Chipping 1986 325i - can early motronic be chipped

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grimbleweed
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Post Thu Nov 09, 2006 5:27 pm

I have early 1986 325i - can this motronic unit be chipped - all adverts say 1988 onwards?
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pnd
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Post Thu Nov 09, 2006 5:32 pm

yes see zone shop these early cars benefit more from chipping than the facelift models.
ed325i
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Post Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:47 pm

yes they can I had a chipped 073 ecu.
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grimbleweed
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Post Thu Nov 09, 2006 10:03 pm

Looked in Zone shop - all chips say >88 which I take to mean later than 1988 - mine is 1986.
HELP

Also is it difficult to install chips.
GDBN
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Post Thu Nov 09, 2006 10:07 pm

If you can solder then you might be able to do it yourself as you'll be going from a 24 pin chip to 28.
You can remove your current ECU and send it in to be chipped or alternatively buy a used ECU and send that in.
Then you just swap them over when you get the new one.

G
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:31 am

pnd wrote:yes see zone shop these early cars benefit more from chipping than the facelift models.
No they don't! Plastic bumper cars were all catalyst prepped and run very lean fuel/air mixtures and they need help. Early cars were not and apart from giving the timing a boost at the top end of the rev range there isn't a lot you can do with them as the mixture is pretty much spot on. This is why the old metal bumper 325i's were so much livelier that the later ones. I've had 3 or 4 or each and the early cars have a lot more bite.
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grimbleweed
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:47 am

Basically not a lot to be gained then. Thanks for the comments :)
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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 5:27 pm

Hi, I have an early 320i with a bosch ecu which Im guessing cant be chipped. Is it just a straight swap with a later Motronic and which version/part number would be best for chipping? I also have an '85 M535, would this benifit from the m30 chip offered in the zone shop or are there different ECUs fitted across the E28 range also? Thanks
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 5:31 pm

IF YOU LOOK CLOSELY YOU WILL SEE IT SAYS THE FOLLOWING ON ZONE SHOP :? sorry caps

upto 88
E30Zone Wild Chip
E30 325i >1988


after 88
E30Zone Wild Chip
E30 325i 1988 >

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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 5:38 pm

I was led to believe Bosch units were un-chipable
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 5:48 pm

Motronic is Bosch!! Any car with it is chippable, while the earlier Bosch L-Jetronic ones can't, because it's an analogue system as opposed to the digital Motronic.
///M aurice
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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:38 pm

excuse me, i was led to believe that EARLY Bosch ecus were unchipable,you're contradicting yourself, are you not??
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:46 pm

Early L-Jetronic ones cannot: later Motronic ones can. I am not contradicting myself in any way :roll:
///M aurice
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zaust
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:49 pm

If it has an ecu then something can be done.!. Mild to wild..
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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:50 pm

Can an L-Jetronic be replaced directly with a later Motronic?
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 7:01 pm

nope, L jet cannot be swopped for Motronic as easily as that I'm afaraid
Jetronic can only be tweaked by using a piggyback, so as an upgrade retrofit the entire motronic from a later car and gain 3D mapped ignition @ the same time

lots of work though, MS anyone :lol:
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 7:07 pm

zaust wrote:If it has an ecu then something can be done.!. Mild to wild..
Zaust are you talking about the tip you gave me a few sundays back?
havent had the chance to try it yet.Or the balls tbh.
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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 7:39 pm

So aside from the actual ECU, what bits do i need from a breaker?
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 7:59 pm

Believe it's the injectors, wiring loom, throttle body, sensors. The distributor is also completely different - block mounted on L-jetronic, mounted on end of camshaft for Motronic.
///M aurice
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only_sideways
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Post Fri Nov 10, 2006 8:14 pm

Cheers, thanks for the help
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pnd
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 4:43 pm

interesting comments from andyboy I agree that the early cars are quicker but from my experience they respond to chips better also. Ant any comments?
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gooner1
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 4:56 pm

PND, are you saying that you have actually had an early car chipped,if you did was that a straight chip or did you have to swap injectors,tb, etc etc?.
Knew the chrome bumbers looked better,did,nt realise they were quicker too.
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 5:41 pm

i was thinking of doing the same but running the spark signal through my block mounted distributor instead of the cam driven idea so this will give me infinately adjustable timing as well as the benefit of motronic injection unless i'm missing something this should work well
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 6:25 pm

gooner1 wrote:
zaust wrote:If it has an ecu then something can be done.!. Mild to wild..
Zaust are you talking about the tip you gave me a few sundays back?
havent had the chance to try it yet.Or the balls tbh.
No you can still remap on top of that....

