Onwards and upwards however
pm replied to too btw.
My E30 M3 S85 V10 Swap
Moderator: martauto
Not bad at all squire! Would you ever consider doing a non bmw engine swap now that you pretty much done all the awesome bmw engines now? Something like an rb26det nissan skyline engined e30 would be immense.
I guess you've already looked at these threads:
http://www.zatzy.com/projekt/338842-joh ... 0-v10.html
http://wp1016621.wp027.webpack.hosteuro ... f01833.htm
In the first case the owner chose to do without power steering and a brake servo due to lack of space. Seems like the other owner retained both.
Anyway good luck to you!
http://www.zatzy.com/projekt/338842-joh ... 0-v10.html
http://wp1016621.wp027.webpack.hosteuro ... f01833.htm
In the first case the owner chose to do without power steering and a brake servo due to lack of space. Seems like the other owner retained both.
Anyway good luck to you!
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glenn
- Engine Transplant Services
- Posts: 2198
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: blackwood, south wales
yes, i've read them several times.Frenchguy wrote:I guess you've already looked at these threads:
i'll be keeping the power steering. probably, i'll modify the cross-member, so that i can position the engine exactly where i want it.
i doubt it paul, i keep saying 'this one will be my last' lol!.Cook318IS wrote:Would you ever consider doing a non bmw engine swap now that you pretty much done all the awesome bmw engines now?
07706856192blitz877 wrote:can you inbox me your number as ive lost my phone
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ShepsEvo3
- Master of go faster
- Posts: 1881
- Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: Bristol/Wiltshire
Uwe, yes it is mate.. Things just didn't work out for me and the chap who was supposed to be helping me with the project. As I am not a body guy and get messed about with big time where bodyshops are concerned, coupled with the fact that my bosses were pressuring me to move the car from work, and that I don't have any room at home for it and I don't have the time the car deserves to put it back to its former glory, I felt I had no option but to offer it up for sale.UweM3 wrote:is that Simons old car??
My intensions were all good, this was going to be a joint venture between me and my engine builder to go through engine modifications step by step, then once the ultimate S14 was achieved we were then going to drop a V10 into it as Glenn is doing now.
Was sorry to see the car go, but am pleased now it is getting some attention.
Paul.
E30 M3 Unichip Alpha N style conversions, this is the ultimate for extracting the best out of your S14 M power car.
Also, Live mapping of your Standard Motronic ECU for optimising all your modifications.
www.sabre-tuning.co.uk
Also, Live mapping of your Standard Motronic ECU for optimising all your modifications.
www.sabre-tuning.co.uk
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GermanGorilla
- E30 Zone Regular
- Posts: 528
- Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:00 pm
Hi,
Glenn- you will have you work cut out on this one.
Good luck, hope it all works out for you.
After reading through the Zatzy.com thread, it would
seem that their are 'issues' which have been
tackled in different ways.
What Gearbox have you sourced Glenn ? as the E60 V10
was available with a Manual 6 speed in the States so
would be the box of choice, as making the SMG III work
on a E30 would be complex, given all the signals and
sensors you would require.
The S65 M3 Manual would be next as same bolt pattern.
The problem with 'other' Gearboxes that people say are
the same, is they are not.
The 'M' specific G/boxes have superior bushes and some
even have harder shafts etc, to take the Torque these
engines push out.
As can be seen in the Swedish project, he sheared the Gearbox
input shaft clean off, without really trying.
I see he also went for a 'Sintered 3 Plate Tilton Clutch, which
would be fantastic for ripping up the Ashphalt on
your local Track Day, but an absolute nightmare for
every day driving. Would not last long if you started
dragging it, as the sintered Plates are very thin.
500nm of Tourque and you have a Clutch that is either
in or out, I think the standard clutch for the Manual V10 M5
Gearbox would be a much better choice, even if you were
doing the odd Track day.
Seems he also deleted the Vanos, which is more troublesome
on V10's than it ever was on S50 B32 and S54's.
Are you going to delete the Quad Vanos Glenn or retain
it ?
I thought he made a good job of the sump/subframe issues
as reatining the V10 'Dry sump' configuration is more
or less essential as the V10 starves of oil at the top
end due to lateral G-Forces when being pushed hard.
Three oil pumps certainly need their juice.
Not sure how long his Rear Diff and single eared rear mount
will last with all that Torque though !!!!
The rear shafts and diff will need some serious consideration
as Guys with Turbo S14's making circa 400 BHP and a lot
less Torque are known to 'chew' standard Shafts for a
past time.
The Z3M rear shafts etc would be a better bet, but not
sure how they would stand up to the power and Torque
of the V10.
The Guy from the e30.de website seems to have gone a
different route with his rear end and drive train but its
hard to tell from the limited pics what parts he actually
used.
I will be watching your thread with great interest Glenn
and I am sure that once you get into it proper, then it will
all start to come together like a massive 'metal' jigsaw puzzle.
Regards,
The Gorilla.
Glenn- you will have you work cut out on this one.
