318iS/325i Realistic Max Power?

[NIX]

Hi all,

Any idea of what sort of 'max power' you could get from a tuned 318iS engine or a late 325i, but without having to change the running gear should such an engine swap be done and what kind of mods and cash would be required?? - I currently have an F reg 318i and am swapping the running gear from an iS-including poly bushes to replace rubbers, anti roll bars and rear discs . I eventually (probably a while yet to be honest) want a bigger engine once the handling and bodywork are sweet, just don't like the thought of changing the running gear again (especially with all the poly bushes in plus I'll probably uprate the brakes, have already changed the front discs) hence why I'm thinkin about the above engines. Saying that, if I'm gonna do a transplant I want one thats gonna be worthwhile.

Any suggestions?

Cheers!

[Brianmoooore]

Clue's in the forum title really.
To get serious power gains from any of the standard E30 engines takes serious money. Easier and cheaper to go either the well documented M30 or M50/S50 route, or to look into forced induction.

[NIX]

Would I have to change the running gear with those engine swaps? Those are 5 series engines right?

What sort of 0-60 times could I expect from a tuned 318iS or 325i and what bhp would they be running at?

Similarly what would be the figures for the engines you suggested?

Sorry for all the questions but I'm not 100% clued up on the technical side of things. Did my degree in car design but concentratin on aesthetics, so I know how to make a car look good but could do with some more knowledge on how they run and more importantly making them run quicker!!

Cheers!

[Brianmoooore]

Only changes you would have to make to the running gear (over standard 325 or iS stuff) is a change of diff if you use the matching gearbox with the M50/S50, as these have a 1:1 5th gear instead of the E30s, and the 318 front springs would need upgrading for the heavier engines.
M50/S50 engine is used throughout the BMW range, including the E36 3 series. Power output from the lowliest 2.5 M50 is 192 bhp, but if you can get hold of one of the S50 series M Power units then they give considerably more!

[NIX]

Thanks for the info mate!! Much appreciated!

With that in mind I can carry on changing the running gear and bushes without having to think that I might have to change it all over again. Definetely more motivating when you look at it like that.

My car is currentley riding on Bilstein shocks (only the streetline kit tho) with Pi springs for a 60mm drop. Obviously that will have to go once the heavier engine goes in but atleast the car looks nice and low for the mean time. Not the best option for handling due to the little amount of compresion available within the springs but hey...

I'll look into the engines you were talking about but as I said funding for a transplant is not gonna be available for a WHILE but in the mean time I can prepare the car atleast ready for a new engine+loom, gearbox, diff and exhaust to go on. I just hope my current engine last till then

Cheers dude!

[NIX]

Do you know anyone in particular who would do such a transplant i.e. took my car to him and said; right here's some cash please can you source the parts, put them on and turn my 318i into a something just a tad special

How much do you think it would cost? Ideally I wouldn't mind doing some of it myself but I know I'm not gonna have the time nor the knowledge. Also do you think it would be better to source the parts myself? Is there a trustworthy place or guy that specifically does this sort of stuff?

Cheers!

[chu346]

Parkside in Nottingham do the M50 conversions.

If I was you i'd love to do a M30 (3.5) swap.

[NIX]

Yeah a 3.5 would be sweet. Have heard about those conversions. Would I need to change the running gear for that?

[NIX]

Just been findin out some more about the M30 3.5 engine. Think its gonna be the way to go

But I'm guessin the handlin is gonna be a bit a pig?

[Zayyan]

Just been findin out some more about the M30 3.5 engine. Think its gonna be the way to go

But I'm guessin the handlin is gonna be a bit a pig?

The M30 is about 25kg heavier than an M20 so it'll be a little compromised.

I haven't seen any of the 3.5ers complaining though, especially considering it makes the rear end even lighter

[Kos]

you gota sit and think what do you want from the car. 3.5 is a lot of fun, m50/52 you could compare to a tuned m20 2.5/2.7 ot build a screamer of or m42 is engine!!

[M5pilot]

you gota sit and think what do you want from the car.

Excellent advice!!

Just to go further on this point you have to know what kind of power delivery you want. Do you want lots of bottom end torque or do you want all your power top end?

If you dont know, get down to some meets and take a test drive in some 2.7's, turbo's and 335i's and that will help you.

[NIX]

Cheers guys!

Really appreciate the advice! What I want is tasty acceleration, top end would be nice too but a lot more bothered about acceleration.

At the same time I also want sweet handling. I'm envious of a couple of my mates when taking bends in their little jap cars (MR2 MK1 and CRX Vtec) they just seem to stick as if they're on rails. My cars a lot nicer now I've got the poly bushes but obviously its a bigger car so I'm guessin thats why there would still be more roll/weight transfer compared to a little jap car.

What do think? I'd still like to be able to use it as a daily driver but that really depends on how much the transplant will be. If its enough for me to afford this year or next then my e30 will still be my only car I reckon.

