S14 Guru's !

[e30topless]

ok so bear with me here..

I am in the middle of a M3 restoration for a client .. see here...

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... 60&start=0

and I am now collecting oily bits,
the owner wants a fast but usable car nothing too lairy
I have located a fully re-built 2.5 S14 bare block and head it has Evo2 cams and 47mm throttle bodies.. I'm assuming the 2.3 injectors can be used?
Also intending on running the already bought Alpha N and Carbon airbox
can anybody shed some light on what other upgrades maybe needed to get the most out of this apart from the obvious re-map ?

[Mikey_Boy]

Blimey - a wishlist!!

Not sure about the injectors....
Would suggest lightening the flywheel and use a standard clutch for throttle response..
You MAY need a new crank damper - when I removed mine it was a touch cabbaged - I will update my thread soon and show what the problem is for reference.
New oil pump for sure - depending on what the owner wants to do with the car, you may want to consider the 'basic' baffles for the standard sump.
I would strongly suggest getting the 'rally manifold' (with 50mm primaries) as that adds a whole truckload of torque and power..
Again, depending on how hard the owner wants to rev the car, ARP rod bolts may be in order?
Otherwise, it sounds like a lovely starting point for your restoration (and reading your thread, makes my track slag throw together look a bit amateurish!!)

HTH - given my relative inexperience with S14s, no doubt I am going to be shot down in flames pretty soon!!

Cheers,
Mike

[e30topless]

Cheers Mike,
you may recall this car when you called over for the Aircon pump Bracket ?

it already has a 50mm Manifold and the oil pump was replaced on the 2.5 when it was rebuilt along with ARP bolts/new mains/Pistons ect so I really don't have to touch the internals thankfully
Lightened Flywheel sounds like a really good idea and I think i had better check the Crank Damper !
I want to try get the best from this build without "buying twice" as you know nothing is cheap for these things...

when it comes to S14's i try steer away from them, they scare me a bit so any info/input is Mucho appreciated !

[Demlotcrew]

With that setup the stock injectors wont be a problem at all!

Evo II cams are pretty tame and are nothing special, the same what was fitted to 215 M3, i have a box full of them here;



BMW never made 47mm throttles, there are only four different kinds, S14b20 46mm, Early 195 46mm, Evo II 46mm-48mm (from the direction of flow) and 215/SE 48mm. Unfortunately 46mm throttles are worthless at $250 per set where as the 48's and Evo II's go for anything over $1800+ and if you have 46mm, these combined with Evo II cams will serve a severe restriction on power for such a large displacement engine.

Sport Evolution high pressure pumps are no longer available and I can see new ones exchanging for $700+ soon! Does the block have piston oil jets? If it does you must run a higher pressure pump, i hope you have the SE pump!

Or best be quick, these are the last three available! They were only £170 two years ago!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-M3-E30-or ... 500wt_1305

Lighter flywheel is a good idea, if the customer can stretch it go for an SE one or a VAC Ali one, both are very good!

Crank dampers dont normally fail on these engines and if you need one, there are plenty on US ebay for very little money.

I would never advise anyone to run one of these solid ali copies sold on many sites! The stock dampers are second stage harmonic's and are needed for our buzzy engines.

Do you have the fitting kit and filter snorkel with the Carbon Airbox kit?

Andrew

[e30topless]

Interesting stuff !
the throttles must be 48's because they are bigger than the one's on the 2.3..
is keeping the Evo cams a bit silly ? last thing I want is the tickover to be compromised by a lumpy engine !
I'm not sure about piston oil jets and again the pump was replaced during it's build but I have no idea on the type, taking the sump off while it's on the engine stand and checking might be a good idea

I have the fitting kit fro the airbox but not a filter I read on S14.net that a filter is available Piper i think ?

good news that the injectors are up to the job.. Cheers Andrew

[Mikey_Boy]

Hello again - I thought that car looked familiar!! Looking fabulous now...

From what little I know, Andrew is absolutely right - crank dampers don't fail as such - what I found with mine was that the crank bolt wasn't done up tight enough so it had fretted around the crank nose a bit. Solid crank dampers are useless...! With luck yours will be just fine...

Also - don't worry too much about the idle quality - I have seen cars with much wilder cams than Evo cams idling a treat...

[Mikey_Boy]

Forgot to mention - the filter for the carbon airbox is a K&N item...

[Demlotcrew]

Hello again - I thought that car looked familiar!! Looking fabulous now...

From what little I know, Andrew is absolutely right - crank dampers don't fail as such - what I found with mine was that the crank bolt wasn't done up tight enough so it had fretted around the crank nose a bit. Solid crank dampers are useless...! With luck yours will be just fine...

