upgrade to a 318is

Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:25 pm

tim_s wrote:would love to see how fast it would be then though: 2.1, high CR, flowed head, solid lifters and throttle bodies....

That would make a very nice engine

What sort of duration cams can you get for it ?

Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:27 pm

Bloody hell, sounds like you've quite a bit of work on your hands there!!

Wouldn't solid lifters be a pain in the arse because of the shims etc. Don't you have to check and adjust them periodically (which would mean a rocker cover gasket added to the list on consumables on every service interval?).

The finished engine with TBs would be an animal though!!! Coupled with all the other mods i reckon you'd be able to achieve around 250bhp!!!!
An M3 eater!!!

They wouldn't see you coming!!!!!

Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:32 pm

Andy335Touring wrote:
tim_s wrote:would love to see how fast it would be then though: 2.1, high CR, flowed head, solid lifters and throttle bodies....
That would make a very nice engine

What sort of duration cams can you get for it ?

i think the only cams you can buy of the shelf for an IS are schrick ones

you dont even wona know how much they are

think the lift is around 280 mark iirc

Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:55 pm

think 250bhp is a bit hopeful, i'd realistically hope for m3 sort of performance once its all sorted. to get up to 250bhp i reckon you'd need a big valved head, bigger capacity etc. oh and i'm not planning on being too nutty on cam duration etc. and want a nice driveable motor with decent torque etc as its a daily. its not gonna be geared towards getting impressive numbers.

nice thing is doing that would cost less than having converted to an s14 in it, plus everything will be newly rebuilt etc. admittedly a bit more experimental, but that's all part of the fun.

the project may be broken into two stages:
1) get the bottom end in and sorted, just doing whats necessary to the head, get the car mapped and run it for a while and see how it all goes. this should be finished in a month or two, am a fair way through this atm.

2) take the head off for a proper rework and throttle bodies, allowing me to inspect the bottom end with all the new bits.

if some s50 throttle bodies happen to turn up, though, i might just have to do them while i'm at it. i have to chat to my mate and ask him nicely to do some headwork and mate these up for me. the way i'm inclined at the moment, i can see this happening, am not really holding back on this project. was supposed to be 1.9 or 2 litres, but ended up 2.1, sposed to just put the head straight on, but i'm gonna sort out the inlet cam carrier and change the tappets minimum, may get it flowed etc. am also changing flywheel and timing chain (one on there's fine!) while i'm there.

dan, schrick aren't the only manufacturer of cams for the m42. you can get pretty much whatever cams you want for the m42, piper and kent do regrinds to any spec and are well cheap (Ãƒ”šÃ‚£180), schrick etc make 'em from blanks. so do a load of other companies - actually dbilas do them for a start.
dan, you mean the duration is 280 degrees, not lift. schrick's mild cam is 256 duration, 10.3 lift, factory is 242, 9.7mm. can't remember their other cam specs of the top of my head.
.

Fri Dec 30, 2005 8:56 pm

i meant to mention regrinds

i got a quite from piper once cnt memebr it though

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:00 pm

Manufacturer :

Kent Cams
Category :

Kent Cams - BMW
Sub-category :

318i M42
Application :

Cam - Sports Injection - Ex
Product Code:

KC-BM46-Ex
Details :

Powerband = 2000-6500rpm.
Valve Lift (Inlet/Exhaust) = 10.36mm
Duration (Inlet/Exhaust) = 256 Degrees
Timing (Inlet Open/Close)/(Exhaust Open/Close) = 18/58 58/18
Full Lift (Inlet/Exhaust) = 110/110 Degrees
Valve Clearance = n/a
Price:

Ãƒ”šÃ‚£176.25 inc VAT
Delivery: Ãƒ”šÃ‚£12.00
Quantity:
QUICK CODE: 38A1G

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:01 pm

that is for one though!

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:05 pm

nope, for both. had quotes from piper and kent direct and from my local shop, all of them for the pair, all about the same price. btw no-one sells cams individually, never heard of it (unless for a single-cam'd car!!!).

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:06 pm

chrikey

bargain there then. not to wild either

this is turning into a useful thread!

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:11 pm

lol, feel a bit guilty for the fella who started it though! i spose in a way its what he asked for!
yeah mate, regrinds are the way forward if there's nought wrong with yours. and pretty damn cheap.

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:13 pm

IS cams never wear also

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:28 pm

yeah so people tell me but my inlet cam whirrs like a good'un and i bet you when i have it off its both the carrier and the cam that are shagged.

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:29 pm

will be interesting to see if its both

sure its not anything like the tensioner?

never heard of a worn cam on an is ever!

Fri Dec 30, 2005 9:43 pm

definitely a worn bearing metallic style whirring coming from inlet cam area, and i dunno of any other spinny whirry thing around there! plus the engine's low miles and had a new m44 tensioner in it by me a year or so ago. about 10 years ago when it had the profile gasket repair it had a new chain (about 60,000 miles ago). its not a cam chain noise anyway. i'm 99% its the inlet cam or carrier, won't know for certain until its done though. should really have taken a look but will be better to look at it once everything's out.

Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:53 am

I think this thread will need a section on it's own soon!!

A Tuners Guide to the M42

It's definitely got me wanting to start messing about with mine. I was um-ing and ah-ing about throttle bodies before but i wanna do it now. With this talk of cams and other stuff it makes me wanna have a go with mine and aim for rally spec!!

Any idea how much your engine will have cost by the time it's back in the car tim??

Might as well start budgeting now for it, hehehe!!!

Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:54 am

Tim

i think it would be an idea to list exactly what componenets are needed to convert an m42 block to a 2.1 litre

and what you recommend is used/undertaken on the cylinder head side of things

will certainly come in handy for me next summer!

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:41 am

You bast*rds will soon be known as the "m42 legends", get in there lads!

this thread has my vote for best thread 2005.

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:46 am

Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:22 am

I've got a complete set of throttle bodies with linkages from an E30 M3 if anybody needs them, should be an easy starting point for this conversion, and I think that the E30 M3 engine was as upright as the E36 M42, so should alleviate the need for the CNC angle plate and these have the cut-out for the injector 'firing' angle, also shown is the rubber flange that is used on the E30 M3 S14 engine, and an example adapter for the bolt pattern

Sat Dec 31, 2005 9:30 am

Any idea of the rough port dimensions (height and width)????

They look a bit less oval than the iS ones, if you get what i mean.....

Sat Dec 31, 2005 10:02 am

its likely that the e30 m3 ones will be too spaced out, this is why i've ignored them in the past

Sat Dec 31, 2005 11:20 am

In other M42 4 pot rightness news, i've just got some m20 rods.
M42 rod (left) versus M20 (right):

Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:09 pm

Foookin 'el!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That M20 one looks a bit serious!!! And they'd fit in an M42 you say??!! Although heavier whats the strength advantage over standard??

I take it they're the same length so they don't change the stroke at all??

(my thirst for knowlege grows with every post you submit tim! hehe)

Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:44 pm

oh my god, wher have i been all this time,, i started the thread,, then zona shut,, and just cuaght up.... god daymmmn you guys know alot.

some of this stuff looks crazy...

wats a easy achievable mod,

what other m42 engines are there? am i right in assuming u can move m42 to m42 from different generations easily? what engine is the later e36 318is the 1.9 version engine is it? can things from there be used easily??

if theres any straight swap stuff,??? i can do that easily??

anything more advance,,, how much would a garage charge as well as parts?

im getting quite excited on my hunt for a 318is

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:08 pm

yeah they're a bit hefty aren't they!
but atually in profile they actually are weaker than the m42 ones...

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:27 pm

tim_s wrote:yeah they're a bit hefty aren't they!
i was looking into them for my project as shorter rods would mean i wouldn't have to deck the pistons with the longer stroke. btw just rods won't change the stroke though fella, just the deck clearance and rod-stroke ratio. don't mean to patronise, i'm sure you knew this really!

To be really honest i've heard various things about changing the stroke of an engine to increase capacity but don't fully understand how it all works!!

Obviously increasing the bore will increase CC's but i've never had a good explaination os 'stroking' an engine...(ooer!!)

In fact i think i've just realised

(i've never given it that much thought before now, just heard what people were saying)

It must be the throw of the crank, right.

So to use the same block, head and pistons with a longer throw crank you'd need shorter rods? The piston moves further, therfore sucking more mixture into the cylinder to be compressed.

(sometimes i impress myself!!!

)

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:30 pm

dark_sounds wrote: im getting quite excited on my hunt for a 318is

By the time you've got an iS you'll have all the info you need to turn it into a fire breathing monster (well make it quicker than standard anyway!! hehe)

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:34 pm

Must go now, gotta head back to Brize where i have no internet access

. Won't be back for a couple of weeks, so i'll be looking forward to any developments on this thread!!

Happy New Year everyone, have a good 'un!!!

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:39 pm

no internet access fella, why?

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:51 pm

I live in a barrack block on base (i'm in the RAF). It'll cost me to have a phone line put in and i'd have to leave it behind as and when i move. So i see it as pointless because i'm back home virtually every weekend etc.

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:57 pm

fire breathing,,, RARRRRRR!

Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:58 pm

That's understandable. Stop by when you can though.

Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:01 pm

see ya fella! have a good new year. i wanna see the throttle bodies project coming along next time we hear from ya!

and various answers to qs!
tommy, you're spot on about stroke
dan:
my engine will not be straightforward, the crank's gonna need the nose machined to fit the m42 pulleys, the pulleys themselves will need a bit of work, and the crank will need a new bolt (bmw don't make one the right dia long enough). don't know what rods i'm gonna use, how much i will deck pistons etc to get the CR i want. rods and pistons are a pita to get right too. when done it will not just be bigger displacement, but less rotating mass (by lighter pistons etc) and higher CR. in hindsight 1.9 or 2l would have been sufficient and cheaper, but i fancied more of a challenge.

dark_sounds
m44 = 1.9l e36 engine, not m42. changes described a bit in this thread i think. would be the easiest 'straight swap' into an e30 m42 for capacity increase.

Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:19 pm

tim i think s50 rods would be a better idea

m20 rods are nearly twice as heavy and a lot bigger than m/s50 rods iirc

are you sure m20 ones oculd be used in the m42 lump? they look tonk!

Sat Dec 31, 2005 2:39 pm

welll here u got guys some info on the S42!! lump my god wat a animal!!
The S42 engine was a 2.0L touring car engine with a 86.5mm bore and around a 85mm stroke, which shared the same block as the street going M42. Unlike the common M42, the S42 had a more sophisticated engine management system, and had individual throttle bodies. The S42 unfortunately did not share the same valvetrain as the M42, and is a solid lifter valvetrain (possibily from the S50Euro) fully capable of over 9000rpm, but was limited to a 8500rpm redline, as dictated by touring car rules. It was mounted upright in the bay, not slanted, and ran on a full dry sump oiling system. The pistons had a static compression ratio of around 12:1, and running on pump gas, the S42 made around 280hp (and up to around 310hp later in it's life).