Good luck, hope it all works out for you.
After reading through the Zatzy.com thread, it would
seem that their are 'issues' which have been
tackled in different ways.
What Gearbox have you sourced Glenn ? as the E60 V10
was available with a Manual 6 speed in the States so
would be the box of choice, as making the SMG III work
on a E30 would be complex, given all the signals and
sensors you would require.
The S65 M3 Manual would be next as same bolt pattern.
The problem with 'other' Gearboxes that people say are
the same, is they are not.
The 'M' specific G/boxes have superior bushes and some
even have harder shafts etc, to take the Torque these
engines push out.
As can be seen in the Swedish project, he sheared the Gearbox
input shaft clean off, without really trying.
I see he also went for a 'Sintered 3 Plate Tilton Clutch, which
would be fantastic for ripping up the Ashphalt on
your local Track Day, but an absolute nightmare for
every day driving. Would not last long if you started
dragging it, as the sintered Plates are very thin.
500nm of Tourque and you have a Clutch that is either
in or out, I think the standard clutch for the Manual V10 M5
Gearbox would be a much better choice, even if you were
doing the odd Track day.
Seems he also deleted the Vanos, which is more troublesome
on V10's than it ever was on S50 B32 and S54's.
Are you going to delete the Quad Vanos Glenn or retain
it ?
I thought he made a good job of the sump/subframe issues
as reatining the V10 'Dry sump' configuration is more
or less essential as the V10 starves of oil at the top
end due to lateral G-Forces when being pushed hard.
Three oil pumps certainly need their juice.
Not sure how long his Rear Diff and single eared rear mount
will last with all that Torque though !!!!
The rear shafts and diff will need some serious consideration
as Guys with Turbo S14's making circa 400 BHP and a lot
less Torque are known to 'chew' standard Shafts for a
past time.
The Z3M rear shafts etc would be a better bet, but not
sure how they would stand up to the power and Torque
of the V10.
The Guy from the e30.de website seems to have gone a
different route with his rear end and drive train but its
hard to tell from the limited pics what parts he actually
used.
I will be watching your thread with great interest Glenn
and I am sure that once you get into it proper, then it will
all start to come together like a massive 'metal' jigsaw puzzle.
Regards,
The Gorilla.
Not trying to knock this but I believe this is going too far. GermanGorilla has already pointed out a few of my concernes like rear diff/drive shafts.
To makes this a usable car, a LOT of modifications are required IMHO. A lot!
To makes this a usable car, a LOT of modifications are required IMHO. A lot!
Yes, those are some good points. However, I don't see any other as an issue except the electronics unless, of course, all the traction control and anti-theft things can be reprogrammed away.
Rear axle / shaft / differential problem is quite straightforward to solve with E34 rear axle carrier and special driveshafts from PPF that withstand 1000hp (proven many times). Basically E34 M5 stuff, more info can be found on www.pure-pf.com
After all, when taking on this kind of swap does one really expect to get off without modifying & strengthening "everything"? That's part of the game..
Rear axle / shaft / differential problem is quite straightforward to solve with E34 rear axle carrier and special driveshafts from PPF that withstand 1000hp (proven many times). Basically E34 M5 stuff, more info can be found on www.pure-pf.com
After all, when taking on this kind of swap does one really expect to get off without modifying & strengthening "everything"? That's part of the game..
E30 Cabrio M-Tech, powered by V8
E34 M5 3.8 x 2
Alpina D10 Touring #33/93
E46 318i Touring
Toyota Hiace 4wd
E34 M5 3.8 x 2
Alpina D10 Touring #33/93
E46 318i Touring
Toyota Hiace 4wd
-
glenn
- Engine Transplant Services
- Posts: 2198
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: blackwood, south wales
hello dan,
the gearbox (as pictured) is off a e90 m3 v8, as you say, it's the same bolt pattern, so would obviously be the easiest, although not the cheapest!
i'll also be keeping the s85 clutch.
i'm keeping the vanos units, as i will be using the original siemens mss65 ecu.
i too will be making mod's to the crossmember to retain the sump untouched,
i think the swedish guy removed the vanos pump from the sump as he deleted the vanos units.
as for rear drivetrain, i think the 'twin-ear' diff mounting is a must. the e30 rear end is quite robust though, and i'm not saying it doesn't need any modification, but lets see how it copes first, before assuming it cant cope. the rear axle on the white car had been on there for quite a while, and was still perfect, after being abused by the s50, and having had two s62's.
this will be a street car, not a track car. so it wont be having abuse for 100% of it's life. and although having 500bhp, it cant be used for most of the time.
i'm sure the e30 will be fine,
but if it isnt, whatever breaks, i'll modify.......it's what i enjoy doing
the gearbox (as pictured) is off a e90 m3 v8, as you say, it's the same bolt pattern, so would obviously be the easiest, although not the cheapest!
i'll also be keeping the s85 clutch.
i'm keeping the vanos units, as i will be using the original siemens mss65 ecu.
