Convince me

[LittleSwill]

I'm really torn between a 325 and Lancia Integrale. Why do you lot think I should get the 325?

p.s. This is a fantastic site. You wouldn't believe how long it took me to find it!

thanks

[Geeman]

Convince you...?

Erm, go for the Integrale! (joke)

Two completely different cars dude. A 325i is a real torquey grunt of a car, while the Integrale is a revvy 4WD monster... on a par with an E30 M3...

Tough choice. Are we talking 325i Sport, or a normal 325...?

[Simon]

Also the integrale is very fragile, and requires a lot of care.
Awesome cars though, and an Integrale evo is on my list of must have cars. Not so fussed on the plain integrale though, and an E30 325i would win hands down for build quality.

[Nostrils]

2 good choices there. I like them both.....

IMO, you should go for the 325:

Why! - Cheaper, parts readily available at a good price, especially from sites like this and IMO has more street cred and a better build. 6 cylinder grunt like no other, insurance should be more reasonable as you dont have to worry about the extra because the Lancia being LHD.

Preferably go for a late model sport, manual if you can get it, although I had an Auto which when driven with the switchable box/throttle its a scream!

Lancia:

I was toying with one of these before getting my E30 M3, both being LHD was no problem. The Lancia I found looked dated inside, very plastic and felt cramped. I do not see many of these cars on the road anymore!! They are more expensive (Evo of course) to purchase than the BMW, saving money for extras, or more to save for the next car!

Have you got the chance to test drive both cars!!

[Jimbob]

I think the fact that the parts and servicing has much better availability than an Integrale therefore cheaper, and obviously being biased as I own the e30.
If it's a daily driver then the e30 wins hands down, as these guys have said; a well equipped and well kept Sport is more comfortable on the inside, and still has a domineering presence on the road

[6potWil6pot]

Respect to the Lancia Intergrale Evo It has plently of road presence from those in the "know"!

A 325i Sport would be a lot easier to keep as regards to running costs i think tho!

If i were you id go see 325i Sports, E30 M3s and the Lancia and see which one you like!

[E30Adam]

I hate to say this but I'd go for the lancia unless you were thinking about getting an M3 instead. in which case I'd chose the M3.

The Intergrale (which is the only one I'd want) is an astonishing car although parts prices will empty your wallet.

[zaust]

Get EM Both
Then u cant go wrong....

[Guest]

The integrale is better than the e30 in every department other than cost, not even the best M3`s can cope with the sheer nature of the integrale.
I am not putting down the e30 in any way but it is like david and galioth.

[johnono]

yea, im gonna break ranks too. if its an evo then take the lancia

but how much are the cars in question, whats their condition and mileage ect. is the lancia a lefty

but if it was an m3 we wouldnԚ´t be talkin ...id be out in my new bimma

[ian332isport]

The outside of the Integrale is stunning, but the inside is a joke

I quite fancied one myself, but saw the dash, and walked away. It was like a really bad Fiat.

Ian.

[Simon13]

just asking but are there "really" many road cars which handle better than M3? or have a better more involed driving experience? i'm asking cos i have not driven either cars!

[bryn_p]

I've got 2 325i's and an Integrale Evo and they couldn't be more different to be honest. The E30s are a pleasure to work on and you can do most things yourself. The integrale is the complete opposite - its a pig to work on and your almost always better off paying a specialist to work on it. Also some of the bits are very hard to come by, with even Fiat in Italy not stocking them anymore, whereas you can buy anything for an E30.
I'd say to run an Integrale you're looking at 3-4 times the yearly budget for an E30, and to be honest they are both as much fun in their own ways.

I love my Integrale, but the E30 is definitely the sensible choice but in no way a second choice.

Cheers,
Bryn.

[Guest]

just asking but are there "really" many road cars which handle better than M3? or have a better more involed driving experience? i'm asking cos i have not driven either cars!

The M3 is a masterpiece but not even close to being in the same league as an integrale, remember, the integral is a groupB rally winner taking every title there was and eventually being banned due to it being so far ahead of the rest.
The only other car to do this was the ford RS200.

[Simon]

just asking but are there "really" many road cars which handle better than M3? or have a better more involed driving experience? i'm asking cos i have not driven either cars!

The M3 is a masterpiece but not even close to being in the same league as an integrale, remember, the integral is a groupB rally winner taking every title there was and eventually being banned due to it being so far ahead of the rest.
The only other car to do this was the ford RS200.

The integrale was Lancia's answer to group B being banned, the delta S4 was a group B car, but not the later Integrale, they did win a lot of titles though back in the late 80's. The RS200 was a total flop as was the metro 6R4, they turned up to the party too late.

[Simon13]

but the M3 won virtually everything it was entered into, over 150 titles?

