£10k E21

[bss325i]

Forget about about the E21 323i. Where are the pre-facelift 2 door 325i's gone.

I have one available if you're up for it!

[Nas80]

The local dealership requested for my e21 to be part of the display for the m3/m4 launch. This car has won award for concourse and also been magazine featured. The engine swap isn't a bolt in affair like an e30. It requires a lot more work.

E 21s are just much rare, cooler, better looking, more fun to drive then the e30... There are many many e30 and only a few hundred e21s. So if you want an old bmw and want something more exclusive then a run of the mill boring e30 this is the car for you..

[pacerpete]

E21s are definitely rarer than E30s, you were right on that point.........

[Hoobs]

You know you want one Pete. :p

One of the worst things about an e21 is the stupidly slow steering that makes oversteer tough to catch and the handling feel dimwitted overall. You can get quick-racks now though, which ar 2.2 turns instead of 4. Obviously modern rubber helps tame oversteer too.

You know it is OK to like other BM's as well as e30's.

[cobbler2u]

Very nice car. Well worth the money.
if it weren't for the e21 bmw wouldn't be were it is today lets not forget that .
Lets have a history lesson.
1st came the 2002
2nd came the e21's and both models had the baur conversion
Then well I guess you guys know what came next. lol

I have 2 e21's including BAUR & The Special also known as the (LE)
And a pre facelift 325i. You see I like the cars that aint two to a penny

As for porches the are an over priced VW BETTLE to common
and nothing special

[Nas80]

My e21 has a very expensive 2.4 turn quick rack. It's like a go kart.

[pacerpete]

Very nice car. Well worth the money.
if it weren't for the e21 bmw wouldn't be were it is today lets not forget that .
Lets have a history lesson.
1st came the 2002
2nd came the e21's and both models had the baur conversion
Then well I guess you guys know what came next. lol

I have 2 e21's including BAUR & The Special also known as the (LE)
And a pre facelift 325i. You see I like the cars that aint two to a penny

As for porches the are an over priced VW BETTLE to common
and nothing special

E21s used to be two to a penny, and they were expensive at that ! You just are not old enough to remember !

On a positive note, they are not quite as horrid as 02's , though the owners are nearly as spesh . Mark excepted cos he's a big c0000nt and has some bits for me

[Nas80]

[Nas80]

[cobbler2u]

yea before the e30's
Im old enough to remember unfortunately

People must take the blinkers off and appreciate all models. I remember people hated the e36 in its day. Watch the prices rise on these soon as they are getting rare no days.

[Simon13]

e21s are crap. BMW learnt their lessons and came back with the world beating e30. it was THE car! Everyone loves to hate the best its the british way to be like that.

[bss325i]

The E30 is THE car that made BMW's rep in the UK what it is.

The were the car to aspire to where as the E21 was, as Andy once put it, an upmarket Cortina.

Dont get me wrong, i like a nice E21 but the E30 is better in every way.

[Hoobs]

Can someone pass the rose tinted spectacles my way please?

BMW had a rep for building quality, driver focussed cars long before the e30 came along. The e30 just happened to coincide with Thatcherism, yuppies and disposable income, which meant that they were no longer just for the wealthy.

e21 and e30 overlapped by a couple of years and both have their good and bad points. Obviously, this being an e30 forum, most people are going to back the e30 but it was hardly light years ahead of the e21 it replaced. Yes, the e30 looked a bit more contemporary and felt a little more refined, but it's pretty much the same sort of thing under the skin.

I've got both and wouldn't want anything else.

[Andyboy]

The E30 sold better than the E21 and gained cult status because it had that certain something that the E21 didn't. It's the difference that separates the original Audi A4 from the previous Audi 80 - they look vaguely similar but one was a showroom museum piece and the other sold millions. The E21 just looked a bit odd with the number plate under the rear bumper. The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car - the E21 just didn't, and it will never have the all round appeal of the E30. In the same vein, an E23 looks like a shed on wheels parked next to an E32.

As for drivers cars, the E21 never had a shining reputation - cars like the Alfetta and even the original Cavalier were better. E21's had very odd handling, too soft at the front with low geared steering. 323i's were just useless as standard - LSD and Bilsteins were essential extras.

