Pain in the arse newbie questions.

[robmarriott]

Hi all, I'm new to this, and looking to built a 335 after seeing Mr Unna's in PPC mag.

Couple of questions though...

1) which is the best model to start with? (4 or 6 cyl)
2) what is done about gearbox?
3) which car is best to get the M30 from?
4) are there any other engines I could use, or is the M30 the only way?
5) are the mounts and stuff the same?
6) what about wiring? easy to do?

Think that's it... sorry about the randomness.

I have searched, but I'm still a bit lost.

Thanks.

[gareth]

hi mate, and welcome!

in brief...

1) 325i 6 pot as it'll have the larger front struts, vented front brakes and rear disks. tourers all had rear disks though. 320i 6 pots had smaller struts. it depends on what you can find really as a good 325i will always be worth good money whereas a good 316i will be peanuts and you'll probabably want to upgrade the brakes etc anyway.
2) ideally, use a manual M30 box and M3 prop but a M10 (early 316i / 318i) box and M20 (320i, 325i) prop can be used. this is being discussed at the moment in this section of the forum
3) in my opinion, a E34 535i manual. a E32 735i will often be a lot cheaper (mine was £100) but most are autos and finding a manual box, flywheel and clutch will often outweigh the cost difference.
if you find a cheap 535i sport, you'll have a load of goodies to sell on to get some money back from the breaker.
4) not at all, the V12 goes in, as do the 24V engines. budget wise, the M50 / M52 is the closest rival to the M30
5) you need custom mounts. either make your own or buy some from karan (on here) or www.e30.de. about £100ish
6) easy peasy. the loom will essentially plug in and let the engine run! some small mods need to be made to get the econometer working and let the electric windows work etc.

you'll also want to be on the lookout for:
- an electric fan (the old one won't fit) but if your donor has aircon, it will have a fan that will work.
- M3 exhaust is the easiest one to use as it can easily be mated to the M30 downpipes
- M3 prop can be used or if you can't fine one, the larger flange from a M30 prop can be welded to a M20 prop.
- E28 535i radiator is the right capacity but a lot thinner than the E34 535i one to give more room

your best bet is to spend an evening or two looking though the engine swaps section and read up on all of the options. get a good idea on budgets before you start. spend some time colecting bits / donor car / project car then have a go! start a thread about your conversion and everyone on here will help you along the way with any problems and questions that arise.

where about are you based? most M30 nutters will be happy to show you around their cars and take you out for a spin. maybe pop along to a meet?

[robmarriott]

Thanks for the awesome amount of info there Gareth

I've tackled an engine swap before, but it was in a FWD hatch, from 1.4 to 1.6 using the same mounts and box, although I imagine it was pretty much as easy/hard as most swaps would be.

I have a budget of around 4k (or will have, when my car is sold) so I think a solid 325 is probably a bit overbudget, but I might be wrong.

It's good to know I can buy the mounts, that's easier for me than messing them up myself

I'm based near Northampton.

Thanks again.

[gareth]

4k will give you a lot of options. don't forget that most E30's will need a fair amount of upgrading to the brakes / suspension etc which will eat up a lot of the budget.

getting the best base car you can find will be a good first starting point.

[eko]

Awsome welcome you gave there Gareth,very proud of you

318is maybe a good base car to start of with?

[DRIFTBOY]

Welcome robmarriott!

I'd agree with all Gareth said!
E34 535i is the easiest donor to find with manual box and they are cheap!

There must be a 335i owner not too far away from you ? !

Good luck!

[robmarriott]

What are my other options for similar power (just to weigh up exactly what to do), would a Turbo M20B20 or M20B25 be as good/cheaper?

Or should I just settle for a solid 325is?

Basically what I want is a simple way to have more fun than I had before in my previous toy car.

[DRIFTBOY]

Depends what your previous car was! ?

325i is great fun as it is! Especially with lsd!

M50 (2.5 24valve) engine might be a good choice but I've not driven one. Less power than M30 but might be worth looking into.
From what I have read, turbo can give amazing results, but not cheap.

