Imaginative GENESIS placement...

[Royalratch]

About to install som enew JBL components, small amp and all new ISO head unit wiring.

When messing with my dash the other day, I noticed there is a big chunk of space above the gearbox clutch area / under the heater controls. You'll see it when pulling the centre console away from the dash.

Wouldn't this be a great place for an amp? It's near the head unit and battery and front speakers. You'd only have to run speaker whire to the rears instead of RCA and power etc plus you keep you're boot and parcel shelf clear and nobody can see the amp.

Do you have to bolt amps down or can they just 'sit' on the carpet there?

Could this work?

[cliffybabe]

u could velcro the amp, i have done this with many cd changers etc.

I think the location could cuase over heating as the heater duc etc is under there, also should u need to adjust the amp its gonna be a git to get to.

Also im not sure if u will get interfearance aswell witht he amp being so close tot he head unit

Like ur thinking though

[Royalratch]

Velcro! That's the answer!

I think it would be far enough from the H/U to be okay - any kind of shielding an option?

Amps are better when they run warm no? I'm going to shoot it and post it up.

Dealing with mini amps as it's not cavernous down there so maybe only squeeze a 2 channel.

[d6dph]

Amps are very heat sensitive, You should always give them enough room to breath so te internals do not fry.

[Royalratch]

I think there's almost a foot of clearance above it for air to circulate so it should be okay.

[cliffybabe]

u could mount a cooling fan like a pc one, or get a amp with a built in cooling fan, Remember if it gets to hot it will go into protection ode or worse burn out

[d6dph]

But what I'm getting at is that there is not flow of air, Once that air gets warm (and it is in a bad place for heat ingress - gearbox, engine & heater matrix in close proximity) I can see problems.

Maybe a small 12v cpu style fan on either side of the console to flow the air, on to pull air in, the other to expel it.

[Royalratch]

I see.

But is there air flow in a boot? It's bigger I guess.

There are quite big exit gaps wiether side into the footwells...

I just can't stand ICE on show but want better sound. Where else?

Boot and spare wheel are out of the question. Glovebox - in use. Boot tray - maybe.

[cliffybabe]

Maybe a small 12v cpu style fan on either side of the console to flow the air, on to pull air in, the other to expel it.

thats what i was thinking

[cliffybabe]

I see.

But is there air flow in a boot? It's bigger I guess.

There are quite big exit gaps wiether side into the footwells...

I just can't stand ICE on show but want better sound. Where else?

Boot and spare wheel are out of the question. Glovebox - in use. Boot tray - maybe.

i know its all about stealth, Im my case now its all about showing it off

If i was u boot it in the boot and screw the amp on the rear of the seats

[dazleeds]

due to the drain thingys each side of the boot
the ones that exit behind the bumpers
yes there is airflow to a point

[d6dph]

No there is not air flowing in the boot, but the quantity of air is huge compared to the location you suggested.

Personally, I would make a second skin behind the seatbacks, Have the amp mounted to the seat then have the second skin covering up from prying eyes. Again the use of small fans can help to keep the temp down, but it should be a lot cooler in the boot away from the transmission tunnel.

Neil: I saw your post after I posted the same idea, Sorry mate

[cliffybabe]

Neil: I saw your post after I posted the same idea, Sorry mate

dude great minds think alike

[Royalratch]

I'm sticking to me guns. Fans could help plus I don't always have the thing on.

Do digital amps get hot? How do I know if it has 'protection'?

[d6dph]

dude great minds think alike

c....cc.......ch...chrome

Royalratch, What amp are you looking to use, Maybe then we will get a better idea of what the sizes ect are.

[cliffybabe]

I'm sticking to me guns. Fans could help plus I don't always have the thing on.

Do digital amps get hot? How do I know if it has 'protection'?

fare play mate, Na digital amps are the same still will get hot,

PC fan one either side of the footwell one as a intake and one as a exit fan wait till then little puppies start huming away

[miniblob]

Right then, if you put an amp behind the centre console, velcro would be the best way to stick it.

Heat wise, you will definately want a pair of fans. As above, i would say one each on each side of the centre console. Yes, amps want to be warm, as opposed to being cold, but they deffo do not want to get too hot!!

Make sure the amp you use is designed for use in that position (i.e. with cooling fins or built in fans designed to be at their optimum position when the amp is layed flat). A built in fan may or may not help, depends on the design/spec of the amp so don't just go out looking for one with a built in fan!! Best thing would be to ask some experienced car audio shops/fitters what amps run coolest - they should know approx operating temps of some amps. Some amps just run hotter than others!! (Depends on design/class/circuitry/etc)
I would think you will more than likely be better off with a more powerfull amp running at much lower gain.
Think about which way round you mount the amp - do you want the air blowing across or along the cooling fins?

As people have pointed out, there is not much airflow in there, but i don't see why a carefully chosen and installed amp, would not be perfectly happy in there. A lot of amps i have had running just front components, would still feel almost cold to the touch after running at high volume for an hour!!
Also, do you do many long trips with the music constantly on max or up very loud?? If you only listen at sensible volumes and for reasonable periods of time, the amp will not give off as much heat.
I assume you don't have the music at too high a volume level, 'cos i think you'd struggle to find an amp with a serious power rating, that will fit in that gap!!

Also, bear in mind, mounting equipment there is going to be a real pain in the ass if you need to adjust anything, or check/replace fuses!!

Bonuses, in theory would mostly be the very short cable runs, but unless your using very high end equipment, there won't be any noticeable gains there! Obviously stealth, less cables required and not taking up any (otherwise useable) space are little bonuses too!!

