Touring Rear Speakers

[Davenotouring]

I went to Discount Autoparts in Cambridge today, who have a decent ICE area.

I said to the guy 'I'm after some replacement speaker for my E30 Touring'

He said ok, you're best of with components up front, which is fair enough.

At the back he said, if you take out the black L-shaped speaker enclosure (which wasn't in my car when I first bought it, I fitted it from my breaker) and fit these 6x9 holding brackets, you can put them straight in. They are for an e30 saloon, but will screw straight on underneath where the enclosure was. I said 'You are sure this will work in my Touring? It is the estate' He said yes. I was reluctant, because when I've looked behind there before, I couldn't remember ANYTHING this would screw to, it's just the wheelarch beind there! Anyway, I took his 'expert' advice having been suprised he knew about e30 Tourings well enough to know about the speaker box and bought the brackets and some nice Infinity 6x9's.

Get home, dismantle car. Nothing for the brackets to screw to, at all. Or am I missing something? I will go there tomorrow and ask him what the fcuk he is on about with the car still in bits.

Also, if I have to return the 6x9's, what speaker options should I go for?

[johnono]

dave, its rare to find enthusiasts that work retail, as most probably find work that rewards such know how.

[Davenotouring]

This is true.

Sorted now thanks! Got money back!

Cheeky sod said 'You didn't say it was an estate'. I told him it was a Touring, and when he started saying 'This will screw straight on....' I said, you DO KNOW it's an Touring, which means estate! He said yeah.....

[placey]

before offering any suggestions on what you could put in the back - 1) what's the rest of the system setup 2) what are you looking for the system to achieve 3) how much boot space are you willing to use 4) what's your budget and 5) will you be doing the work yourself?

i suspect that if you answer all these honestly you'll know yourself what you want back there.

listen to any prospective purchases first - if it sounds good to you it is good, end of discussion. it doesn't matter about the price, specs or what the salesperson thinks.

paul

[placey]

you must have been typing at the same time as me!

[Cotty]

I have spoken to an car audio place about rear speakers in my touring. The answer was dont. There are pods that the speakers sit in under the grills. The problem is that A you probably dont have the pods if the speakers were not fitted originally, as per my car and B even if you have the pods the size of speaker you can fit would be so small as to not be worth the effort.

I have a couple of 6X9 kenwood three ways and an amp that I would love to put in the rear of my car but there is just not the room under the grills

[Davenotouring]

Hi there,

I didn't have these enclosures originally, but I did have rear speakers.

I put the enclosures in from my breaker touring.

I went back to the shop today, and got my money back. They had a decent offer on Infinity replacements, which I have bought. They have improved the sound quite a bit, but I intend to use these only for a while until I am earning money to have a 'proper' setup.

1) I have a reasonably high spec JVC (not great!?) and these speakers which I mentioned above.

2) I want decent sound with a bit of bass to back it up.

3) I don't mind using about half the boot space, but I'd like it to be removeable if poss.

4) Budget......hmmm. Not loads as I'd rather spend it on the engine. I'm putting a 2.5 in soon, but I may spend a little on spicing it up. I'd guess about 500? Depending on what I could get for a bit more?

5) I would like to do most of the work myself depends what there is to do?

Thanks, Dave.

[gareth]

i've been thinking of a rear component setup on mine. using tweeters inder the grilles with the woofers on the acces hatch door thingies. the problem is gonna be rattling like mad when you turn it up!

smallish speaker box with amp on a multipole connector so it can be pulled out of the boot when you're load lugging?

not really a neat answer... that i know of anyway!

[Andy335Touring]

I wouldn't worry about rear speakers if you can get a decent sized/quality speakers up front with a sub in the boot.

My set up is plenty loud enough with good quality sound.

Denon CD head unit
4 chanel amp
12" Rockford sub in a sealed box
165mm DLS coaxle(sp?) mounted in some door builds(thanks to Paul = Placey)

I'm well impressed with the sound of the DLS speakers and i would recomend them to any one whos going to get some new speakers.

[Davenotouring]

I wouldn't put speakers in the actual door hatch, why not the area infront of that?

Probably a good location for 6x9's?

I await advise from ICE god placey!

[Demlotcrew]

I wouldn't worry about rear speakers if you can get a decent sized/quality speakers up front with a sub in the boot.

My set up is plenty loud enough with good quality sound.

Denon CD head unit
4 chanel amp
12" Rockford sub in a sealed box
165mm DLS coaxle(sp?) mounted in some door builds(thanks to Paul = Placey)

I'm well impressed with the sound of the DLS speakers and i would recomend them to any one whos going to get some new speakers.

Must be producing good sound there mate.

Dave BMW did a Premium sound system for the Touring as well as the Saloons, which includes components on the front/rear and amp.

This is what you need to look out for.

Andrew

[Davenotouring]

Ahhh I see.

The rear enclosures have a space for a tweeter, which is marked but not cut out.

I will keep an eye out, very rare no doubt.

[BadDave]

[quote]The problem is that A you probably dont have the pods if the speakers were not fitted originally, as per my car and B even if you have the pods the size of speaker you can fit would be so small as to not be worth the effort.
MB Quart comps DO fit in the std enclosures(4"mid &3/4" tweeter).
I agree with Andy.A good setup in the front works wonders,2way comps are good,3 way comps are better.DONT put any in the rear access panels(It'll just rattle)

System so far
Alpine Mobile Media Centre
Alpine 6 cd changer
Alpine Dolby/DTS proccessor with time correction
Audiocontrol EQ's times 2(1 for front/1 for rear)
Kenwood 6 ch Active x-over
Brax supercap & voltmeter
Caliber basscube
Pr 12's in sealed enclosure
3 way comps up front/2 way comps in the rear
Amps by Rockford/Genesis/Kenwood

Need to fit a centre channel

[placey]

hmmm - thanks for the compliment but i'm no god - just a veteran of 1 or 2 installs that's all.

