Convertible Windows

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FinalD
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Post Sun Jan 27, 2013 5:58 pm

Fronts are really simple

1) Whip off the door card
by removing the 3x screws, one behind the electric mirror switch/blanker, two in the underside of the arm rest and then undo the push clips along the sides and bottom (ideally use an angled tool, I have a Y shaped tool that allows me to prise them without snapping them). Once you've removed the securing bits, lift the card off.

2)
Carefully remove the plastic film (or you can just be naughty and poke a few holes through for the 10mm socket to get to the bolts)

3)
For the height when it stops at the top, slacken off the silver bolt with a huge washer on/just above the motor (B / left bolt on it's own, on the photo at the bottom of this link http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ont_window). Moving the bolt down allows the window to go higher, up makes it lower.

4)
For the horizontal alignment there are two bolts (A / pair of bolts, on the photo at the bottom of this link http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ont_window), slacken them off, move the bar they screw into about and see how it adjusts the window.


I might do a photo filled write up so others can see, but it is quite simple. I will try to do a photo filled write up of adjusting the rears which I'll hopefully do tomorrow or Tuesday. :)
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Post Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:03 pm

Cheers Matey. I'll have a good look at that tomorrow on my PC.

I've got to do this bit was a bit embarrassing when I took it to the local hand wash place and got
Sprayed on the side of my head because of the small gap!! Pretended not to notice the cold water running down my neck! :D
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PONY, 2013 - "Anyway span 360 degrees hitting the kerb and giving the old man two fingers as I was spinning like Michael Schumacher would
FinalD
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:38 pm

Really helpful guide here:
http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ont_window

Unfortunately it doesn't really describe much, just has a barely legible bit of text below a diagram of the location of bolts.

This is my p1ss poor guide on how to do it!

This guide is for the passenger side but equally applies for the driver side, apart from the horseshoe release.

First things first, tools you'll need:
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Normal flat blade would be fine. You'll also need a Philips head, not pictured (forgot :P)

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10mm socket

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13mm socket


1) Put the hood down.

2) Remove the handle surround on the horse shoe release handle.

3) Stick the flat blade screwdriver (or fork thing I use) behind the speaker grill along the TOP edge. Gently pry the grill away from the door card, it'll pop off.

4) Removing the door card firstly requires undoing the two black screws (circled red).

Image


Now we need to remove the rear door card, not the simplest of things with everything else in place.
Easiest way is to pop the rear bench out for more access, open the door and remove the vertical door seal.
With these out you can now remove the door car out of the way by gently pushing it up at the top/tweaking it at the bottom and pushing up. The seat belt is still in the way but the card can be placed mostly out of the way.

5) Put both front and rear windows up.

6) Close the door, check the gap between windows.

7) Adjust the parallel fit (red circled - 10mm). This mostly seems to pull the window away from the front/rear of the car. Once you're happy with that, next step.

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8 ) Adjust the horizontal fit (blue circled - 13mm). This seems to be the main one I needed, it adjusts it inside/out of the car as it were. Once you're happy and it is perfect, next up.

Image


9) Roof down test.
Might seem minor but it is an important step, make sure that the front window works fine still and lines up when going up/down and do the same for the rear one. Also make sure to (with both windows up) open and close the door.
You may find at this stage that you've adjusted the window too far towards the other and so it doesn't actually fit flush, back to step 7/8 for you.

10) Roof up test.
This may well seem like a silly and pointless thing to do, trust me, it isn't. Before putting the door card back on, drop windows, put the roof up (lock into place) and put the windows up. Make sure that you have no gap and the windows are flush with each other and sit correctly in/on their seals. If you're happy with the fit etc. you're done, if not, back to steps 7 & 8. If you think you've done all of the adjustments you can on the rears, you need to redo the fronts.








I discovered at step 10 that something is just totally not bleddy right with my car's windows/roof. I got the windows set up spot on with the roof down but when the roof is up I still have a gap which I've sussed to being due to the window seals along the roof edge. In the below picture you can see the rear window in its seal, the door window shuts against the seal at the top just below the roof line which keeps it away from the rear window. This says I probably need to adjust the front window's stop height. Nuts.

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I'll do a write up for the fronts and for the driver side too, both with more pictures etc. to truly walk people through how to do this.


I'd also like to note, don't be ham-fisted with the horse shoe release...
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Fek.

11) Go inside and sulk and watch some TV.
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:51 pm

Fantastic work and detailed how to do. Thank you FinalD!! :clap:

Looking forward to the front set up. :D
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FinalD
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:59 pm

No worries, it's down to the basics, fully step-by-step guides that are needed for jobs like this really. Shows just how simple the things are to do and can guide anyone though, even if they are unsure which end of a screwdriver is which. :P

I'll try to do pics of every stage with the front and driver side ones. My camera (well the flash gun) was playing up which is part of the reason for there not being a pic at every step. :)

It'll be interesting to see if I can adjust the buggers to fit flush with each other once the roof is up actually, but that's a job for tomorrow, irritated now.
I *think* the horse shoe release was broken anyway before I even got the car. Still works but due to the spring being in there the handle sticks out a little and is only going to get worse. :(
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:33 pm

FinalD wrote:Really helpful guide here:
http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ont_window
The rears are covered here: http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ar_windows

I think you missed the lower adjuster that changes the angle of the window.

