thought about it before as its a 3.0..

custom bracket or something for the dipstick then?

coolant is now on its way to bein plumbed, need to mount the oil cooler n then its wiring and odds n sods i think (other than the servo issue which im still undecided about)

[buster]

well i fitted my engine without sump then fitted new sump in situe,just used a trolly jack to lift engine slightly to get sunp in.
Im worried about the rod bolts now
If i keep standard ecu mine should be ok no ?
Do the 3.2's have forged pistons ? i think they do but not sure.

[ian332isport]

Im worried about the rod bolts now
If i keep standard ecu mine should be ok no ?

Andy,

I shouldn't worry about it too much. I'm still on standard bolts, and it gets a regular thrashing.

Ian.

[buster]

Ok,thanks Ian.
Do the 3.2's have forged pistons then ?

[jaistanley]

My paranoia about rod bolts stems from them being the only real fault I've found with the engine from searching the internet. When you say 'I'm fitting the 3.2' to that smartarse beemer 'expert' you know down the pub, the first thing they do is pull a face and tell you how un-reliable they are. I can only assume this stems from idiots buying E36 3.2's and A: neglecting the oil service and the VANOS and B: thrashing the life out of them (probably cold) and spinning shells.

Seeing as I'm an idiot thats used to ragging the nuts off of underpowered 4 pots, and have a habit of revving my cars, I thought it'd be a nice upgrade. I must admit I'd only see titanium ones for more like £250 and was umming and aahing but I will probably go for those steel ones at a more sensible £80 ish (thanks for the link).

Right now I plan to take it easy and drive the engine sensibly so wont need them, but in the future if I fit the aftermarket ecu and start taking the car to tracks, I'd like the added warm fuzzy feeling of ARP bolts Now seems the ideal time to fit them as I doubt I'll want to swap them in the car!

I dont know if the pistons are forged (i doubt it on a production engine eh?, think of the piston slap when cold) but they may be hypereutectic or something a little advanced like that. Upgrading to forged might shave some weight off and reduce the risk of the rod bolts mis-behaving. Thats a lot of money on the offchance! I'm not going to do (unless I go nuts an buy a carbon air-box, reground cams and an aftermarket ecu... )

[Jhonno]

Jai.. Early XE engines used to run forged Mahle pistons.. So not unheard of on a road car from the factory

CATCAMS do cams for the S50..

[jaistanley]

Not un-heard of but it all comes down to cost.. A guy I know did a feasibility study of swapping from 6 stud to 5 stud on a production 4*4 (he works for Nissan) and saved millions in material costs and time (labour fitting the extra nut!).

The catcams lok like a nice idea. Not sure if they are for the 3.0 single vanos or for the B32 double, either or if they'll fit both. I'm told you can lock the VANOS out with two 3.0 exhaust cam sprockets if that's what's required. I'd personally like to keep the VANOS, it does a very good job.

God. I'm talikng about S50 tuning here.. I haven't even got the engine into the car yet!! And lets be honest, I think it's a pretty god damn good engine as standard; Nice dynamics, loads of torque (more than enough everything for the E30 chassis!) etc etc.



Jai

[Jhonno]

Yeah but once its in there n you lose to some (albeit high end) council chariot for the 1st time the mind begins to wonder

Im having issues with where to mount the oil cooler atm.. Its a MOCAL one as i bought a 325i one but the ends got knackered when i tried to reverse the lines so thought sod it i'll buy new to save the hassle.. But then try and find somewhere suitable to mount a 13 row cooler on the front end of an e30 Im worried bout mounting it too low n it getting smacked! My sump im particularly scared for.. it has 3.5" of clearance to the tarmac!!

[jmc330i]

My sump im particularly scared for.. it has 3.5" of clearance to the tarmac!!

Tell me about it, Ive already started my sump guard fund

Any pics of your oil cooler? Nobody could tell me what size cooler to go for so I used the M20 cooler, but Im not sure how leak resistant my connections will be, so I may change to a Mocal cooler if I get problems once I start using the car.

[Jhonno]

I'll just go n get one..

[jmc330i]

[Jhonno]

Here it is.. Dim 97x330x51

[Jhonno]

Also got a what is this.. Found it earlier n looks like it should be attached to something

[Jhonno]

Lastly for now.. Which +VE wire should be used to put the battery terminal on?

One of these 2 or the other one which comes out with a load of relays on the otherside?

[ian332isport]

Also got a what is this.. Found it earlier n looks like it should be attached to something

That's an E36 heater valve. Not needed

[jmc330i]

Here it is.. Dim 97x330x51

Monster

It might fit where the M20 cooler would be, but with something to direct the airflow down to the top section. I will get down to my car later, have a look at the available space and have a think.

That pump isnt something Ive seen on my S50, but it does look like a water pump I fitted to a V6 converted Astra - circulated water around the rad to help it cool once the engine had been switched off - standard fitment on the Vaux V6s I think. IIRC some of the later M54s had something similar, Ive seen something like it on the ETK.

Cant remember what I did with those wires, but will have a look when Im at the car, unless Ian or Buster can help before hand.

[ian332isport]

Lastly for now.. Which +VE wire should be used to put the battery terminal on?

One of these 2 or the other one which comes out with a load of relays on the otherside?

Both of those go to the battery. The big one supplies power to the starter etc, and the smaller one provides power for the injection electronics.

