E30 crash tests? does anybody know how safe our cars are?

[SCOTT325SE]

Renaults now have plastic front wings. ok, they never rust, but its all because of richys point of pedestria safety. i may be the only one here, but when i buy a car and IF i think about its safety.... I DONT GIVE A FLYING FUCK about the pedestrian when im buying the car - i buy the car for me and my own ass and the asses of my passengers! THATS why i buy a car - for the people i carry in the car, not the people im trying to advoid in the first place!

Bloody rules and regulations gone mad!

[Ziggy]

I like the old idea - stick a spike on everyone's steering wheel instead of an airbag. There'd be no blimmin crashes then cos everyone'd be so damn scared!

A bit excessive admittedly, but the point remains; you *should* be aware of the danger & huge amounts of passive safety don't help that. I'm not saying we should all be driving round in pintos, but less 'safe' cars may actually be 'safer' in the long run!

That said, I reckon e30s are pretty good for their age, though I've not yet tried it out (touch wood!). Did you know that airbags were an option on later ones? Interesting that I don't know of anyone here who's tried to retrofit one, but there's plenty of cruse-control / OBC etc...

[SCOTT325SE]

TOTALLY agree with you Jon. I drove like a total cnut in my 03 "safe" clio. Then i nearly rolled it... then i slowed down for a week, then bought my first e30. yay! in an e30 i only drive fast and hard, never like a cnut.

[JOSEMI]

agree,
while the E30 its a fairly old car on its own, somehow thousands of them survive while others just get scrapped, and accidents have happened recently around here... although some of them will carry on because the damage wasn't too bad: because the shell is made to resist impacts, not like on other cars...

[DanThe]

Have you ever seen a plastic Renault wing thats been impacted?
Its as bad as a broken pane of glass,
I worked in a Renault dealers and they made us dissarm the airbag system everytime we needed to work inside the car because they are so sensitive, airbags can do some damage in the wrong situation.
A friend of a friend recently hit a curb in his 04 clio,
he was doing no more than 30, a taxi was parked in the wrong place, it was dark etc.
anyway, the seat airbag went off on the nearside and both seatbelt pre-tensioners, and due to the suspension damage the car was undrivable.
His insurance broker said "dont be suprised if its written off"
All this from a curb?
I was laughing all week!

[Paul325i]

That Mini vs F150 test is balls, the F150 deformed so greatly because it's over 2 tonne of weight, the mini is far less. If you crashed the F150 Head on into the mini then see who survives.

The E30 is a tough car, but it's very rigid which means the entire shell takes a hard impact, modern cars are designed in a way that they protect the occupants by crushing and absorbing shock. The shock impact of a crash is what will kill a person in most cases.

In a hard front end the E30's engine will actually crush the occupants legs and the dash comes up extremely high, yes they're tough for their age but i'd much rather be in a new car if i had to crash hard.

[DanThe]

Id rather crash in a new car of the same model,
But in my crash, im glad i was in my 20 year old E30 and not a new clio cus i prob wouldnt be here

[E30BeemerLad]

it's been said already, but modern cars are designed to crumple and dissipate the force of the impact so that the passenger cell remains intact and the forces are directed away from the occupants of the vehicle, not only this but it should also mean that the front of the car looks a royal mess but doors can still be opened etc.

Talking to members of the emergency services ( we sponsor the North Yorkshire Air Ambulance) they said they turn up to accidents and see the wreck and think they will be taking a bag home with them, but the driver is sitting at the side of the road perfectly well.

The damage to an E30 in a crash would look less severe, but the occupants of the vehicle are probably 5 times more likely to have injuries because the organic human being has to take a lot of the force.

Not E30 related, but a car from the same era which is a tough old nail is the Merc 190. A bloke my dad used to work for had a head on doing about 70+ with an oncoming Artic. A deer ran out, he swerved and went into the wagon. The diff and propshaft was found 200 yds up the road and the car was a proper mess, he suffered a couple of cracked ribs from the seatbelt.