Andy335Touring is spot on when he says that you don't have to worry too much about rear speakers if you can get good quality up front. this depends however on how much you care about what any rear seat passengers hear! any rears are there mainly for 'rear fill' - the idea is that the fronts give detail, soundstage and volume, the rear gives you bass. so you really need the fronts to cover sounds from high frequencies down to mid-bass.

so let's consider the fronts for a mo - to get that mid-bass (very important) it has to be 6 1/2 inch components - decent quality here starts at about Ԛ£100 retail. also you need to get them as close as possible to on-axis so that both front passengers hear the sound as if they are in the middle of the speakers - this really means door builds as by the time you put 6 1/2inch drivers on axis in the factory kick panel locations they stick out too far.

that then puts the rears into perspective. if they are there for fill they don't have to be 1) as full range or 2) as loud as the fronts. therefore 5 1/4 inch drivers will do their job (as a part of the whole) quite adequately.

any location can be made to work so long as it's sufficiently prepared - i have heard some excellent and truly loud drivers in hatch panels. 4 things need considering - giving the drivers as much air to work with as possible behind them; a solid mounting base - mdf time; return waves i.e. make sure the driver is sealed from front to back and deadening everything around and near them - dynamat time. if installed with all these in mind even average speakers sound really really good.

so now for the bass - the jl10w3v2 is a stonkingly good sub for the money right now - Ԛ£180 retail before haggling(?) and luckily for you it works in an amazingly small enclosure - so as gareth suggests a multi-pin type connector could see it unplugged and removed with ease should you go for it attached to your seat backs. with a bit more work however (and some pretty serious maths or playing with foam or the like) i am sure you could mould a more permanent mounting into the side of the boot behind the wheel arch. (forgive my unfamiliarity with the exact design of tourers.) it simply invloves some resin paste contouring.

this leaves you with the best part of Ԛ£150 for an amp. a little haggling will see you walk away with a decent 4 channel amp for sure. some of the 4-channel jobs on ebay go for much less...

have you invested Ԛ£20 in the haynes ice manual? it's not exhaustive but it's still plenty packed with information.

paul

[Davenotouring]

That you for that.

Interesting reading.

I may well buy the Haynes 'ICE' manual for some extra info!

Door builds seem to be the way forward then.

SO 6.5 inch speakers in door builds, and one sub? Do you think this will be enough for decent sound?

[placey]

for sure. it'll never break any spl records (or windows for that matter) but it will sound very good indeed if it's all installed with care.

for a single sub it's probably well worth going for a 12, it's only a little more money and touch more size but it will kick just that little bit harder. i tried hard to fit in with your budget though...

personally i love two 10's in a sealed box. i think you have to go a long way to beat that - but the box will start to weigh a bit when it comes to lifting it in and out as well as other practicallity drawbacks..... and any box has to be bolted to the car for you don't want it loose inside the cabin or even really the boot during spirited driving or heaven fobid an accident.

paul

[Davenotouring]

I'm not going for SPL records, but I appreciate your point. Just a good all round system with decent quality and even power at all frequncies!

Where can door builds be sourced? Or is it better to build them yourself?

[BadDave]

Where can door builds be sourced? Or is it better to build them yourself?

Audioscape do them for about Ԛ£150
Aidiosport do them on Ebay for about Ԛ£70-Ԛ£75
Both of these accept a 6 1/2" midbass driver
They will do away with the door pockets tho

[Davenotouring]

Not too bothered about loosing door pockets, it's only cd cases in there.

Hope they do 4 door ones as well as 2 door ones.

[Cotty]

Door builds seem to be the way forward then.

Just spotted these door builds while surfing E-bay, dont know if they are any good for you.

No connection with seller


http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 36827&rd=1

[Davenotouring]

Excellent.

I'll keep an eye on those.

Cheers!

[placey]

there are several considerations when fitting door builds (oh what a surprise!)

the e30 cables into the door design i.e. the rubber boot will not accept a great deal more than what was put in there from the factory (particularly the drivers side) without fouling the furflex door seal and letting in water. therefore any crossovers need to be placed in the door or thin speaker cables used (which is a comprimise)

glovebox opening width is comprimised on the passengers side unless the design takes this into account. probably ok with the audiosports.

if you have the sports seats the front adjustment lever only just clears the original door pockets - it looks like it will foul the audiosport pockets - thus anyone shorter than about 5'4" will be unable to fully depress the clutch with the seat as far foward as it will go. short missus anyone?

just about any mid on the market is designed to work with some air behind it - thus needing to use the air in the door. this requires cutting the rear of the build and the door card and preparing the door itself. firstly remove the whether strip and clean everything thoroughly, inside too. then dynamat the outer door skin. then waxoyl everything thoroughly. then seal every hole with templated plastic sheet and clear silicone. then dynamat the inner door skin. then cut the dynamat to match the build hole. then glassfibre a protective whether strip to the rear of the door card to prevent water coming into the back of the build. it can be done but it is quite a bit of work and time consuming to get right.

finally the build needs securing to the door - one screw should do it but don't forget to rustproof it.

if it's desired to put the car back to original at any time it's worth sourcing some replacement door cards.

it's also worth making sure all your inside door componentry is extremely healthy while in there - so as you don't have to peel all your careful dynamatting away next month to fix a central locking problem.

paul