Theresa's deal binned

[alexdejonghe]

Suspect yoi're all sick to the back teeth of the B word but, we've a monumental few months coming up that could see the Tories renegotiate fresh terms with the EU, leave without a deal and trade under WTO, scrap BREXIT, have another referendum and hold another UK general election. All big potatoes and all, possibly, what is frightening people off buying my bloody house.

Anyway, whats everybodys thoughts on what's to come?

[steve_k]

lets be honest, she knew it wasn't going to get through,

when the referendum was held 2yr's ago the ballot paper said "IN" or "OUT" not, lets f**k around for 2yr's & come up with a "deal" that keeps us in the EU in all but name, & to be honest thats what her deal was,

on the news this morning they are talking about it going on that when we leave if there is no deal that it will be a disaster, how? they are forgetting about the WTO, under their rules you are free to trade with who ever you is willing,why limit yourself to only trading with 27 countries? when there are 196 in the world? why limit your marketplace?

then you get comrade corbyn trying to table a motion of no confidence, trying to get a general election, who does this old fool think he is? he has absolutely no idea what he's doing, he changes his mind as often as his socks, he can't even get his own party to agree on what their plan would be, also he seems to be taking orders from mcclusky (union boss), if corbyn was to get into number 10 then this country would be done for, don't forget this is a man who thinks venezuela is a blueprint for how this country should be, but that is a country thats in flames, with an economy on it's arse, unemployment through the roof, riots in the streets, & near enough bankrupt, does that look like a good idea for the UK????

and now they are going on about a 2nd referendum, how?? the first one told them what the people of the UK wanted yet they forget that they work for us not the other way round, yet they go on about how this country can't manage without being in the EU, are they forgetting (ignoring??) the fact we did pretty well before we joined in the '70's??

at the end of the day we voted to leave so they should just get on with it.
the EU needs us more than we need them.

[Gert_8]

Exiting on WTO terms is not a good thing. It's more bureaucratic and bound in red tape than the EU - a complaint made by many about the EU and their reason for voting exit. Do you know who your EU parliamentary member is? Who is your representative in WTO? We would be starting from scratch (no pre-agreements in place, should we leave with no deal, despite the fact that there is nothing stopping us having such agreements).

We have substantial trade with the 27 EU countries and they are on our doorstep. Exiting on WTO will impact our existing arrangements and be harmful to the country. I am not saying it will not harm the EU too.

Perhaps Mrs May thought dancing in Ghana would make for good deals with similarly sized nations - That's Ghana with the GDP of, say, Birmingham....?

We can, of course, trade with Japan, China, India, USA* - firstly, the EU is already trading there, so what's stopping us? If trade is affected by the level of tariffs, then do you think the aforementioned is going to ignore Europe in preference to trading with the UK? Europe presents a larger market, after all. If we offer reduced tariffs, then the EU will wade in and undercut us. Who benefits from this?

*We will get nothing from trading with the US unless it benefits them - especially with Trump MAGAing.

The Conservatives are responsible for creating this mess in the first instance (I am not a Corbynite). They have wasted two years muddling through things and being held back with their own party's in fighting. Only after two years and last night's vote is May talking about cross-party solutions... two years! (David Davis, in charge of negotiations did 4 hours work over this period - WTH has he been doing apart from collecting his salary?)

We have been promised cream cakes, but we are actually getting a turd in a box. Surprises me how many people still want to eat it!

At the end of the day, if you work to make a living, rather than making a living from your wealth, I cannot see Brexit benefiting you.

[alexdejonghe]

Two well balanced rational arguments.

Nearly 3 years on it is quite amazing how BREXIT still divides people with otherwise much in common, in families & offices, quickly leading to 'racist, 'stupid', 'naïve', 'weak' being tossed about. No general election does this and seemingly polarizes Leave into the extreme right and Remain into socialist left, which is bollocks.

Guess it's that 'conformation bias' tendency of humans to seek out evidence (= spin/scaremongering by politicians, printed by biased media outlets) that support our viewpoint.

Whichever we voted in 2016 I think many of us regret opening this can of worms (not that we'll necessarily reverse or regret our vote) and want it closed pronto. Had this vote taken place not following a time of terrorist attacks across Europe (like now, for instance) I bet immigration wouldn't have been an issue and Remain would have wiped the floor.

[Gert_8]

Personally, I suspect a lot of people got duped by the £350m per week going to the NHS and politicians telling them the EU could whistle for the HUGE £39B "divorce payment" we make every year, and that leaving would be the easiest thing going and leaving would make everyone better off.

Some voters confused local issues, such as housing, libraries, swimming pools or kids playground closures with the EU, so voted exit.
There will also be an element of voters that simply wanted to give the government a kick in the balls for years of austerity measures and some that have no interest in whether share prices or house prices fell, or that the value of the pound plummeted, purely because they don't have any of these things, so has no effect on their day-to-day lives. Life continues irrespective of whether they are in or out.

A very complex issue passed off as a yes/no vote to the public. It should never have been allowed to happen. Cameron regrettably pandered to a minority hard-line back bench that have been whining about Europe for decades.

The reason why we have wasted 2.5 years on this is that Brexit is undeliverable. It will have far reaching consequences, harming all sectors of our economy. May is trying to deliver "Brexit" ("because the people have spoken") while safeguarding jobs and financial security. yet still, her own, aforementioned, party members remain unhappy....!

Labour are too frightened to lose voters, if they also fail to honour the "people have spoken."

Thing is, a lot of the people that spoke have changed their views based on the reality of the situation, rather than the FALSE ideology sold in 2016.