Can anyone remember 5th Gear when they did the staged motorway pile up? Remember that old Merc S class which came along last, it just ploughed it'sway up the pile of cars.

Seems might is right at the end of the day. It's all about ther physics dudes

[SCOTT325SE]

Dan, i smacked a grass/earth/stone hedge HARD in my 03 clio - thats why i nearly rolled it. Hit it hard enuf to put a 2" bend in the alloy! Car was up on 2 wheels but i managed to get it back onto all 4 somehow (opposite lock maybe?) Came back down with a mighty thump and not one airbag or pre-tensioner kicked in!

[DanThe]

Lucky
Prob one i worked on and didnt rearm airbags
Did you get much suspension damage? I recon thats what set them of in the one i mentioned

[E30BeemerLad]

is this urban legend?

I am sure I heard before that if you smacked a car with a large hammer on the front tow hook it would fool the safety computers that the car had been involved in an impact and would pop the central locking up? Suppose it would also immobilise the fuel pump circuit though so no driving away.

Top gear or 5th gear did a 30mpg crash before in a megane, I think the airbag popped on that one, but in another staged crash with an Espace the system figured out the airbag was not necessary and just used the seatbelt pre-tensioners. Horses for courses I suppose

[kam-325i]

is this urban legend?

I am sure I heard before that if you smacked a car with a large hammer on the front tow hook it would fool the safety computers that the car had been involved in an impact and would pop the central locking up? Suppose it would also immobilise the fuel pump circuit though so no driving away.

It does has some thruth. On cars where the Central Locking ECU is mounted close to external body panels, a blow from a mallet would activate the emergency opening mechinisim (ball bearing switch thing) and open a locked car.

I have seen it work.

[Gwynleym10]

This is a very interesting thread,

As ever I think some cars are sutible for some people and others are sutible for other people.

Its very well attacking renault, but there are certain drivers who are going to crash at some point, end off. Maybe i'm being steriotypical, but i'm sure its pretty hard being a mum with screeming kids in the back, you need a car which can take some of the pressure off you.

Scott you cycle, so do I (commute in central london every day) I think pedestrain/other road users saftey is inportant. And I know that if I was going to be hit by a car I would far rather be hit by a renault than an e30.

Thats what the 5th star is for in NCAP.

But then there are other drivers who are "perhaps" more aware, so in that respect a "drivers" car with good visibility etc and perhaps more crash prevention aids is more important.

I ve been in two little crashes in my old e30 recently (both below 10 mph)
One I went into a new taxi (probably my fault..) and the other I was rear ended by some fool! Both occosions (and were pretty similar crashes really sept my e30 was on different ends so to speak) the e30 was worse off by a long way. The taxi literally just had some paint from mine (while i bent the bumper,bonnet,wing,lights) and the toyota previa which rear ended me did have a scratch, I got a bent bumper, rear panel and a cracked rear light!

I do suspect that later (old e30 was early chrome bumper) plastic bumper cars would fair slightly better in these situations as the have bumper shocks, etc etc

[JOSEMI]

I have been following this thread myself, as you never know how these car would behave.
I also had recently a collision, it was so stupid that I rather not go into it, but it was a fairly severe hit in the front of my car, and all I heard was a very solid and non metalic 'pom' which didn't sound weak at all. In fact before I say the damage I thought that in fact nothing had really happened.

The damage (with chrome bumpers) resulted in the front o of the car being slightly bent inwards, but even now I take pictures and its almost unnoticeable - although the damage IS there, (and it pisses me off everytiem I see it, but that's another story).

I then thought how it would behave at high speed, and judging by my own thoughts, a little experience (enough to measure) and the responses above, it looks like these cars behave really well at low speeds where the passenger can take the pressure, but do not behave as well at high speeds. It sounds like stating the obvious in all cars, but the E30 did feel very solid and safe (at low speed) whereas an accident I was in in a corsa, and a modern Escort (driven by me) felt really unsafe and the cars did feel like they were falling apart during the collision, and I was well shaken afterwards for a while - so I also took the impact like the cars did.