At the end of the day, only way to be 100% sure about it, is to try it!!!! I've mounted line drivers and eq's there, but never thought about putting an amp there!!

Overall, i reckon if you go for a carefully chosen, decent amp (not just the cheapest little one you can find!) it should be ok, unless you listen loud for hours on end!!

Let us know how it goes!!

[Royalratch]

Only looking to drive front copmpenets and never at high volume. I was a small 2 channel like this:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/JBL-CS60-2-Mint-C ... dZViewItem

I'm not too bothered with price, I could go upto £200 for a 2 channel but it needs to be small and not run too hot and I have no idea what would work.

[cliffybabe]

JBL is alirght, Looking at the amp it would be alright to run fans along looking at the fins and for 25quid off ebay if u melt it, its not gonnabe th ened of the world

[miniblob]

JBL are (generally) a good brand, but that looks to me like it might be a bit big to fit!!!

Maybe a little kenny like this: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kenwood-KAC-528-3 ... dZViewItem

Can't find the amp i was looking for - i'm sure genesis (ST60) or phoenix gold do a really small 2 channel amp!! Again, the power rating (output) is not worth worrying about - a good genesis 35W RMS per channel will sound better than a lot of amps that quote 100W per channel!!

(The daddy, if it'll fit!!) genesis ST60 http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/produc ... /4377.html
Pioneer GM-3000T http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/produc ... /2640.html
Alpine MRP-T222 http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/produc ... /5625.html

[miniblob]

Think you need to measure up first and just find out what'll fit!!!!

Would be worth asking at some car audio dealers/fitters, after you've had a measure up!!

[Royalratch]

Awesome.

Cheers guys.

Any other hi-quality brands that are small - throw this way!

[Royalratch]

Maybe a little kenny like this: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kenwood-KAC-528-3 ... dZViewItem

This look awesome. I'll bid anyway.

Is a small amp always better than head unit power?

[miniblob]

I would say yes.

Possibly some exceptions - and obviously depends on the amp, but generally yes!!

Again, in an ideal world, you'd listen to the amp before you buy, 'cos all amps have different characteristics and sound different.

Personally, i would spend out (or keep checking ebay) and get the genesis amp!!

[Royalratch]

Personally, i would spend out (or keep checking ebay) and get the genesis amp!!

What one am I looking for - got a model name or link?

[miniblob]

(The daddy, if it'll fit!!) genesis ST60 http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/produc ... /4377.html

Not cheap, but very good!!!!

Again, you better measure the space first - might not even be an option!!

[Royalratch]

That looks tasty!

What's the difference between RMS and the other one?
Also, what's the deal with OHMs into this that and the other?

I think my speakers are rated at 90w.

[miniblob]

RMS is what you want to go by, ignore the others - stands for Real Music Somethingorother!!!! Other quoted figures will normally be MAX, which is what you might hit for a second or two if you're being silly and caining it!!!!

Having said that, a lot of companies like genesis, pg, dls, are very conservative with their power figures. Hence a 35W RMS amp from a proper manufacturer can often sound better/louder than others that are higher rated.

Also, don't be fooled into thinking the number of Watts means how loud it will go - there's more to it than that!! It can be a good indication, but i would say that a proper 35W amp would be plenty good enough for most people!


The ohms are the resistance of the speaker you can/will connect.
Haven't looked your's up, but i would assume most front components would be rated at 4ohms.
Less resistance against the amp (from the speaker) can equal more power, but that also depends on the amp. If you put too low an impedance on the amp, it will overheat/be damaged.
Some people run subs at 2ohms to get more power from the amp, and you can wire speakers in different ways so the amp see's a different resistance - but you shouldn't need to worry about that in your case!!

[cliffybabe]

RMS is what you want to go by, ignore the others - stands for Real Music Somethingorother!!!!

RMS (Root Mean Squared) is a measure of the amp's ability to supply clean power over a continuous period.

[d6dph]

How the hell do you, of all people, Know that Neil?!

Is google your friend?

[miniblob]

Aahhh yet, that's it!!!! Real Music Source is the kids version for when you can't remember it

Neil likes his sounds!!!

[cliffybabe]

How the hell do you, of all people, Know that Neil?!

Is google your friend?

na mate as rob said im well into my sounds, The bm is getting a overhaul in the next few weeks aswel (just need to find a graphic)

Im also fitting aza's within the next month

[placey]

if it's a two door - amps will mount behind the rear quarter panel trims. plenty of space and good air flow and ideal for cabling....

if it's a four door than a custom plate made up to sit under the front seats will take amps - not so ideal for two door cars as the seats move back and forwards a bit more as rear passengers get in and out.

a couple more ideas for you anyways.

paul

[BadDave]

na mate as rob said im well into my sounds, The bm is getting a overhaul in the next few weeks aswel (just need to find a graphic)

I take it ,you mean an equaliser.
If thats the case ,I've got 2 nice Audiocontrol ones(EQl and EQX)
also 2 Lanzar Encore's if there any use to you.

[Royalratch]

if it's a two door - amps will mount behind the rear quarter panel trims. plenty of space and good air flow and ideal for cabling....

if it's a four door than a custom plate made up to sit under the front seats will take amps - not so ideal for two door cars as the seats move back and forwards a bit more as rear passengers get in and out.

a couple more ideas for you anyways.

paul

Now this is the kind of shit I'm talking about!

Would heat build-up be an issue there also?

Would mean long cabling again...