Maybe Grr or Kedge could combine your write up with that.

Ben
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:49 pm

Those are the bolts I circled for steps 7 & 8. :P

Mine don't appear to be star driven lock nuts though? The top two (that I circled in red) were 10mm hex bolts and once slackened off can be moved up and down with their nut which seems to allow for adjustment. The bottom two I recall are standard 13mm hex nuts and go onto standard bolts. I've had the whole window and regulator unit out on both sides and the only none standard bolt was one in the middle that bolts through the glass and onto the regulator.

The issue I have it seems is that whilst the windows are perfect with the hood down, with it up the rear sits in a seal at the top and the front sits outside the same seal at the top.

You can see the rear window is inside the seal here:
Image


But the front window is outside the seal when at the top (hard to see in this pic):
Image



Tomorrow I'll get some better pictures to show what I mean, including with the roof down and the windows lined up perfectly as well as with the roof up and them not lining up properly. I'll also sort some better pics of the adjustment bolts, closer up etc. :)


In fact, epic camera...cropped the pic of the bolts:

Image


Top is a 10mm bolt and the bottom is a hollow threaded bar with a 13mm nut on it, as far as I know there is no star drive within there (but I'll check tomorrow).
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:01 pm

FinalD wrote:Those are the bolts I circled for steps 7 & 8. :P
I don't think so.

It is one bolt right near the bottom. Next to the rear seat belt anchor point.

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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:03 pm

FinalD wrote: The top two (that I circled in red) were 10mm hex bolts and once slackened off can be moved up and down with their nut which seems to allow for adjustment. The bottom two I recall are standard 13mm hex nuts and go onto standard bolts.
Top two do the height of the window.

Next two down move it in and out.

Very bottom one that you have missed does the angle. Ie. moves the top of the window in and out when it is up.

Ben
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:11 pm

Ahhh gotchaI read it as you meaning the top 4 is all. :)

The top going in and out shouldn't matter though, as it appears to be an issue between the rear being in the seal and the front being outside the seal. It's hard to explain without pics and I'm not heading outside again tonight so I might grab some in the morning if I have time, if not I'll get them tomorrow evening.

I need to fully inspect the way in which both windows run to the top seal and so how they are sitting with it.

Unless of course the windows is WAY out of line and is running too much towards/into the car, but it appears to be running the roof seal properly. As I say, will check properly and report back tomorrow. :)

I was hoping someone like you would come along though and inform where I'd missed things. Didn't find the rear adjustment link before, certainly much more helpful than the small pic from the link about fronts. Cheers.
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:14 pm

The roof seal is quite flexible.

I think you need to adjust the top out to line up with the front window. The rear seal will flex with it.

Ben
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:16 pm

It is odd as with the roof down they sit perfectly in line with each other now (front window sits agains the 'B pillar' seal on the rear window), which got me all excited until I put the roof up and checked. :( :P
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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:22 pm

It may be possible to adjust the angle of the back of the front window slightly by moving the bottom of the rear guide in the door.

I don't know this for sure, sorry.

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Post Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:24 pm

willnz wrote:The cab is a '93 so BMW might have changed the type of fixings/adjustments from the earlier ones.
My 88 cab is the same.

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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:37 pm

Well I'm at the point of "fek it" for the moment with the windows to be honest, car is also throwing other problems at me which are much more important and even more retarded.


Image

Image


Perfect, no?



Image

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No. Grrrrrrrr
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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:43 pm

(Using Homer Simpsons voice) "get it don't. We don't like quitters" :D Come on, you know you can do it with a little bit more fiddling. Are all the door cards off? Is so, how about having the roof up, windows up (correctly aligned within the seals) and then make the adjustments , tightening things fully and see how this works?


Working from the inside of the car.
:D
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PONY, 2013 - "Anyway span 360 degrees hitting the kerb and giving the old man two fingers as I was spinning like Michael Schumacher would
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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:51 pm

The problem with the windows is that the rear window runs inside a seal but the front one sits outside of the seal, no matter what adjustments I make (aside from having the stop height really low so letting water in at the top), I'll have that gap.

I want it MOTed on Sat, that is more important than fannying around with the windows. As it stands though it is going to fail because it is being a twunt. :x
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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:42 pm

Haha. I've got an electric hood and I kid you not it took me several months to get it working again. Even then I had to leave it because it started sticking again. Once the weather is better, I'm going to crack that bastard!!
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PONY, 2013 - "Anyway span 360 degrees hitting the kerb and giving the old man two fingers as I was spinning like Michael Schumacher would
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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:43 pm

I fixed my electrical issues today (woo) so I can now go back to focusing on these buggers. I'll need to get them sorted before mid/end Feb as from then onwards it'll have to live outside and not in a garage which means...wet bum if I don't fix it. :D
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Post Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:45 pm

I hope you do, as I'm depending on you for the instructions! :D
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Post Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:34 pm

Proper document in the wiki here:
http://www.e30zone.net/e30zonewiki/inde ... ont_window



This is my p1ss poor guide on how to adjust the front windows!