When these cars were made it was more important how solid the shell was than how the passengers took the impact, as accidents had not been fully developed, I recall only Volvo trowing cars all over the place to study their behaviour.

I still fel safe in an E30 though, as they do handle better and its easy to 'feel' how the car is responding in any situation, and judge what to do next (i.e. E30's slip from the rear, but the driver also has the chance to rectify as this is felt at an early stage).
Jose

[SCOTT325SE]

Scott you cycle, so do I (commute in central london every day) I think pedestrain/other road users saftey is inportant. And I know that if I was going to be hit by a car I would far rather be hit by a renault than an e30.

But then there are other drivers who are "perhaps" more aware, so in that respect a "drivers" car with good visibility etc and perhaps more crash prevention aids is more important.

Gwynley, yes mate i do appriciate that if i was to be on the recieving end id probably have a different perspective, but as i said, if i buy a car i buy it from the drivers perspective.

Ive been hit my numerous cars in my cycling time (including once in a race ffs! i was riding a yellow bike, wearing my team racing strip which was bright blue and flurescent pink! The guy who was driving the car that hit me said "i didnt see you" BULLSHIT! Im 6foot, medium build, riding a yellow bike and im wearing fluro pink you cnut! what do you mean you didnt see me?
The car he was driving..... a 52 plate Vauxhall Omega.
It hurt like fuk as i went across the bonnet but what hurt more was the fact that i was flying in the race and had plenty in my legs for the last quarter. He totally ruined what was set to be a personal best by about 3 minutes in an open competition. As it happened he just said "well you seem alright" (because i was jumping up and down screaming in his face) yet he negated to notice the blood running down my left thigh, left arm, right wrist and shoulder.

The guy didnt care really and he didnt think he'd done anything wrong. THATS the biggest problem - people drive "safe" cars, but dont think about the implications of actually hitting something or someone!

[Gwynleym10]

The guy didnt care really and he didnt think he'd done anything wrong. THATS the biggest problem - people drive "safe" cars, but dont think about the implications of actually hitting something or someone!

Yea this is a problem, its really the Hummer/SUV sydrome where people "feel" safe which means they car less about other road users. But the fact is some people are going to have crashes what ever, so the car needs to make up for some of this...wow i'm turning American belivening that technology is the answer to everything!

These people really should just get thte train in my opion and not be allowed to drive! The test should be FAR harder!

I hear you about drivers not seeing you! I'm lit up like a xmas tree when i ride commute, but they still don't see you (or realise that your going above 5mph...)! TBH its not as bad as I expect mind (i'm going to get hit tonight now...)

[E30BeemerLad]

I'm lit up like a xmas tree when i ride

Dirty welsh bugger

2000 Posts

[Lordschleife]

Just saw this pic



No idea of the speed involved, but maybe not all that safe after all?

[Brianmoooore]

I've bought several written off E30s in the last couple of years, and looked at several more.
I've always been quite impressed by the progressive way they crumple at the front and rear. Those little ridges and holes in the chassis rails behind the bumper mounts are all there for a good reason.

[Dan318-is]

after staring at that picture for quite some time robin iv just realised thats an s14 sitting in the front

[stevetigger]

after staring at that picture for quite some time robin iv just realised thats an s14 sitting in the front

First thing I noticed, I think it's an M3

[E30Mark]

after staring at that picture for quite some time robin iv just realised thats an s14 sitting in the front

First thing I noticed, I think it's an M3

Was an M3, now a bean can...

[dsio]

I havn't smashed one myself, but mine has taken a few small hits that have all been repaired and still holds together. I would like to see how having a 6 cylinder M20 up front instead of a 4 cylinder M10/M40 effects the head on collision given how tight the M20 fits.

I would not want to be T boned in one of these things, thats for sure. Being rear ended is never great but you would be safe.

I would also be interested in the difference having 2 doors or 4 has on side impacts.