Mind you, that dark Lapis blue 316 E21 on the Park Lane stand at Gaydon last year was really lovely, single headlights and skinny steel wheels.

[Nas80]

For £10k I would have an immaculate E21 323i LE with 40k mileage and Concours champion which was for sale recently.

For once I agree with pony !

If I was ever stupid and or high enough on drugs to pay 10 bags for an E21 ... It wouldn't be on a modded 316 from Bradford ! Fair foooks to the guy for blowing his wad on a once horrid turd and making his dream come true etc...but getting a refund on his project will be hard unless he finds an equally delusional victim? eek:

Surely 10k is e21 C1-b6 territory ?

You can tell a fool as soon as he opens his mouth. This guy is a prime example. (e30topless)

[pony]

A decent 996? Was there ever such a beast?

The trouble with 996's is that the engine is very flawed and it's not a case of if it will require a 5-10k rebuild, but when. Plus they just look like old 1998 toss now and have Mark 4 Golf build quality, penny pinched and cost pared to buggery.

10 grand for an E21 or any description = no ta. I had 323i's when they were £350 auction fodder, and they're no faster in 2014. They were replaced in 1982 by something much better.

But the appeal of the E21 323i LE is is goes sideways more early than E30 325i

That's not an appeal, it's a liability. Not bad in the dry with LSD, proper suspension and tyres but horrid in the wet. I ran two 323i's back in the day, okay but nothing a 325i can't sort out.

Who doesn't wanna be "arm crossing" sideways in an immaculate original E21 323i LE
So much style and cool
Cannot think of another car for £10k which has this much
sTYLE
FUN
LOOKS
And birds love E21 323i LE!!!!
With LSD you can go drifting

[Nas80]

The E30 sold better than the E21 and gained cult status because it had that certain something that the E21 didn't. It's the difference that separates the original Audi A4 from the previous Audi 80 - they look vaguely similar but one was a showroom museum piece and the other sold millions. The E21 just looked a bit odd with the number plate under the rear bumper. The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car - the E21 just didn't, and it will never have the all round appeal of the E30. In the same vein, an E23 looks like a shed on wheels parked next to an E32.

As for drivers cars, the E21 never had a shining reputation - cars like the Alfetta and even the original Cavalier were better. E21's had very odd handling, too soft at the front with low geared steering. 323i's were just useless as standard - LSD and Bilsteins were essential extras.

Mind you, that dark Lapis blue 316 E21 on the Park Lane stand at Gaydon last year was really lovely, single headlights and skinny steel wheels.

I often say that there is absolutely nothing good about a stock e21. They are actually terrible to drive as a stock vehicle, they came with the balloon tyres, very soft suspension, but it was designed in the 70s.

You guys are lucky with e30's because you have a abundance of go faster bits, its not so easy with an e21 where there is a very limited supply.

This is precisely why my e21 has had a lot of focus on the chassis. I spent many thousands and even more time improving it. It's setup perfectly now you can easily balance it on the throttle mid bend,

The missing link like you say is the steering. standard it is 4 turns lock to lock from the factory, when I fitted the rack which is 2.4 turns lock to lock. you hardly ever need to cross your hands, it has totally transformed the car, the steering rack has made such a massive difference. no more constantly sawing at the wheel you can easily pull off some big long slides if you wanted to without ending up in a ditch.

I took it on one track day to basically test the strength and have some proper fun (which I did) I didn't break anything, recently did a trip to Europe and took it to 140 on unrestricted motorway, handled that no problem too.

[pony]

The E30 sold better than the E21 and gained cult status because it had that certain something that the E21 didn't. It's the difference that separates the original Audi A4 from the previous Audi 80 - they look vaguely similar but one was a showroom museum piece and the other sold millions. The E21 just looked a bit odd with the number plate under the rear bumper. The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car - the E21 just didn't, and it will never have the all round appeal of the E30. In the same vein, an E23 looks like a shed on wheels parked next to an E32.

As for drivers cars, the E21 never had a shining reputation - cars like the Alfetta and even the original Cavalier were better. E21's had very odd handling, too soft at the front with low geared steering. 323i's were just useless as standard - LSD and Bilsteins were essential extras.

