Tune the m20, fit a 2.8 m52 or turn the 2.5 into a 2.8?

[Bump]

hi all

I know, another one of these threads.

This is my car:





Very happy with it having spent a few years bringing everything up to scratch - standard scratch that is.

There's zero rust. I'm the 3rd owner and it's on 84k, so keeping it original-ish is probably the way to go given miles and condition.

So options for engine tinkering now on the table because I can't resist:

1) Tune existing m20 with bolt ons: BBTB, ITG panel, BTB manifold

Cost about £1100 and keeps original.

2) Convert m20 to a 2.8

Don't know about costs for this option, faster, not original

3) Fit an m52 2.8

I guess about £1500, fastest of all, not original

I think I have just talked myself into option 1, but welcome thoughts

cheers

[daimlerman]

Option two will be expensive if done properly,but will look original at a quick look under the bonnet.

[jmc330i]

If you build a 2.8 M20, everything under the bonnet will still look original, so if you're worried about originality I'd be going that route.
You could always tune the 2.5 with a BBTB, BTB manifold etc now, as those bits will be very useful for a 2.8 build at a later date

[Speedtouch]

A chip will liven it up considerably, and can be had for as little as £35 posted.

[HairyScreech]

building a 2.8 and fitting an m52 work out about similar in costs. So really its your choice, the rewards of building a good 2.8 are about the same as fitting the m52, however the carwill still look and feel roughly the same and all parts will be off the shelf.

[Bump]

Good point. Option 1, enjoy that for a bit, then Option 2 at a later date.

How much would an m20 2.8 build, done properly (i.e not me) cost?

Bexleys do them don't they?

Cheers

[Bump]

A chip will liven it up considerably, and can be had for as little as £35 posted.

Already got one on there thank you - but you're right.

[polsta]

thats definatly the way to do it, seems so/too many engine conversions go on these days, keep it old school

[miniblob]

I've played this game - started tuning my M20 with BBTB, BTB Mani & Exhaust, ITG, Remap, etc - was good fun and got to about 180/185bhp iirc - before the head went!!!

Then went the expensive 2.7 route - spent huge amounts of money and still not sure if I like it!!!
I've made the whole car a lot more harsh and noisy though - different cam, near solid mounts, coilys, etc!!! Lots of fun, great on track days, but not so much if you're using it every day!!!

If I did it again, I would be going for an engine swap to something bigger as standard!!!
M52 I would imagine will feel great, as well as being reliable as standard!!!
Personally think I'd go for a cheeky V8 next time!!!

[Morat]

In your (enviable) position I'd go with the 2.8 M20. Your car is achingly gorgeous and while there's nothing _wrong_ with an M52 under the bonnet a totally stealthy 2.8 would be so much cooler.

option4 sell to me for a bag of werthers and a testicle.

[E30BeemerLad]

That's a very nice looking touring and with the low miles etc and original features I think it would be better to keep the M20 lump in there for originality sake.

So I would go option 1 followed by option2.

You still won't end up with a massively quick car at the end of it all though and I would guess that the costs of option 1 & 2 (especially if you are paying labour for option 2) will be in the region of £5k

[Quaser]

Ive done a similar thing in a motorsport i had - tuned up a 2.5, then made it into a 2.7 by bexleys - DO NOT GO THERE - they dont know how to map cars, engine was rebuilt twice as it kept blowing up - its just not worth it.

I now have a m52b28 - it looks like its supposed to be there! I wouldnt spend money modifying an engine - to the extent of cranks, pistons etc again - the m52 option is the best bet imho.

[jmc330i]

Having issues with my phone displaying pics, but that is one lovely looking touring
I would definitely be keeping the M20 in that.

[Bump]

Thanks for the comments.

Seems like option 1 is the way forward for now.

I used to have a 328i sport with the m52 and did the whole de-restriction, air filter kit, chip, re-map thing on that. It was pretty pokey so I'm not entirely sure I'd trust myself with that in the touring anyway, it would be pretty savage in the lighter car.

I bought this touring off a bloke in Guernsey who had it for spares after he wrote off his e30 touring m52 doing about 30mph when he put his foot down and the back stepped out. (Think it might have been Ste's old car if I recall the name correctly?)

