New M54 engine swap forum.

[Steve]

Working on M54 project? or you would like to share some M54 info, do it in this forum.

Thanks to flybynite for his suggestion to add this new forum.

[flybynite]

Well I asked Steve to add this and about 20 seconds later it was there. That's service !!

As E46 are becoming cheaper and more plentiful, It makes the M54B30 a good engine to swap. It is lighter than a B30 S50/54 and maybe even than a B20. It produces as much power as all but the last of the M3s loads of low end torque and it has the sound of a 6.

My aim would be to get it running in an e30 as designed with dual VANOS and DISA all intact with as much of a factory look as possible. I would like to get the ball rolling with a few thoughts for people to pick through when I get them together.

[clarko74]

Nice.

I'm about to start my M54 swap so this should be useful.

Cheers Steve.

[clarko74]

It produces as much power as all but the last of the M3s

This may be true in relation to US S52s but the european ones were a fair bit more powerful.

Should still be a good swap though.

[flybynite]

It produces as much power as all but the last of the M3s

This may be true in relation to US S52s but the european ones were a fair bit more powerful.
Should still be a good swap though.

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear I was talking about the E30 M3s I think it was only the 2.5 Evo 3 (238bhp) that was higher than the UK 330 (228bhp)

Having driven an E36 evo for 10 years I would not want an S50B32 in the front of an E30. It was fast no doubt but I never felt it handled as well as the 328i Sport I had before. The E46 M3 I had after didn't feel much better either.

These things are quite personal but is the combination of weight, handling, power, torque and sound that makes the M54B30 tick all the boxes for me.

[clarko74]

Ah ok, I see what you mean now.

At a recent track day I did a friend of mine took me out as a passenger in his track prepped E36 M3 Evo, that was quite an experience.

[Steve]

I posted this on FB as well to see if we can get the forum populated a bit quicker.

[martauto]

I have had two e46 330`s and they were awesome engines but in an e30 ? you must be mad !!
I like it

Mart.

[Samoughton]

Just about to set off on on my m54b30 swap.

got a 320 auto and an e39 530i manual that I will be trying to swap most of it into the e30.

wise me luck as can't find all that much info on it but I'm sure ill work it out.

ill update some bits on here when I get there.

Sam

[punkawalop]

https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/forum/ ... e?t=383897

[flybynite]

That thread is useful, there is the full thread on the car which goes into a bit more detail on some things
https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/forum/ ... n?t=366843
Just be aware there are differences if you are doing it on a Right Hand Drive

If you are considering an M54 there are quite a few people making specific bits to make life easy.

The crossmember made by these guys is built for the E46 rack and lets you use the standard E46 sump and pickup.

It is not cheap but take away the fact you don't then have to go hunting for an old E34 sump and pickup at inflated used prices. it keeps the sump away from the speed bumps which is why it is so hard to find a good E34 one in the first place. The 4-stud one will fit the M54 sump the 5-stud one will not.

DanThe on here does a few bits like looms and exhaust and pipes that will save some time.

I'm just on a parts hunt at the moment, trying to work out in my head the best way to tackle it before I start.

[clarko74]

Not cheap? You're right there! I'm all for buying the right parts and don't mind paying for decent quality stuff, but I could smash and replace my sump at least 10 times before it's going to cost me as much as that.

[martauto]

Just about to set off on on my m54b30 swap.

got a 320 auto and an e39 530i manual that I will be trying to swap most of it into the e30.

wise me luck as can't find all that much info on it but I'm sure ill work it out.

ill update some bits on here when I get there.

Sam

Welcome to the zone mate and the best of luck with the swap.

Mart.

[flybynite]

Not cheap? You're right there! I'm all for buying the right parts and don't mind paying for decent quality stuff, but I could smash and replace my sump at least 10 times before it's going to cost me as much as that.

Yeah I know what you mean, there are cheaper versions if you search but thought that video showed the theory. Not difficult to make yourself though if you are handy with a welder.