Mind you, that dark Lapis blue 316 E21 on the Park Lane stand at Gaydon last year was really lovely, single headlights and skinny steel wheels.

Who cares

The challenge is taming E21 323i LE
Which is by all records an oversteering beast
For heroes
For the hairy chested
Metro sexual need not apply
I thought E21s were ugly growing up but wow I think they look really stunning original E21 looks stunning
Modded E21 just spell council and peasant to me much like any other modded BMW / wannabe Porsche / Ferrari owner !!!!

Google tiff Needell and E21 323i in YouTube
The E21 he drove in the clip that 323i LE was for sale at £10k recently

[ross_jsy]

Pony you have had a couple of tiny bits of sideways and shat a diff being a bell end in a residential area. Do shut up about being a hairy chested drift king

[Nas80]

Modded E21 just spell council and peasant to me much like any other modded BMW / wannabe Porsche / Ferrari owner !!!!

Wow. I'm going to guess you live on a bridge.

[Fal_325i]

Haters gonna hate!,

Lovely car, if I had the spare coin, I'd have that. Nicely put together.

Everyone has their opinions, and yes, this is an e30 forum and people will be biased. But even a basic e21 is a rare sight these days. Credit where credit is due, a lot of blood, sweat and tears, not to mention £££ have gone into this car, and it shows. Not your ordinary e21.

[Hoobs]

The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car.

A must have car that never once made it into the top 10 cars sold in the UK?

Aesthetics are always going to be subjective and there are plenty of people who prefer the earlier styling of the Bracq cars.

[Andyboy]

The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car.

A must have car that never once made it into the top 10 cars sold in the UK?

Supply and demand, or rather demand and supply. BMW was a much, much smaller company back then. They could well have dropped prices and increased production to match the Sierra but back then they had an image to protect. There's also the question of money - E30's were a lot more expensive than run of the mill stuff plus you then had to pay through the nose for options of which you needed many.

[Andyboy]

The E30 sold better than the E21 and gained cult status because it had that certain something that the E21 didn't. It's the difference that separates the original Audi A4 from the previous Audi 80 - they look vaguely similar but one was a showroom museum piece and the other sold millions. The E21 just looked a bit odd with the number plate under the rear bumper. The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car - the E21 just didn't, and it will never have the all round appeal of the E30. In the same vein, an E23 looks like a shed on wheels parked next to an E32.

As for drivers cars, the E21 never had a shining reputation - cars like the Alfetta and even the original Cavalier were better. E21's had very odd handling, too soft at the front with low geared steering. 323i's were just useless as standard - LSD and Bilsteins were essential extras.

Mind you, that dark Lapis blue 316 E21 on the Park Lane stand at Gaydon last year was really lovely, single headlights and skinny steel wheels.

Who cares

The challenge is taming E21 323i LE
Which is by all records an oversteering beast
For heroes
For the hairy chested
Metro sexual need not apply
I thought E21s were ugly growing up but wow I think they look really stunning original E21 looks stunning
Modded E21 just spell council and peasant to me much like any other modded BMW / wannabe Porsche / Ferrari owner !!!!

Google tiff Needell and E21 323i in YouTube
The E21 he drove in the clip that 323i LE was for sale at £10k recently

For Christs sake.......

[Andyboy]

The E30 sold better than the E21 and gained cult status because it had that certain something that the E21 didn't. It's the difference that separates the original Audi A4 from the previous Audi 80 - they look vaguely similar but one was a showroom museum piece and the other sold millions. The E21 just looked a bit odd with the number plate under the rear bumper. The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car - the E21 just didn't, and it will never have the all round appeal of the E30. In the same vein, an E23 looks like a shed on wheels parked next to an E32.

As for drivers cars, the E21 never had a shining reputation - cars like the Alfetta and even the original Cavalier were better. E21's had very odd handling, too soft at the front with low geared steering. 323i's were just useless as standard - LSD and Bilsteins were essential extras.

Mind you, that dark Lapis blue 316 E21 on the Park Lane stand at Gaydon last year was really lovely, single headlights and skinny steel wheels.

I often say that there is absolutely nothing good about a stock e21. They are actually terrible to drive as a stock vehicle, they came with the balloon tyres, very soft suspension, but it was designed in the 70s.