[Simon]

but the M3 won virtually everything it was entered into, over 150 titles?

That was touring cars! The integrale excelled at rallying, the E30 M3 did do some rallying but was more at home on the tarmac stages.

[Simon13]

but logic would say to me that a car setup more for rally wouldn't be as good on the tarmac as the track slag M3?

[Simon]

Who knows, the M3's main competitors were the RS500 and the Merc 190, they were the tarmac kings, the Lanica Integrale was the forest king, though they were good on the tarmac stages too!

[Geeman]

Then we have the 6R4 and the Quattro...

M3 was the European Touring Car King... no doubt about that, the Integrale was more at home on the dirt.

For a road car, M3 wins hands down for me.

Trouble is, we're supposed to be comparing the Integrale to the 325i.

[Simon13]

so we are! for looks and sound 325i sport anyday of the week IMO, sounds like running cost favour the e30 also

[Guest]

The 6R4 with a 0-60mph of 2.4 seconds was outstanding, the RS200 was not a flop, I have no idea where you get this info from.
With 350 and 450hp this lightwieght special was something else and way ahead of its time.
It was the banning of the GroupB that killed these machines, not the inability of them.

[Simon]

From the initial question though are we comparing the Integrale Evo, or just the delta? As these 2 cars (delta and 325i) seem to be similar price range, where as integrale evo and 325i are a totally different prices.
As has been said though you'd only have to sit in a delta to make up your mind, theyre horrible inside.

[Guest]

But driving one puts a smile on your face like not many cars will give.

[Simon]

the RS200 was not a flop, I have no idea where you get this info from.

Ford spent millions of pounds developing the RS200, and the car never got the chance to prove itself in group B due to the banning of group B, so they were left with a car that cost them millions with no rallying pedigree, the car iteslf was not a flop, but the timing of it all made it a flop, it also came the same time as the stock market crash of the late 80's meaning people did not have the money to spend on buying these machines.

You'll also probably find that it was the ability of these cars that got group B cars banned, as they just kept getting faster and faster.

I think you're also mis understanding me as I would like to own a version of every group B car ever made as they were awesome, and what I would give to go back to that time when the quattro first hit the forests.

[Guest]

Maybe the fact that the RS200 came off the road in wales on a stage killing 11 people had something to do with it as well.

[Simon]

Maybe the fact that the RS200 came off the road in wales on a stage killing 11 people had something to do with it as well.

That was Portugal, the stages out there have always been the same, very poor crowd control.

[Ant]

Forget the Lancia, regardless of model I could not live with the playskool dash and appalling electricals .


If you want the wide body look with german build and quality, Audi Ur Quattro, you'll never look back, point to point still the quickest car I've driven, eats scoobys on B road blasts too

they are getting cheaper now, I've seen some superb 20V models in the sub 8K bracket of late, decent 10V with histories are 4K and under.

Quick trip to Dainlynx and the worlds your oyster, hmm sport quattro rep anyone?

but as always we've digressed

[Simon]

Now there's a man with sense!

[billgatese30]

selling the m3 then are you si.

[Ant]

you an me both mate, still want one even after all these years......

Mate of a mate bought one last year, dark met blue, 20V rims , leather etc etc , mechanicals were perfect , paid under 3K, shame the tosser could not drive for $hit , ended up scrapped after a backwards excursion off the lanes, only had it 2 weeks.

[jonb]

ant

isnt the quatro a money pit waiting to go wrong though. mega bills etc, which makes it comparable to the lanca.

back to the debate. i think this guy must be going on about the "normal" lancia delta. which is not even on the same level as the evo. more of a poor mans evo, but still carrys the same worrys.

[placey]

nobody has stated an obvious point - the lancia has too many doors.

4 door cars are rubbish. sell out - all of them. no exceptions.

also when asked what car you own/drive which is the better answer - lancia or bmw? neither of them conjour up great images for the listener but i ask you lancia?

paul

p.s. you can rely on me to sit on the fence in any debate.

edit: i spose could weld up the rear doors. but on a car with provenance?

[Guest]

No offence meant but only people knowing little about such cars would make such a silly statement.
Mitsubishi Evo
Lancia Integrale
Subaru Impreza
Lotus Carlton
Sierra Cosworth

[bryn_p]

Its fair to say that the normal delta is a piece of sh*t, but all the Integrales are awesome. The 16v non Evo is mechanically the same as the Evo, it doesn't look as good, but it goes and handles just as well. Just thought I'd clear that up!

No offence to anyone, but I also think you can't be a genuine car enthusiast and write a car off just because you don't like the interior... just drive the thing!!

Have to agree that the UR quattro is awesome too.

Cheers,
Bryn.