I’m not sure it is necessary on an M54 but I would certainly baffle the E34 sump if you are going to track the car. He is right about the oil starvation and aeration.

If you are going to the expense of a bare metal S54 swap then I guess the benefits of using the twin pickup sump are worth it as insurance on a £6k rebuilt S54 engine.

[Rinx]

So it sounds like the following would work with the M54B30.

Usual M52 swap stuff:

- ZF 328i/M3 gearbox
- E36 328i prop with E30 CSB reversed
- E36 Engine arms
- E28 Engine mounts
- M20 Flywheel/starter/clutch (or just stick with the E46 dual mass set up with standard starter and clutch)
- E34 M50 sump
- Clio servo
- EWS delete or wire in EWS modules etc if you have donor car
- Exhaust manifold - sounds like the M52 manifold bolts up (BM Conversions M52 one should work?)

The main things that are different from the normal M52 swap are:

- Oil pick up pipe needs to be made up (doesn't look too difficult)
- DBW throttle to be installed
- Attach C101 plug to M54 loom and wire up accelerator pedal - doesn't look too bad if you're ok with electrics (E46 loom should be a good starting point)
- Modified FPR
- A few different pipes etc needed for plumbing
- Temp gauge sensor can't be mounted into the head

In the guide, he has used an E30 rad with a viscous fan. I would just go with a E36 aircon rad with an electric mounted fan in front of the rad.

So feels like if you can get hold of a cheap e46 330i, it shouldn't be a huge amount of additional work than a M52 swap or am I missing something....

[flybynite]

So it sounds like the following would work with the M54B30.

Usual M52 swap stuff:

- ZF 328i/M3 gearbox

I'm looking at using the 6-speed from the FL 330i which should tie up with the unused rearmost mounting points in the shell

- E36 328i prop with E30 CSB reversed

Not sure on what props would work with the 6-speed but haven't got the tape out yet

- E36 Engine arms
- E28 Engine mounts
- M20 Flywheel/starter/clutch (or just stick with the E46 dual mass set up with standard starter and clutch)

I'm going to be using the standard DMF there is a valeo sprung clutch/solid flywheel conversion for the E46 but heard mixed reviews

- E34 M50 sump
- Clio servo

I have heard the E90 servo fits but you need to remove DISA and lift the engine on one side if you need to swap it

- EWS delete or wire in EWS modules etc if you have donor car

EWS delete will work but running EWS is not as simple as M52, you need to swap ALL the modules otherwise it throws errors for modules it can't find and won't start. Some modules you can't use so you would need to edit the EWS to code out the modules you are not using. It is the way I want to do it but it is a can of worms.

- Exhaust manifold - sounds like the M52 manifold bolts up (BM Conversions M52 one should work?)

The main things that are different from the normal M52 swap are:

- Oil pick up pipe needs to be made up (doesn't look too difficult)

The E38 728i pickup should work , from this thread
https://www.r3vlimited.com/board/forum/ ... gin/page30

- DBW throttle to be installed
- Attach C101 plug to M54 loom and wire up accelerator pedal - doesn't look too bad if you're ok with electrics (E46 loom should be a good starting point)
- Modified FPR
- A few different pipes etc needed for plumbing

In the guide, he has used an E30 rad with a viscous fan and mounted the radiator fan switch into a different housing . I would just go with a E36 aircon rad and mount the switch in there, with an electric mounted fan in front of the rad.

So feels like if you can get hold of a cheap e46 330i, it shouldn't be a huge amount of additional work than a M52 swap

If you are running the full DISA intake it is bigger than the M52 but I think DISA is worth it.

or am I missing something....

I hope not

[Rinx]

Sounds good! Would be good to hear how you get on!

With the flywheel, I suppose you could run a singlemass 240mm unit with a sprung clutch plate from an E36 M3.

[flybynite]

Sounds good! Would be good to hear how you get on!

