Fritzs Bits vs Cheapo vs BTB

General E30 related discussions -
Please put technical questions in E30 Tech Help forum below

Moderator: martauto

M5pilot
E30 Zone Addict
E30 Zone Addict
Posts: 4968
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Luton

Post Sat Sep 16, 2006 12:00 am

The BTB 1 does not have equal length headers, the bore size is smaller but it is still a manifold that is very free flowing. It has the X pipe aswell.

The BTB 2 has massive long equal length headers, a larger bore, an X pipe - it just works better especially on a 2.7. It was designed from scratch at the end of 2005. Lots of development work was done.

Alot of people often don;t understand manifolds( i dont claim to know too much about the dark art itself). From the few experiences I had there are few basic things like no sharp angles, collectors that are smooth inside and do not obstruct flow, primary header entry into the collectors is important etc etc.

The FB (also known as the larini manifold) is just really designed to fit and this is something the guys at larini admitted to me over the phone. They do NOT claim 20bhp unlike fritz who are the resellers. Larini did say that the BTB2 manifold is an absolute work of art and they could easily believe the gains in power it made.

Ԛ£500 for some pipes that do sweet fuck all......money well spent :cry:
User avatar
--alpina--
E30 Zone Regular
E30 Zone Regular
Posts: 787
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 11:00 pm
Location: somewhere in timbuktu

Post Sat Sep 16, 2006 12:33 pm

Hi, what does the BTB2 manifols looks like and what does BTB stands for, sorry for being abscent minded.


Cheers


Jimi
Andyboy
Alpina Colada
Posts: 12577
Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:00 pm
Location: Notts

Post Sat Sep 16, 2006 12:51 pm

I've not seen a Fritz manifold on a dyno - but to be fair they did add a bit of power (5-10 bhp for both) to the old M30 and they do sound good - but the M30 cast iron manifold is a truly disgusting thing and makes the M20 cast manifold look like a really good idea. It would be hard NOT to improve on the M30 tbh. I was led to believe that the FB manifolds and systems were their own work.

Oh well.........

Time for another dyno day at Bexleys Sal?
Ant
Retired Team Member
Retired Team Member
Posts: 10496
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:00 pm
Location: PD+E dept :D

Post Sat Sep 16, 2006 1:17 pm

Time for another dyno day at Bexleys Sal?

Hell yeah !

puts the pub talk to rest ..... theres one in October @ Surrey Rolling road centre
Product Development and Endurance for Delphi.

Original performance chips, original works not unlicensed copies :D Email FTW
M5pilot
E30 Zone Addict
E30 Zone Addict
Posts: 4968
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Luton

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:28 pm

We can do a test if you like, one's already been done at Jay's place yesterday which showed the BTB equipped cars to be giving much more power than anything else.

Another test was done just after development stages of the BTB and that showed some over 15BHP just be adding the manifold.

The M30 FB manifold is quite a horrid thing having seen it. To just get 5bhp from a manifold on a big 200+ bhp engine is pants.

As for all of the BTB questions - I am preparing a small write up for everyone to have a look at soon.

Sal
Andy335Touring
Married to the E30 Zone
Married to the E30 Zone
Posts: 7144
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Long Eaton,Nottingham

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:44 pm

Andyboy wrote:I've not seen a Fritz manifold on a dyno - but to be fair they did add a bit of power (5-10 bhp for both) to the old M30 and they do sound good - but the M30 cast iron manifold is a truly disgusting thing and makes the M20 cast manifold look like a really good idea. It would be hard NOT to improve on the M30 tbh. I was led to believe that the FB manifolds and systems were their own work.
Are you talking about the log style E28 M30 manifold rather than the two peice E34 manifolds ?

Like this ?

Image
Simon13
The longest resto in the world !
Posts: 22697
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Camberley, Surrey don't u know

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 8:20 pm

Andy that is a work of art 8O
Andy335Touring
Married to the E30 Zone
Married to the E30 Zone
Posts: 7144
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Long Eaton,Nottingham

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 8:43 pm

Not nice is it ?

E34/2 M30's are a two peice manifold like the M20's.
Simon13
The longest resto in the world !
Posts: 22697
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Camberley, Surrey don't u know

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 9:12 pm

no, is there queue from number 1 and 2 to get the gasses out!
M5pilot
E30 Zone Addict
E30 Zone Addict
Posts: 4968
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Luton

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:09 pm

Now that is one shite manifold!

I bet there is a bloody que.

Any 6 branch, even the poorly designed FB will be better.

BTB do a manifold for the M30, it's just as impressive as the M20 BTB2.

Sal
Andy335Touring
Married to the E30 Zone
Married to the E30 Zone
Posts: 7144
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Long Eaton,Nottingham

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:46 pm

M5pilot wrote:
BTB do a manifold for the M30, it's just as impressive as the M20 BTB2.

Sal
But does it fit around the E30 steering coupling ?
M5pilot
E30 Zone Addict
E30 Zone Addict
Posts: 4968
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Luton

Post Sun Sep 17, 2006 11:11 pm

Certainly does!

I can sort out a price if your interested.

I saw one on A1 BMW spares car with the same engine fitted in an E30. Looks very very nice indeed with all equal length headers.

Sal
Andy335Touring
Married to the E30 Zone
Married to the E30 Zone
Posts: 7144
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
Location: Long Eaton,Nottingham

Post Mon Sep 18, 2006 12:06 am

It's probobly out of my price range at the mo dude