i too will be making mod's to the crossmember to retain the sump untouched,
i think the swedish guy removed the vanos pump from the sump as he deleted the vanos units.
as for rear drivetrain, i think the 'twin-ear' diff mounting is a must. the e30 rear end is quite robust though, and i'm not saying it doesn't need any modification, but lets see how it copes first, before assuming it cant cope. the rear axle on the white car had been on there for quite a while, and was still perfect, after being abused by the s50, and having had two s62's.
this will be a street car, not a track car. so it wont be having abuse for 100% of it's life. and although having 500bhp, it cant be used for most of the time.
i'm sure the e30 will be fine,
but if it isnt, whatever breaks, i'll modify.......it's what i enjoy doing
Well saidglenn wrote:I'm sure the e30 will be fine,
but if it isnt, whatever breaks, i'll modify.......it's what i enjoy doing
S54, S62, S65 & S85 Plug & Play loom/Ecu Kits
Sump Baffles
Engine Conversion Kits/Parts
TrackDays
Sump Baffles
Engine Conversion Kits/Parts
TrackDays
Really looking forward to seeing this progress
Just a thought about the rear end, to my mind surely the stress the rear end sees is as much to do with the tyres as the engine - if the tyres will break away at say 250 ft/lb then that's all the shafts will ever see. Unless you start running slicks and doing drag starts with a harsh clutch, then things might get crazy. The beauty of this engine is that it will probably put 250ft/lb through the back end all the way to 6th gear
Just a thought about the rear end, to my mind surely the stress the rear end sees is as much to do with the tyres as the engine - if the tyres will break away at say 250 ft/lb then that's all the shafts will ever see. Unless you start running slicks and doing drag starts with a harsh clutch, then things might get crazy. The beauty of this engine is that it will probably put 250ft/lb through the back end all the way to 6th gear
Awesome!!! 
I'm torn... the epicness that this thread will be, or the total molestation of a black M3 with red leather interior or the empty, gutted feeling I'm experiencing reading 'interior for sale'...
I'm torn... the epicness that this thread will be, or the total molestation of a black M3 with red leather interior or the empty, gutted feeling I'm experiencing reading 'interior for sale'...
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glenn
- Engine Transplant Services
- Posts: 2198
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: blackwood, south wales
pm me an offer if you want?suchy wrote: the empty, gutted feeling I'm experiencing reading 'interior for sale'...
i'll put it in the 'for sale' section once its been removed......probably on the weekend
Been watching the e30 v10s on youtube, and drooling massively, wish i could have something like this in my cab. maybe i should start with something a little cheaper and smaller though. lol. Subscribed anyway, will watch it in awe. 
Yeah it's my fave, would love to but not in a position toGortour wrote:Your car would look nice with a red interior Chris... Buy it...
Cheers Glenn would bloody love to but unfortuntely cannot.glenn wrote:pm me an offer if you want?suchy wrote: the empty, gutted feeling I'm experiencing reading 'interior for sale'...
i'll put it in the 'for sale' section once its been removed......probably on the weekend
Will watch this thread though as it sounds brutal. Bring on the molesting
Haha the unorganised chaos that is my life Gordon!!Gortour wrote:All these hours and no play for ages though Chris? Where's it all going?
Must be a real b****ard working so hard and not having anything to show for it.
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beardymat
- E30 Zone Squatter
- Posts: 1979
- Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: sheffield, city of steel, and rust apparently
after completing my own S50b32 M3 swap and knowing the feeling it gives me you must feel like a dog with two knobs. The M3 is an iconic car but isnt as quick as it looks by todays standards so more power is the best way to do the legend justice.
keep up the good work
keep up the good work
No longer self employed but still available for welding duties.
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glenn
- Engine Transplant Services
- Posts: 2198
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: blackwood, south wales
well,
finished removing the s14 this afternoon.
i've also removed the m3 arb, as it's completely in the way of the rear bowl on the sump. looks like i will have to mount an arb in a different position, possibly an e36 evo bar mounted forward, i'll have to get the engine dropped into the bay first then decide how to fit one.
prop has been removed, and i'll get the servo out of the way tomorrow.
i should have enough room then, to have a first 'trial' fit.
it's pretty cold out there today
....plus the rugby's on this afternoon
finished removing the s14 this afternoon.
i've also removed the m3 arb, as it's completely in the way of the rear bowl on the sump. looks like i will have to mount an arb in a different position, possibly an e36 evo bar mounted forward, i'll have to get the engine dropped into the bay first then decide how to fit one.
prop has been removed, and i'll get the servo out of the way tomorrow.
i should have enough room then, to have a first 'trial' fit.
it's pretty cold out there today
....plus the rugby's on this afternoon 
-
glenn
- Engine Transplant Services
- Posts: 2198
- Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: blackwood, south wales
welcome to the zone.....but,yaza wrote:can any one suggest what is the best turnbo engine to put in a e30 its gt a 325i on it nw
wrong place to make a post like that mate.
you might get a better response starting a fresh thread.
