E30 M3 H35 - 24 (Hartge) Authentication

[PGH]

Help needed to Authenticate an E30 M3 H35 - 24 (Hartge).

I recently came across an E30 M3 that has an M88 M5 engine and I did my homework via the VIN # and the car is an authentic M3.

I am now trying to get a hold of someone at Hartge to authenticate that it is one of theirs and not a clone.

The engine bay look like it was factory built.

Just as it should:
ABS is behind the headlight
BMW and 24 - 6 with horizontal strips on the intake
Round BMW logo and M Power on the valve cover
Headers that look original and fit perfectly
Hood insulator fits the engine and takes the shape of the intake
Extra tank behind the rear seat in the trunk
Breaks may be that of the M5 E28
Alpina motor mount!
Break master cylinder has not booster!

Missing:
It does not have the Hartge label one the valve cover or any where else!

[bss325i]

Pretty sure genuine H35 -24V have a brake booster and i doubt they would have used an Alpina motor mount.

Brakes on an E28 M5 are 3 piston ATE callipers an the H35 24V i know of being rebuilt uses single piston calipers.

There is one well known H35-24V in the uk which a mate owns, Kos on here is a good friend of the owner so may be worth dropping him a pm if he does not see this thread.

Is the extra fuel tank steel and vertically mounted or alloy and horizontally mounted? All E30 M3's apart from the sport Evo have a vertically mounted steel tank the the luggage compartment.

Also, another mate (Theo on here) owns the remains of a genuine H35-24V which is part way through being rebuilt into a replacement M3 shell after the original was damaged in an accident.

[bss325i]

Any pics by the way?

[Topblag]

By the time they were making Hartge H35S models, I believe Hartge were an approved German Car Manufacturer and like my 1984 H35, the car should have a Hartge vin plate behind the front lights on the slam panel and also the BMW Vin on the scuttle scored out and the Hartge number stamped beside the original BMW number, matching the Hartge VIN plate of course. You can buy copies of the VIN plates on German eBay.

Now comes the tough bit, my H35 was owned by Rolph Michael Hartge, the brother of Herbert Hartge and who also who set up Carlsson Tuning and was handy with a Polo Mallet. Unfortunately he is long dead. It's rumoured to be he first H35 ever built and was adorned with lots of interesting extras. I eventually got the email address of Herbert's daughter, Maya and contacted her. She got another member of the Hartge family to check it out and see if they had any info they could share. They came back with nothing and by all accounts, they kept no records of these cars. In summary, they will be of no help. This is nothing new as far as I've heard.

My advice would be to contact the TUV, who I believe to be the German DVLA equivalent as they must have records of these cars. I need to do the same to confirm if mine was the first built.

[Topblag]

Pretty sure genuine H35 -24V have a brake booster and i doubt they would have used an Alpina motor mount.

Brakes on an E28 M5 are 3 piston ATE callipers an the H35 24V i know of being rebuilt uses single piston calipers.

The H35 came with the same Merc 52mm (IIRC correctly and I'm not going into the loft to check them!) single piston caliper, with a bespoke Alpina carrier and 296mm discs. It was the same setup from the B6. Same with the front top mounts, Alpina used them first on the B6. As well as making a load of stuff up, Hartge robbed a fair amount from the Alpina design.

[bss325i]

Pretty sure genuine H35 -24V have a brake booster and i doubt they would have used an Alpina motor mount.

Brakes on an E28 M5 are 3 piston ATE callipers an the H35 24V i know of being rebuilt uses single piston calipers.

The H35 came with the same Merc 52mm (IIRC correctly and I'm not going into the loft to check them!) single piston caliper, with a bespoke Alpina carrier and 296mm discs. It was the same setup from the B6. Same with the front top mounts, Alpina used them first on the B6. As well as making a load of stuff up, Hartge robbed a fair amount from the Alpina design.

I'm well aware all that. The H35-24V used a two piece front disc and single piston caliper with vented rear discs which is different to the Alpina B6/Hartge H35 set up.

Theo posted pics of all the set up on his H35-24V on his thread but they were hosted with imageshack and not displayed anymore.

[Kos]

Alans is possible the most well documented H36 (H35-24) known. From my understanding the H35-24 was an e30 with the m88 engine. When it was put into an M3 body it was called the H36

On Alans engine, there is no Hartge badging


As for his brakes, the originals were replaced with a MovIt 4 piston set up. These were removed and OEM M3 brakes fitted

His rear brake discs re vented. but not sure what car they came off.

i'll try and find out whats what

[Theo]

It doesn't sound original to me, hartge engine bays looked anything but original. Additional fuel tank in the boot is commonplace for the m3, or is it a large flat aluminium tank?

Lack of brake booster also makes me think it's been put together by a home mechanic, no way would a car pass a TUV without a proper braking system.

Interested to see pics if you have any?

[HartgeRaul]

He emailed me with pics of e30 m3 with m88 motor.
After looking at the pics it is not a Hartge H35-24 m3.
It could be made into a clone with Hartge parts.