I used to have one of those big 'ol 80s fairlane V8s with over 2 tonnes in steel. It really gives you a feeling of superiority, knowing that if anyone hits you, your only out of pocket $300, while their new car is wrecked. And if you hit anyone head on, they will be wearing a V8 engine block, while you will still have 4 feet of legroom, and a comfy lounge chair of a driver's seat.

The E30 and the E34s are a little different in that I would care if they got smashed.

[Hyperion]

My car has only been in 3 accidents in its life , the worst was when my brother was driving her and hit a audi. The front chasis bent a little. But she was all sorted out with some chassis straighting. I didnt have a digital camera back then so i dont have any pics. But here is some pics of a rolled e30.

[Moofles]

I've bought several written off E30s in the last couple of years, and looked at several more.
I've always been quite impressed by the progressive way they crumple at the front and rear. Those little ridges and holes in the chassis rails behind the bumper mounts are all there for a good reason.

you mean you've bought written off e30's which have had bent chassis'?

I only ask because 2 things spring to mind:

- an e30 is written off very easily because it's not worth much, a panel that needs replacing and that would be the end of it through an insurance company

- serious work (and $$) would be needed to sort out a bent chassis on any car

So it makes me think that you could buy a written off e30 and yes it would be perfectly good, because it would only need a new wing panel or something, so the e30's you've bought could well be good cars.

You also mention the way an e30 crumples well - if this happens it's gotta be a write off, as mentioned above this costs a lot (and almost definitely means the car will never be the same again, doors won't shut quite properly, etc).

Which category is the car in this thread falling into?

[dsio]

It is also interesting to note the number of people here that have smashed the things.

The E30 is so famous for losing the back end that it has its own term in the dictionary: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=r3v

Clearly people are smashing them left right and center, but everyone is walking away from them in fairly good condition. You seriously dont hear of many deaths, when you compare that to the number of smashes people have escaped from.

If people are comming back here with their crash photos to show off, clearly thats a good thing. Go to a Ford Pinto forum and search for "My crash" or "I got out of the wreck ok". Dead people dont post pictures

[Brianmoooore]

I've bought several written off E30s in the last couple of years, and looked at several more.
I've always been quite impressed by the progressive way they crumple at the front and rear. Those little ridges and holes in the chassis rails behind the bumper mounts are all there for a good reason.

you mean you've bought written off e30's which have had bent chassis'?

I only ask because 2 things spring to mind:

- an e30 is written off very easily because it's not worth much, a panel that needs replacing and that would be the end of it through an insurance company

- serious work (and $$) would be needed to sort out a bent chassis on any car

So it makes me think that you could buy a written off e30 and yes it would be perfectly good, because it would only need a new wing panel or something, so the e30's you've bought could well be good cars.

You also mention the way an e30 crumples well - if this happens it's gotta be a write off, as mentioned above this costs a lot (and almost definitely means the car will never be the same again, doors won't shut quite properly, etc).

Which category is the car in this thread falling into?

The badly bent one's I break, although if you get a car on a jig it's surprisingly easy to straighten a bent chassis. The metal seems to come back to where it should be, and then not move any more.
The less damaged ones I repair and upgrade with bits from the breaker ones.
Recent examples have been a silver touring with "engine fire" which turned out to be one small fried wire in the engine loom, and a saloon with a light dent in the nearside wing, extending to the front half of the door. Both cat. C write offs.

[stevetigger]

I think there safe!!

[Moofles]

The badly bent one's I break, although if you get a car on a jig it's surprisingly easy to straighten a bent chassis. The metal seems to come back to where it should be, and then not move any more.
The less damaged ones I repair and upgrade with bits from the breaker ones.
Recent examples have been a silver touring with "engine fire" which turned out to be one small fried wire in the engine loom, and a saloon with a light dent in the nearside wing, extending to the front half of the door. Both cat. C write offs.

The recent examples you mention do seem to serve to highlight the point that e30's get written off by a feather duster...

not sure i agree so much with the car on a jig point, it might make it legal but everything i've ever heard says a car with a bent chassis will never be the same again