Miniblob, you're right in what you say - not everything is an improvement. It would pretty much change the whole character of the car to m52 it and I'd probably need to wear a crash helmet to go down the shops..

I did swear that on this one I would not tinker and would keep it original.

[jimbom30cab]

Guys, there is only one option here, chuck an M30 in it and bingo, bags of torque, easy to look after, proper old skool look

[bab-91]

I'd go the m20 2.8 option but I'm waiting for HairyScreech to come up with some modz that give it more bhp for the same cc

[Bump]

Guys, there is only one option here, chuck an M30 in it and bingo, bags of torque, easy to look after, proper old skool look

Are Alpina C2 3.5's worked up m30 3.5s?

Or have I just imagined they exist?!

Maybe it's the alpina m3 that has this engine.

I like this as an option..

Cheers

[hongkongfuey]

My 2.5 is running at 192 hp and 189 ft/lbs torque

[Bump]

Guys, there is only one option here, chuck an M30 in it and bingo, bags of torque, easy to look after, proper old skool look

you keep buying all the m30s don't you?!

[DanThe]

Building an engine is not cheap, you should be expecting to spend thousands, at least 3 if your paying someone to do it.
You will get more power/torque and economy with an M52, and its also a good deal lighter, for similar money fitted

[goosiegander]

Enjoy what you have!

Nice original cars are thin on the ground...

[Bump]

Building an engine is not cheap, you should be expecting to spend thousands, at least 3 if your paying someone to do it.
You will get more power/torque and economy with an M52, and its also a good deal lighter, for similar money fitted

True.

How much would an m30 3.5 install be with parts and labour?

For some reason I forgot about the m30 and I just fancy a 3.5 if I was to change from the m20, which I shouldn't. Wrong car to do it on.

[HairyScreech]

Terrible engine, 50% more mass than the m20 and counted a lot further forward. Great for its time but in today's world makes about as much sense as fitting a buick v6.

[rich318i]

M52 all the way

[Speedtouch]

Depends if you want reliable stonking torque from an iron block 'boat anchor' or the potential fragility of the alloy block M52, of which horror stories seem to abound here on the Zone; the slightest bit of overheating seems to ruin them, and even replacing the head bolts is fraught and sometimes renders the block beyond repair!

[rich318i]

just need to know whats involved and will not over heat. been running mine over 2 years now over 10k on the clock and all good

[sweep]

leave it alone....manifold/skimmed flywheel

[Bump]

Enjoy what you have!

Nice original cars are thin on the ground...

Yeah I know.

Ahem, is that an s50 in yours?!

[Bump]

On the m52 thing my e36 would idle erratically and ended up replacing the vanos and all sorts to try and fix it, never quite did and it pissed me right off

[DanThe]

On the m52 thing my e36 would idle erratically and ended up replacing the vanos and all sorts to try and fix it, never quite did and it pissed me right off

If you go to the people that know what they are doing you wont have problems

[G-Bear]

Easy Simon. Christ that Touring of yours is a real gleamer.. I've got to pop over soon to see it in the flesh.

I haven't read into much of any of the options stated in great detail.

Although I've never read about overheating issues, I've always been keen on the idea of an M52 conversion. Power to economy seem like a good mix on this one. I appreciate comments on keeping it original. But the M52 does look at home in the bay of an E30. Plus a sleeping black touring would be very nice...

[jimbom30cab]

M30 is a far far more enjoyable car to drive, more smiles per mile than a m52 guaranteed. The m52 boys are just gutted they made the wrong choice, but hey not everyone's perfect yer.

[DanThe]

Jim if your ever up this way you will have to call in and take my track car down the lane, bring your wallet too as ive got a fair few M52 conversion bits lying about

[jimbom30cab]

Arh, now that would make my day , how much fun can you have on 4 wheels !

I am of course secretly hoping the Mrs's e46 328 gets infected with rampant tim work soon, ready made donor car

The thing is, the m30 conversion seems to be the popular choice at the moment, not many m52 faithfulls about these days.

[G-Bear]

I am of course secretly hoping the Mrs's e46 328 gets infected with rampant tim work soon, ready made donor car

This was a loose plan of mine too. I keep showing my good lady for sale adds of E36/46 328's...