This guide is for the passenger side but equally applies for the driver side, apart from you have to unplug the elec. mirror switch on driver side.

First things first, tools you'll need:
Image

10mm socket
13mm socket (actually that's for the rears only)
Flat blade screw driver / forky trim pry tool thingy
Cross head / Phillips screwdriver


1 ) Right, now you've got your tools ready you need the next important thing...

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A DOOR, YAAAAAY



2 ) Carefully remove the handle surround (push it to the left)
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3 ) Carefully pry out the mirror switch blank plate in the grab handle (You may want a really small flat blade for this)
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4 ) Grab your trusty cross head screw driver and remove the screw behind the blanking plate
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5 ) Keep hold of the screw driver and remove the left screw in the arm rest (blatantly has to be done in this order, honest)
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6 ) Now that the left one is done you can do the right one (Seriously I'm not messing around, they must be done in this order...)
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7 ) Push the handle towards the front of the door about 1inch, lever it towards you and away it comes
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8 ) Now this is where the forky tool comes into its own. Pry the pop clips out from the door. Start at the top (left or right) and work your way down and around to the other side
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9 ) With all of the clips undone you can simply lift the door card from the door
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10 ) Carefully peel back the plastic shitty sheet
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11 ) You can either fully remove it or just peel it back half way (oooeerrr missus)
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Right so that's how to remove the door card in 11 steps. :D


12 ) Quite an important step this one. Lower the window, I've been helpful and taken a picture of how to do this...with a perfect choice of finger too...
Image




Actual Window Adjustment


Height Adjustment

If the window is going up too high you'll need to adjust this 10mm bolt
Image


To adjust the stop height you need to slacken off the bolt (try to only just make it loose enough to move up and down, not too slack), once you've done that you have two directions to go in, up and down. This is where it gets odd/illogical.

UP - Makes the window stop LOWER
DOWN - Makes the window stop HIGHER

It'll take some trial and error and you'll probably get annoyed with it. You'll find that moving the stop thing by only a few mm can make a huge difference to how high/low the window stops. You'll get there in the end though and it is quite satisfying when you test shut the door and it is perfect against the seal.


Horizontal/Parallel Adjustment

If the window is on the p1ss you'll need to adjust it using these two 10mm bolts
Image

Image


Unlike earlier with the height one, you can slacken the both of these off until they are loose and allow for play. These only have a small range of adjustment really in comparison to the height.
I found the easiest way to adjust this is to have the window up, slacken off both nuts and wiggle the window so it is parallel then tighten them back up.
You may find that having both quite loose means that you can't get it right, if that is the case then do one up finger tight, then slacken it off around half a turn, so it can move but isn't loose. Now you should be able to adjust the other bolt's position to give you a better idea as to where/how the window is sitting. Obviously if it isn't quite right, tighten up the one you have adjusted, slack off by a quarter or so and undo the other. Now you should be able to get it to line up nicely.




Refitting is the reverse of removal basically.

1 ) Carefully reattach the plastic shitty sheet (or apply a new one if you're changing it).
2 ) Slot the door card onto the hooks at the top of the door and carefully locate the pop clips into position then give the door card at each one a gentle thump with your hand to pop them into place.
3 ) Insert the hook of the grab handle into the door pocket slot, lean it upwards and then push the top of the handle into the hole in the door card and push the whole thing to the rear of the door.
4 ) Refit the screws and blanking plate.
5 ) Refit the door handle surround.







Hope that is helpful to people and if anything is incorrect, please tell me. :D
FinalD
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Post Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:45 pm

When playing today I found out that the guys were right about the threaded bar being hollow and being torx. This does indeed allow for angle adjustment.


I realised (thanks to my brother pointing it out) that I was never going to get my windows to sit together properly.

Image


If you look at the seal at the top of the door window, half of it is 'smooth' and half is 'dented'. This was stopping the window from being able to butt up against the B pillar seal. The reason is simple, on BOTH sides someone (not me, never touched the roof) had fitted the 'front' seal the wrong way round. I slid them out, slotted them back in having turned them 180 degrees and now they look like below.


Image



Sorry for the shit picture, the flash gun appears to be dying. Now both parts of the seal have 'dents' and the window sits perfectly against every single seal it needs to (top, front, rear, bottom).
The issue was the same on the drivers side (although I did need to drop the window height a touch).
I also found out that someone had rounded the torx internal on the lower adjustment bolt for the drivers side rear window, this means I can't get it to quite sit flush at the top of the window along the B pillar with the front door window. :(
Still, it is now such a small gap I can ignore it for the moment.
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Post Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:37 am

:D Thank you!
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PONY, 2013 - "Anyway span 360 degrees hitting the kerb and giving the old man two fingers as I was spinning like Michael Schumacher would