Later V8 (4.0 and 4.4 litre) engines can be fitted but that tends to get pricey, must make for an awsome E30 though!

[Toby_Unna]

if you're going to turbo you might as well start with the right engine

the 3.5 is a good choice because it's strong and fairly powerful. 230lb/ft of torque, and as a standard engine it'll take a lot of abuse without complaint.

as far as finding an e30 goes, just get one in good nick. the brakes etc just bolt on and there are plenty of 325s being broken to get the parts from. my car cost £80 with full mot and while it might be an interesting colour i'm very happy not to have spent the last two years patching rust holes up

we need to all have a big m30 meet at some point

[robmarriott]

Previous car was a fettled 1.6 Corsa, stripped, decent suspension/brakes, 130+bhp and under 850kg. Was a good car, well set up, went really well until the water came out of the engine and the head banana'd lol. The main problem with it was it being Wrong Wheel Drive.

From what I've been reading tonight, the M30 seems like the obvious choice then, for cheap power?

I'll have a look on ebay and see what I can find, work out what sort of money I'll need for the base car etc.

[robmarriott]

I like the colour of yours Toby

I was just wanting to make sure that it was as easy to get a 3.5 into a 4 cylinder car as a 6 cyl one, from an engine bay perspective, not too bothered about suspension/brakes, I can sort that easy enough.

I'll just look for the best 2 door I can find then

[Toby_Unna]

that's what I did. it just happened to be beige

bay is the same on all cars. there's something about the PAS rack pipes being shorter on 4 cyl cars or something, hardly a nightmare...

[robmarriott]

Good good, that's what I like to hear.

Thanks

[Andy335Touring]

Theres a chap down you way doing the swap at the mo, brains gone, carn't remember who it is

If your ever up this way(Long Eaton, Notts) your welcome pop over for a natter and a ride in my 335, it might help to get your head around things seeing it in the flesh as it were ?

[gareth]

Awsome welcome you gave there Gareth,very proud of you

why thank you very much good sir! i was feeling very chatty that evening!

toby, i think that colour suits you, metallic beige needs cleaning less than any other colour!!!! it doesn't look dirty, it just gets less shiny! white cars find black dirt, black cars find white dirt, beige cars find beige dirt!!!

[robmarriott]

Right, been having a think, and I reckon an M50B25 would be a better option for me, if there are no Nikasil issues (forgive my lack of knowledge, I'm not sure if the engine had Nikasil liners or not).

What needs doing to get an M50 in? what mounts and do I use the same box as I would with an M30?

[Andy335Touring]

Right, been having a think, and I reckon an M50B25 would be a better option for me

You might as well go for the 2.8 as with a few tweaks it will be on par with an M30 performance wise but will have slightly better MPG ?

2.8s cost more to buy than an M30 or M50 but not daft money.

[gareth]

i suppose a M50 2.8 would have a good return breaking a donor car if it's a E36 328i. lots of ebay-able goodies to be flogged on!

from my experience of M50's (E34 525i sport, non vanos) they're a more 'sporty' feeling engine. a lot revvier than a M30 and you need to rev them to get the full potential. in a way, i do miss having to thrash the tits off an engine when pushing it as the M30 only ever really needs 4500 rpm! the brutal feel of the torque makes up for it though i suppose.

i guess i would advise anyone who is looking to do a conversion (especially the more common M30 and M50) to blag a passenger ride in both as the feel of an engine is a real personal preference imho.

[robmarriott]

I do like revvy engines, so it's a bit of a no-brainer when it's put like that.

Does the 2.8 have Nikasil liners? (or the 2.5 for that matter)

[BadDave]

You might as well go for the 2.8 as with a few tweaks it will be on par with an M30 performance wise but will have slightly better MPG ?

2.8s cost more to buy than an M30 or M50 but not daft money.

If going for the 2.8 then get the inlet manifold from the 2.5(give more power) cos the std 2.8 manifold is quite restrictive.