Balls ?????
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 6:30 pm

the early cars with the high comp engine and 073 ECU were built to perform, the post 88 were built to comply with new emissions regs, so cant really be compared.

the later cars benifit from more fuelling right thorught the rpm range, and work better as a result , with reduced consumption to boot.

the 073 has the fuel it needs as stock, but the timing is a little tame and the fuel curves do need a tweak to make the overall package gel together .

you can experiment on those with the fuel quality switch, but its @ your own risk !!
i was thinking of doing the same but running the spark signal through my block mounted distributor instead of the cam driven idea so this will give me infinately adjustable timing as well as the benefit of motronic injection unless i'm missing something this should work well
the std motronic dizzy is a "dumb" device, the advance/dwell are all handled by the ECU directly, based on load info from the TPS/AFM and RPM's , you could use the Jetronic dizzy in this fashion if you welded the internals to fix its mech advance, then swing the base timing to gain a degree or two, but that would be effective over the entire rpm range, so not advised TBH dude.

3D igniton is a major advance over the 2D mech dizzy setup, I can see where you're going on this but TBH, if thats what you want to try, slot the CPS bracket and move the base timing with that method.

HTH
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pnd
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Post Sat Nov 11, 2006 7:20 pm

All im saying is this ive chipped two 87 chrome bumper cars which benefitted more than the facelift car i have now which didnt show great gains with a chip. zone wild chip used in all cases. All the cars in question were in very good shape mechanically.
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 5:04 pm

Ant wrote: you could use the Jetronic dizzy in this fashion if you welded the internals to fix its mech advance, then swing the base timing to gain a degree or two, but that would be effective over the entire rpm range, so not advised TBH dude.
Or just bolt the Motronic rotor arm adaptor onto your existing cam and add a Motronic top cambelt cover and distributor cap - piece of piss. Then throw that hateful distibutor in the bin. They were shite 20 years ago - bobweights, vacuum advance/retard etc is all Hillman Minx technology. Bin it.

Use a complete loom and ECU from a plastic bumper E30 as the old type from the metal bumper cars with the two flywheel sensors is a pain in the arse - too much to go wrong. I think using the LE Jet injectors will fry a Motronic ECU - right Ant??
There are two threaded holes in the M20 block to take the alloy mount for the front TDC sensor. As long as your car has the later C101 connector (mid 85 onwards) it shouldn't be a bad job to do.
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surj
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:36 pm

i had a 323i bored n stroked to 2.7l but running on jetronic setup ive since replaced complete loom and everthing else to motronic seems to run betta
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:41 pm

I think using the LE Jet injectors will fry a Motronic ECU - right Ant??
Damn right andy, waaaaay too much current for the driver FETs to handle.
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:51 pm

is the crank sensor on the front of mine any use looks like its only used for diagnostics and is not very well mounted to be honest
the main reason i want to keep the dizzy is for originality really so when i pop the bonnet no one knows its a 2,7 with motronic management 8)
mines an 84 model so whats my options if i dont have the right connector
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surj
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:03 pm

ive got a 323i bored an s to 2.7 swopped from old running gear to motronic changed the lot i think its a better setup whats anybody else think
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:32 pm

did you use your original rods surj
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:35 pm

320/323/Eta rods are all the same part number dudes.

re the '84, total rewire and new cluster required there dude, MS instead :wink: sod originality :D
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 8:03 pm

i didn't think it would be that easy,why the need for a new cluster?
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Post Sun Nov 12, 2006 8:10 pm

Kev, my C1 2.3 ran a 2.7 using a 325i head/pistons but still with the original LE Jetronic inlet manifold, small bore throttle body and LE Jet+ distributor. It ran and drive well (superb torque) but wouldn't really rev much over 5000.
It IS possible to keep LE Jet. But the standard injectors probably won't flow enough fuel at the top end and the timing won't be right. Your best bet is to send the distributor to Aldon Enginedering (Google it) to have the advance curve modded and you could run E28 525i/528i injectors. There's nothing actually wrong with LE Jet - it's just old fashioned. You can't remap the ECU so you'd set to set it up on the dyno with an adjustable fuel pressure regulator - plus a play with the timing.