You guys are lucky with e30's because you have a abundance of go faster bits, its not so easy with an e21 where there is a very limited supply.

This is precisely why my e21 has had a lot of focus on the chassis. I spent many thousands and even more time improving it. It's setup perfectly now you can easily balance it on the throttle mid bend,

The missing link like you say is the steering. standard it is 4 turns lock to lock from the factory, when I fitted the rack which is 2.4 turns lock to lock. you hardly ever need to cross your hands, it has totally transformed the car, the steering rack has made such a massive difference. no more constantly sawing at the wheel you can easily pull off some big long slides if you wanted to without ending up in a ditch.

I took it on one track day to basically test the strength and have some proper fun (which I did) I didn't break anything, recently did a trip to Europe and took it to 140 on unrestricted motorway, handled that no problem too.

Good post! Love the car as well, looks just right. May I ask what it cost to build - a lot more than 10k I'll wager!

[Nas80]

Well I did 95% of the Labour myself. That saved me so much cash.

This how it looked when I got it.

[Simon13]

Can someone pass the rose tinted spectacles my way please?

BMW had a rep for building quality, driver focussed cars long before the e30 came along. The e30 just happened to coincide with Thatcherism, yuppies and disposable income, which meant that they were no longer just for the wealthy.

e21 and e30 overlapped by a couple of years and both have their good and bad points. Obviously, this being an e30 forum, most people are going to back the e30 but it was hardly light years ahead of the e21 it replaced. Yes, the e30 looked a bit more contemporary and felt a little more refined, but it's pretty much the same sort of thing under the skin.

I've got both and wouldn't want anything else.

One fairly major difference is the front anti roll bar on the e30 is exactly that an anti roll bar. On the e21 its holding the front suspension together aswell as trying to be a roll bar!

That grey e21 pictured is lovely but they are few are far between, whereas when it comes to lovely e30s there are loads!

[Nas80]

Yea the front suspension is very similar to mk1 / mk2 escorts. The rear is independent though which helps a lot.

[Hoobs]

That grey e21 pictured is lovely but they are few are far between, whereas when it comes to lovely e30s there are loads!

Fortunately (for those who like e21 anyway), there are a lot more properly built e21 in the UK now. (There are loads in mainland Europe where the e21 is really popular and has a big following) They do take a bit more effort though, as off the shelf tuning bits just don't come up and very little stuff can simply be swapped from other models. There won't be as many e21 as e30 though obviously, as they've had longer to rot away and e30 were made for a lot longer. E21 have also been overlooked for years but there is a lot more interest of late as the recent increased prices has shown.

As I said, I like both e21 and e30, but I do like the fact that e21 are a little more unusual nowadays. I'm not saying they're better, just first. (and better)

Like Nas, I have spent way too much time, effort and cash on my old 316, that replaced my old orange car that caught fire a couple of years ago. I don't intend selling it though and it's been built how I want it. I know it won't be to everyones taste but that's OK too.

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... highlight=

[whiterhino]

Whether you like this guys car or not,how many zoners own a car in such nice condition as this.
Blah blah blah if I had 10k.fact is if you bought this for 10k or any e30 for 10k I doubt you would be drifting and abusing it hairy chested style would you.
To me as it stands its a lovely e21,maybe the e30 was a better car I like both to be honest.fact is like I said
How many zoners own a cleaner e30.

[Simon13]

i do

[whiterhino]

you and a limited few

[pony]

The E30 just looks tighter and better proportioned, and it became a 'must have' car.

A must have car that never once made it into the top 10 cars sold in the UK?

Supply and demand, or rather demand and supply. BMW was a much, much smaller company back then. They could well have dropped prices and increased production to match the Sierra but back then they had an image to protect. There's also the question of money - E30's were a lot more expensive than run of the mill stuff plus you then had to pay through the nose for options of which you needed many.

Nowdays BMW do not seem to care about exclusivity

[pony]

Pony you have had a couple of tiny bits of sideways and shat a diff being a bell end in a residential area. Do shut up about being a hairy chested drift king

Pipe down I didn't say anything about drift king

[bab-91]

Hello Nas.

I'm the OP of the thread. Love the car (No zone trash mentality in me )