The big red one the other end is the main 12v feed into the fusebox. If you have left the original E30 wire in place, you don't need it. Just insulate it and hide it somewhere. I removed the original E30 wire, and fed this into my fusebox.

Ian.

[Jhonno]

Awesome, so it doesnt really matter then.. Next job to be done then

[ian332isport]

Awesome, so it doesnt really matter then.. Next job to be done then

If the battery is in the front (as yours appears to be), then they both simply go to the +ve terminal of the battery. If the battery is in the boot, then there's actually a separate fused terminal on the bulkhead junction point for the smaller red wire.

Ian.

[Jhonno]

Mines in the front for now, till i can find a breaker with the little bits that go with (have the main front to rear cable but none of the rest atm)

[jaistanley]

All good stuff chaps...

As for the oil cooler: I was intending to use the M20 one but now it looks like I'm going to fit that (with an M20 still attached) into my daily hack 318is; leaving me in the same boat as before: I have the cooler from the S50 but it was damaged in the crash. The pipes are shot on the cooler end but are fine at the engine end. Ie they could be used to make some new pipes up.

How do you make these oil pipes for the cooler? Are there unions available to do this at home or do I need one of those hydraulic flexi pipes crimpers? I was thinkng about either getting one of the slimmer Mocal's from ebay (one about the same size as the S50 cooler), getting a replacement S50 one (easier said than done) and making brakets for it or getting another M20 one. For both sollutions not using the S50 pipes I shall have to make up some sort of pipeage.....

One question I also have: The E36 reverse wiring is in the engine loom correct? Is this also true for the reverse on an automatic M20 E30?

How much does a sump guard go for? My iS sump has loads of grases and scratches all over it where it's too low and I beleive the S50 hangs lower... ERK! There are loads of those square speed bumps near me, just right for the wheels to miss and the sump to smack!

Jai

[buster]

I think ,if i could have done my conversion again i would mount the servo like Dameon has with the plate.Also i would mount and refit the abs pump into the battery tray so theres plenty of room near and behind the nearside headlight.Then the carbon plenum i have would fit better.
BTW,i will get that thing back on some day,just need a spare maf to play with.

[Jhonno]

anyone got any pics of the inside of modded plenum? just that No.6 trumpet looks maybe a little lacking in room when the plenum is whole.. im leaning toward a modded plenum with the smallest servo i can find for the time being.. I can always buy another plenum if i decide to go another route..

[jaistanley]

If you went to an aftermarket ECU you could loose the MAF.. That's what I was thinking looking at it.

Moving the ABS: I considered this. Obviously would require a total re-pipe, but thats easy enough. The only thing that might be a pain is lengthening all of those wires.. The reasons were: like you I'd like the option of the larger carbon plenum and until then, I'd like to run the standard airbox and paper filter. I like the factory look under the bonnet and the paper filters are excellent if replaced regularly (not that K&N will tell you that!).

Looking at the number of jobs that really should be done with the engine out, I'd be better off using the 6 days I have off for Easter to do them. I was originally going to get the engine in the bay but it might actually slow me down thinking about it. If I'm going to fit the ARP bolts, move the servo, possibly move the ABS, pick and re-wire the loom through a 4 pot vcover and clean the engine bay; I'll need all of the time I can get!

Jai

[glenn]

all these S50 threads are making very interesting reading

[buster]

i think after market ecu for the 3.2 is mega expensive though.The maf can be fitted to the carbon airbox.
Also,i wanted to fit the standard filter but theres no room.I had to make do with the filter that came with the engine which is a large green cotton cone.

[Jhonno]

Right had another look at the oil cooler mounting.. Do you guys reckon it will be safe coming down to just above the bottom of the standard lip? (that makes sense yeah?) I'd mount it so that if it took a knock the mounts would flex n allow it to move rather than just get battered, and it is sitting about 3" above the lowest point (the sump)

[jmc330i]

Are they AN10 fittings on the cooler? Hopefully the same size as the Turner Motorsport oil cooler fittings.

Here it is.. Dim 97x330x51

I take it thats HxWxD - if so, I just did some quick measuring at 100x330x50.

Its not as wide as the M20 cooler, about 30mm taller and 10mm thicker, so I reckon it will fit nicely in the original cooler position, maybe using the M20 cooler mounts with a bit bracket work.

Working from those measurements, I dont think you will need to mount it any lower than the M20 cooler would be - level with the bottom of the metal valance. A bit of work to the plastic fin/grill section and you should get airlflow to the top no worries.

Only thing I cant really factor in is the leccy fan on the front of the rad, as I dont have one fitted yet. Will the pipes coming off the top of the cooler come into contact with the fan? Shouldnt be a problem as the pipes could be routed around the fan, or they might not even get close.

Wish Id gone for the Mocal cooler straight out now, rather than mess around getting the pipes to fit the M20 cooler

[Jhonno]

The issue im having is the leccy fan gets in the way of the connectors hence havin to mount it slightly lower.. have you got a pic of a standard e30 cooler n mount setup?

[jmc330i]

The issue im having is the leccy fan gets in the way of the connectors hence havin to mount it slightly lower

I thought the fan might be an issue. Could you not angle the cooler forward a bit?

have you got a pic of a standard e30 cooler n mount setup?

Only as fitted on my car, with the metal M20 pipes modded. Be back in a min.....