With the flywheel, I suppose you could run a singlemass 240mm unit with a sprung clutch plate from an E36 M3.

Don't hold your breath, going to be a while as I have quite a bit going on at the moment. I'm just doing a parts hunt and getting it straight in my head for when I get round to doing it. There are a couple of people on here doing it now that I'm sure will chip in before long.

As far as the clutch, If you are using a M54 and matching gearbox I would stick with a stock clutch, modern cars have DMFs for a reason. Valeo conversion or M3 hybrid would have the same issues. I had no problem in the 330i with the clutch or gearchange (once the CDV was gone )

Nice new LuK flywheel and Sachs clutch waiting to go on (its the way it came from the factory and I have had no cause to mess with that combination).

[clarko74]

I'm one of those who is doing it now and while it's not finished yet I am a reasonable way through. The engine is in and the only remaining things I need to do are fit the exhaust, fit the radiator and sort out the writing.

I agree with pretty much all of the above, although I've gone a slightly different route with the transmission. My E30 had an M20 and decent LSD in it so it made sense to keep the existing drive train. I just did the usual M52 thing of taking a bit off the flywheel to get it to fit.

I also of course had to take account of the additional 10 or so degrees of rotation of the engine. I went for a Garagistic gearbox mount and dssr which they make specifically for this scenario. Both work fine although the gearbox mounts I'm using (E21 ones I believe) use larger bolts then the E30 ones so I had to open up the holes slightly to get them to fit. I also made up a custom gear lever mount from the E30 one and an E46 one, this puts the gear lever back to a more central location as it comes through the chassis

There is an oil pick up from the E32 728i that works, there are actually two variations of this pipe, part numbers 11417503261 and 11411432735. The one ending ...61 costs £108 and the other one £42, luckily I needed the £42 one but not before I had bought the other one! The information I read on the internet gave dates of production for which part would be required, but don't take too much notice of this as it's obviously not completely accurate. I managed to send the other part back which was good of BMW considering it was a special order from Germany.

I didn't take a photo of the two parts sides by side but one difference I did notice was that the oil pump on mine has a bolt holding the pipe right next to where the pipe enters the pump and therefore part 11411432735 was right for me, the other one doesn't have this fixing point. I also had to make up a bracket to fix the other bolt on the pipe into

I had to remove the baffle from the E34 sump as there's already one on the underside of the M54 block. The M54 baffle also has to have the old oil pipe mounting brackets removed.

There are a few other things but I'll put them in a separate post.

[clarko74]

Power steering isn't mentioned above. My donor car had an LF30 pas pump and I found that with the E34 sump fitted this would not fit. The LF20 pump (the one with the rounded back) is smaller and just about fits. My E30 already had an E46 rack with Danthe custom pipes but the LF20 uses a larger banjo fitting at a different angle for the high pressure pipe between the pump and rack. Dan made me up a new pipe and it fits fine. The clearance to the sump is very tight but there's a gap of a couple of mm so it should be ok.

Danthe's modified M52 exhaust manifolds fit fine.

I'm using a Clio servo which again fits fine.

In the above photo you can also see the fuel pressure regulator setup I have gone for. There are various ways to do this, the E46 combined fuel filter and fpr can be strapped in somewhere, but it doesn't look great. I had also heard that an M52 fuel rail would fit and as this has the fpr on the rail, like the M20, I thought I'd give this a go. However while the fuel pipes work all the other bolt holes are in different places so I gave up on that. In the end I went for an E46 M3 fpr, I made up a bracket that fits into the same place as the original fuel filter and fitted the fpr from the M52 fuel rail I had. This is needed as the M3 uses a 5 bar fpr but the M54 uses 3.5.

Heater hoses are from various ones that I had sourced from reading other forums. I'm going with an E36 radiator, I'm sure my current E30 would work but the E36 one is much bigger and as we all know these engines like to run warm. I sourced a Gates 21900 pipe, this is mentioned on a couple of other forums. I've not fitted it yet but it looks like this can be cut in half and both pieces are then used for each on the radiator pipes.