Also - don't worry too much about the idle quality - I have seen cars with much wilder cams than Evo cams idling a treat...

Crank bold? If its a bolt, then you have a 2.5l crank, but looking at your photos its 100% a nut.

Is there damage to the crank then?

Andrew

[Mikey_Boy]

Sorry - finger trouble!! Crank nut... Mines a 2.3..

Just a bit of a nibble on the woodruff key and slot in the crank damper...

Updates in my thread to come soon detailing that once I have got over the financial shock of today's adventure...

[e21Jason]

If that is the engien you got from Gordon it was built by Alex Elliot to ACS S3 spec so i doubt you need to do any thing internally.


Just got to decided if you want an after market ecu or get a Dastek

Jason

[e30topless]

it is Gordon's engine Jason and lovely it is too i don't intend on doing anything internally he also supplied me with 3 chips, one that matches it perfect,
starting to wonder if the Alpha N is worthy or should i go unichip ?

oh and many thanks for the filler neck via Colin

[Dan320is]

The Unichip will be more versatile as the timing can be adjusted, from what I can remember.

You can only go so far with the Alpha N before needing to adjust the timing, depending how mild/wild the engine is.

That's the extent of my knowledge anyway. Give Paul Sheppard a buzz on 07977 166006. He's a great help.

[Mikey_Boy]

With that setup the stock injectors wont be a problem at all!

Evo II cams are pretty tame and are nothing special, the same what was fitted to 215 M3, i have a box full of them here;



BMW never made 47mm throttles, there are only four different kinds, S14b20 46mm, Early 195 46mm, Evo II 46mm-48mm (from the direction of flow) and 215/SE 48mm. Unfortunately 46mm throttles are worthless at $250 per set where as the 48's and Evo II's go for anything over $1800+ and if you have 46mm, these combined with Evo II cams will serve a severe restriction on power for such a large displacement engine.

Sport Evolution high pressure pumps are no longer available and I can see new ones exchanging for $700+ soon! Does the block have piston oil jets? If it does you must run a higher pressure pump, i hope you have the SE pump!

Or best be quick, these are the last three available! They were only £170 two years ago!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-M3-E30-or ... 500wt_1305

Lighter flywheel is a good idea, if the customer can stretch it go for an SE one or a VAC Ali one, both are very good!

Crank dampers dont normally fail on these engines and if you need one, there are plenty on US ebay for very little money.

I would never advise anyone to run one of these solid ali copies sold on many sites! The stock dampers are second stage harmonic's and are needed for our buzzy engines.

Do you have the fitting kit and filter snorkel with the Carbon Airbox kit?

Andrew

Sorry to hijack the thread - those cams pictured above are 264 degree cams?? Been reading a lot about cam to piston clearance problems, but want something a bit more lairy in mine if possible - thinking a 276 inlet and 264 exhaust to work with the standard CR?? What is the standard cam timing? 106 degrees on each? Any advice is much appreciated...!

Cheers,
Mike

[Demlotcrew]

Mike,

Im running Schrick 284/276 with a GrpN head gasket and i have no piston to valve clearance issues.

I have two sets of BMW motorsport Cams to go on with a set of GrpA pistons when i have some more time and cash, so the Schricks might be up for sale

[e30topless]

had a bit of time to do some measuring and working out the way forward this week...

Andrew you were right they are 48mm TB's, also trial fitted the Carbon box (also 48mm thank god it matches !) this fouls the Dipstick ...
what have you guys done to overcome this ?



i think this will probably suck up a few small children/pets ect

[Demlotcrew]

Looking good!

You have to rotate the dipstick tube 180deg and bend it so you can get to the dipstick it self via cylinders one and two. The strap won't be used anymore and make sure you locktite the tube in to
The block.

You also need to have the lower sump off to do this, as I've had fettled turds before where the dipstick it self rested on the upper splash pan if not aligned correctly!

Andrew

[ShepsEvo3]

The Unichip will be more versatile as the timing can be adjusted, from what I can remember.

You can only go so far with the Alpha N before needing to adjust the timing, depending how mild/wild the engine is.

That's the extent of my knowledge anyway. Give Paul Sheppard a buzz on 07977 166006. He's a great help.

Thanks mate.. my number has changed to 07976 152026, but will be changed back to the original number in a couple of weeks

Everything you said above is true.. although if larger injectors are fitted or a hike in fuel pressure can mean problems with just running Alpha N. You would also need an Eprom with modified ignition timing. If you have stock injectors and fuel pressure, it's not so much of a problem. But more to be gained from the igntion being live mapped aswell as the fuel ;)

Paul.