I'll try and make it down to Ace Cafe sometime in the New Year and see what others have done.

Cheers!!!!

[Dan318-is]

if you mount the m30 in position 3 right by the bulkhead the weight difference is allegedly unnotcable. an extra 25 kilos the m30 may be, but thats what a small person? its not really that much weight if you think about it

i mean when you go out with a mate in the front and rag it, do you really really notice that much difference? 30 kilos on a road car, unless your an insane driver, would not make that much difference imho

if you want acceleration then you should go for torque i think

que m30 turbo

[jaistanley]

The trouble with the extra weight is that is is right at the front, and quite high up.

The extra weight above the car's centre of gravity adds to the systems roll acceleration and the weight forward of the front wheels will unbalance the car, basically leading into understeer. You can compensate by increasing the car's roll stiffness with springs and arb's but again the lower compliance is gonna make it understeer a bit more. Plus the weight of the engine is gonna make the steering response feel a bit more 'heavy' or sluggish.

I've been looking at engine swaps to do to my 318is but I'm having trouble justifying handling compromises. With the M3 running gear the steering is so direct and controllable, I dont want to loose the feel.

You're right to think about what you want from a car. The big engines have the real benefit of low down guts. Torque like that makes driving sooooo easy. Foot down in any gear and it'll pull like a train.

I reccon you need to buy a nice 325i se and an lsd and swap your good bits to it. Wouldn't take too long and is an easy way for you to do this yourself without the intervention of an unknown mechanic..

Just my tuppence.

Jai

[weegaz22]

I've been looking at engine swaps to do to my 318is but I'm having trouble justifying handling compromises. With the M3 running gear the steering is so direct and controllable, I dont want to loose the feel.
Jai

why not turbo your 318is then? wont add that much weight to the car, give you more power, and turn heads making people wonder whats under the bonnet

[Jhonno]

a company in europe has had 300bhp out of the m42...

but for the cost you'd be better off with an s14 imo

if you go for an m50/m30 etc there are ways to drop some weight from the front end to bring it nearer to m20 weight..

[Royalratch]

Just wanted to revive an old thread rather than start a new one.

I want a bit more power from my stock M42. No forced induction or internal tweaks so that leaves re-mapping.

The questions are:

1) How much for a professional re-map (not just new chip)?
2) What kind of power can this achieve on an M42?
3) Does this shorten engine life / stress the engine too much?
4) How does it affect fuel consumption?
5) Who is a solid place to do this?

I don't want to achieve anything more than a bit more lower end torque and more power to pull a Touring load of people and gear around European motorways.
Cheers guys.

[oldroydsr4]

personall, i go for a 2.8 (think m52) ,using an m50 inlet manifold and bbtb.

look at the results of the e36 compact (other bmw chat section)

if i hadn't gone down the turbo route.............

[Kos]

Just wanted to revive an old thread rather than start a new one.

I want a bit more power from my stock M42. No forced induction or internal tweaks so that leaves re-mapping.

The questions are:

1) How much for a professional re-map (not just new chip)?
2) What kind of power can this achieve on an M42?
3) Does this shorten engine life / stress the engine too much?
4) How does it affect fuel consumption?
5) Who is a solid place to do this?

I don't want to achieve anything more than a bit more lower end torque and more power to pull a Touring load of people and gear around European motorways.
Cheers guys.

chipped uk did my IS

power 162 bhp
torque 149 ft/lb
fuel economy improoved
no reliability probs, justa s long as you maintaine your engine properly
cost was £150 , e30 zone discount i negotiated ages ago

[Royalratch]

I asked specific questions about the M42, so answers to those would be useful.

[Kos]

dont be so ungrateful you nob end, i dont see any one else helping you out

it was carried out by chipped uk, and was a proper re-map, cost will be £150 if the discount i set up ages ago still counts, power went up to 162 bhp and 149 ft/lb of torque. life span of an engine entirly depends on how its used. all tye remap does is adjust your timing/fueling to gain the maximum SAFELY from your engine, rev limiter is increased bu 500 rpm to make the most of the extra power available,my fuel consumption was much better after the re-map, and again i'll mention that it was done by chipped UK

the car was very much improved, accelaration to 60 mph was easily on par with a 325i, would cruise comfortably at 100mph 4 up, changing down a gear to over take wasnt needed when before it was

happy ??

[Royalratch]

Perfect.

Wasn't being ungrateful, just trying didn't want a debate on what other engines to use.

Got a contact at Chipped UK?

[Kos]

pm on its way

[Kedge]

Kos is that deal still in place? If so i think i'll get mine done to tide me over untill i'm full prepared for an M50 swap.

[Kos]

Kos is that deal still in place? If so i think i'll get mine done to tide me over untill i'm full prepared for an M50 swap.

not sure mate, i think it will if a few of you organise to go one day and get it done it will be available