One other thing I've not done yet is sort the fan out. I have the electric fan from the donor 330i and with a bit of modification I think this will fit in front of the radiator.

[clarko74]

Here are a couple of the engine going in. I'd not used a load leveler before but for this it was great, being able to finely adjust the angle of the engine and box really helped. It turned what can end up as a quite physical inexact thing into a precise exercise with almost mm control over the angle. Having loads of people around to watch for clearances also helps.

[Rinx]

Sounds good! Would be good to hear how you get on!

With the flywheel, I suppose you could run a singlemass 240mm unit with a sprung clutch plate from an E36 M3.

Don't hold your breath, going to be a while as I have quite a bit going on at the moment. I'm just doing a parts hunt and getting it straight in my head for when I get round to doing it. There are a couple of people on here doing it now that I'm sure will chip in before long.

As far as the clutch, If you are using a M54 and matching gearbox I would stick with a stock clutch, modern cars have DMFs for a reason. Valeo conversion or M3 hybrid would have the same issues. I had no problem in the 330i with the clutch or gearchange (once the CDV was gone )

Nice new LuK flywheel and Sachs clutch waiting to go on (its the way it came from the factory and I have had no cause to mess with that combination).

Yep, makes sense! I think the single mass would be a lot lighter so should give better accelaration. However, when I used to have an E46 330ci, the standard set up felt really smooth and had a great feel to it! I suppose it depends on whether you want to build an everyday useable car or just a toy to rag at the track.

Clarko74 - build looks awesome mate and some really useful info there!

[flybynite]

I needed the £42 one but not before I had bought the other one!

Looking at the pumps i have here looks like I have made the same mistake But I've had the wrong one far too long to have any luck taking it back!. When I get the other one here I will take a picture, hopefully help someone decide which one they need.
Cracking on with it well mate, hopefully on the road soon

Yep, makes sense! I think the single mass would be a lot lighter so should give better accelaration. However, when I used to have an E46 330ci, the standard set up felt really smooth and had a great feel to it! I suppose it depends on whether you want to build an everyday useable car or just a toy to rag at the track.

I get that but can't help thinking that if you mess with it too much you will lose the best bit of the engine and be better off with something else. I wouldn't go to the bother of putting in an M54 if I just wanted to rag it on track.

Don't get me wrong mine will be balanced and mildly ported, running the Schricks I already have and the 4-bolt pump and chain tensioner in case I do want to rag it on the limit but it is not that kind of engine.

The reason I am putting it in (apart from the engine weight) is the effortless V8-like torque I found that made the 330i so good on the road. It is not an engine easily made happy on the rev limit, much better engines for that.

[e30adventures]

Hi all ! New to the forum, but also doing the M54B30 swap after considering bunch of a other variations like m50/52/ M60/M62 and etc, but not this one is for sure I am just wondering, what diff people are using? Ideally I am thinking of LSD with M54B30, but the original subframe is only suitable for small or medium case diff. I have an good offer for the engine and 6speed gearbox, but diff is what wonders me... And if that would be one of E36 then what driveshaft to use? Same variations with E30/E36 as was mentioned above?

Thanks,
Vlad

[flybynite]

I am just wondering, what diff people are using? Ideally I am thinking of LSD with M54B30, but the original subframe is only suitable for small or medium case diff.

I will be using a 3.15 medium-case torsen from the Z3. It is what they used on the M54B30 powered Z3 so should be OK. The M54 was not renowned for tearing out the boot floor like the S50 so I think the medium case will be fine.

I will be using the 6-speed but it has the same ratio as the Z3 5 speed so around 3.15 should work well. I have not worked out if any prop-shafts will work in combination.

[e30adventures]

I am just wondering, what diff people are using? Ideally I am thinking of LSD with M54B30, but the original subframe is only suitable for small or medium case diff.

I will be using a 3.15 medium-case torsen from the Z3. It is what they used on the M54B30 powered Z3 so should be OK. The M54 was not renowned for tearing out the boot floor like the S50 so I think the medium case will be fine.

I will be using the 6-speed but it has the same ratio as the Z3 5 speed so around 3.15 should work well. I have not worked out if any prop-shafts will work in combination.

OMG, this reply so quick! Thank you for the info! Any suggestions on LSD diff? Probably it will be from e36/z3 medium case or I am wrong?
Thanks

[flybynite]

Any suggestions on LSD diff? Probably it will be from e36/z3 medium case or I am wrong?
Thanks

As I said above???

I am using Medium case 3.15 ratio Torsen-type LSD from the Z3.

Plate-type LSD from E30 will work also

[e30adventures]

Any suggestions on LSD diff? Probably it will be from e36/z3 medium case or I am wrong?
Thanks

As I said above???

I am using Medium case 3.15 ratio Torsen-type LSD from the Z3.

Plate-type LSD from E30 will work also

Thanks for the information! really appreciate it!

[Andyboy]

I also of course had to take account of the additional 10 or so degrees of rotation of the engine. I went for a Garagistic gearbox mount and dssr which they make specifically for this scenario. Both work fine although the gearbox mounts I'm using (E21 ones I believe) use larger bolts then the E30 ones so I had to open up the holes slightly to get them to fit. I also made up a custom gear lever mount from the E30 one and an E46 one, this puts the gear lever back to a more central location as it comes through the chassis


20191011_085903.jpg


20191021_122852.jpg

This is why you need the early Getrag 260 gearbox as fitted to the E34 525i for 3-4 months. They are rare (and I have one for sale...) but they were designed to take the 24v engine but sit at the correct angle. You can retain the existing 325i diff, prop, gearlinkage and gearbox mount so that it looks like a proper factory installation. It has the same ratios as the E30 325i box so is an overdrive unit, meaning you can keep the existing diff ratio.

[clarko74]

Indeed. If this had been available when I was doing mine it would have saved me a load of effort.

I'm surprised this hasn't been snapped up already.

[Andyboy]

Me too!

[Blanca]

Have both the 1987 BMW E30 320i saloon and a 1987 Mercedes 2.3-16V Cosworth, give me the E30 any day. Less power, like half but a pleasure to drive, so fed up sapping ends, buying tyres and fuel.

[buzzbee]

im new to e30 zone and i too am in the planning stage for my e30 cab.. im looking at a complete 2004 330ci at the minute for a donner.
if i have the complete 330ci 6 speed manual what other parts am i going to need ??? will prop fit ?? will i need to make any changes to the tunnel or will the engine and box drop in ?? would the front seats fit ? questions questions .
any help and knowledge would be great

[buzzbee]

This is what I’m thinking as donner.
Just trying to get a rough idea of costs if I have this to work with

[flybynite]

im new to e30 zone and i too am in the planning stage for my e30 cab.. im looking at a complete 2004 330ci at the minute for a donner.
if i have the complete 330ci 6 speed manual what other parts am i going to need ??? will prop fit ?? will i need to make any changes to the tunnel or will the engine and box drop in ?? would the front seats fit ? questions questions .
any help and knowledge would be great

Look back up the thread and follow the links posted, that will answer a lot of questions.

Seats will fit if a subframe is made up, whether you would want them in an E30 is another matter.

No idea on the prop, rather than chase round the country with a tape measure I was going to get one shortened professionally to the right length for the 6-speed. If you make one up from two halves it still needs to go somewhere to be balanced unless you really enjoy the feeling of driving over rumble strips

I would also strip out the ABS and loom if it is a Facelift with a MK60 ABS.

It is not the easiest swap and many will say an M52 is better for lots of reasons. The M54B30 is good at some things and if those are what you like then it is a worthwhile swap. if you want to mess with it, go FI or want a high-revving screamer then best look elsewhere