BMW 325I MOTORSPORT VS VW MK4 1.8T

[pacerpete]

Pacer, you must have something more enlightening than that to add to this 'debate'.

OK, dubbers are deluded scum and them and their bruvved up cloned scrap need exterminating.

How's that Ratch ?

From a man that owns a f*cking SKODA!!!!!!!!

Watch this space, the paedo chariot may be minted and served. I have just bought a LPG'd Chevy suburban. I can fit 3 interiors, 2 sets of rims , a catering size werthers dispenser and a scout troop in the back with room to spare
The lack of parking spaces that are 20 foot turd friendly is the only thing that may prevent it staying on the fleet

[rado-steve]

How have I shhown myself up??? E36's are gash every press report I've read about them says they suck, it's common knowledge across the whole motoring press....Ha Ha!

Better coupe than a 328i Ummm thats pretty easy...Corrado VR6, Prettier and more exclusive! Honda Prelude again prettier, Fiat Coupe a bit ugly but by christ its fast, Alfa Romeo GTV, It's an Alfa.....Do you want me to go???

You're kidding right ? Have you driven a good 328i Coupe ?
Corrado VR6 - ok find one that hasn't been caned to within an inch of its life, Honda Prelude - yawn, Fiat Coupe - don't make me laugh, Alfa GTV - pretty but only buy if you like spending lots of time waiting for the RAC.

I don't know what press report you've been reading but aside from a few glitches with trim quality the E36 had when new most of the press reports I've seen were extremely complimentary - in fact Brooklands Books have a whole book full !

I quite like VAG stuff ( my first car was a Mk1 Golf ) but the build quality isn't a patch on BMW !
The most unreliable POS i have ever owned by a country mile was my Mk2 Golf GTi - I sold the best E30 I've ever had to buy it so had a direct reference point at the time. It was hateful and I have never had anything like any of the issues I had with the golf in ANY of the BMW's I've had ( of which there's been quite a few )

my last daily was a diesel A4 - which was a dull but capable all rounder - great as it would do 50mpg. I sold it in favour of an E36 Touring which doesn't have the Audi's fuel econ
omy but is a much nicer car in every other respect.

Just piss taking with Ratch or On_a_Roll as he was quoting press bollocks that he made up in his BMW filled brain I thought I'd do the same

Whats wrong with a fiat coupe......Bloody quick, and awesomely equipped, The Alfa GTV as you say is very pretty, the 3.0 V6 is a powerhouse and yes they do breakdown but thats 1/2 the fun...Ok it's not but Driving an Alfa would make up for it! Corrados are probably one of the best enthusiast maintained cars around and saying they are all thrashed is bollocks...you buy a 328i to pootle to the shops do you?? do me a favour, it'll get spanked within an inch of it's life until the nikasil coating expires ha ha!!!

Everyone has good and bad experiances with cars, for every unreliable VW story you tell I can tell you an equal BMW unreliable story!

Build quality on my Rado is 1st Class! Probs because they were handbuilt at the Karmann Factory in Onasbrook!

Any this is getting boring now......

Some BMW's suck ass, as do some some VW's! And yes I'm quite happy being a "deluded VAG deviant" How Long the BMW thing lasts.....Who Knows! Probs till I get bored and start hankering after a MK2 again

[rado-steve]

Bond is back in an Aston because VW's were too awesome.

Too awsesome for the gay 1.9 Z3, the Z8 and the 7 series obviously.....

[rado-steve]

WTF?

Go on please tell me how good the X3 is...I'm dying to know what the fountain of all BMW knowledge can muster to pull that turd from the U bend!

[rado-steve]

theres nothing special or exciting about run of the mill models of modern bmw either. there no better or worse than vw/skoda etc etc

Ahhh Sanity At Last!!!

[Alex]

OK, dubbers are deluded scum and them and their bruvved up cloned scrap need exterminating.

How's that Ratch ?

From a man that owns a f*cking SKODA!!!!!!!!

Watch this space, the paedo chariot may be minted and served. I have just bought a LPG'd Chevy suburban. I can fit 3 interiors, 2 sets of rims , a catering size werthers dispenser and a scout troop in the back with room to spare
The lack of parking spaces that are 20 foot turd friendly is the only thing that may prevent it staying on the fleet

you make me laugh pete, Paedo chariot

[Blitz]

I've driven a mk4 golf tdi and a Audi a3 tdi and I was dissapointed. I was expecting them to have great build quality but in fact lots of loose and worn trim. And they were average to drive.

[bss325i]

Mmm do not feed the troll

But while your on...do explain???

About the only good thing is the engine but even that needs 300cc to make essentialy the same power a M20B25, not good for an engine which is 10 years newer in design!

Not only that, the engine (not exactly lightweight!) is mounted so far forward you can almost stand between it and the bulkhead!

This would go so way to explain the horrible, bordering on dangerous handling of the thing!

I have driven several, in fact an ex collegue is a serious VR6 deviant and has a tidy one. We have had it many at time and its not as quick as my sport.

Oh the debates/banter/p!ss taking that has gone on between us!

The rest of the car is a joke as highlighted by B7.

We have a P reg Vento 1.8 auto as a pool car at work and it has just had holes on the strut towers that i could fit my fist though, plated up for the mot.

Its only done 40000 miles!

Well I was meaning the Engine! VW's VR lump is probably one of their most succesful engines that and the evergreen 1.8T! The Mk3 Golf is regarded as a bit of a lemon standard but that has been well documented! Sort the suspension and it's a very capable car! and TBF it uses it's 300cc advantage to make roughly 20bhp more than the 171 the beemer has! VW being extremely conservative with their quoted power figure! Every one I've seen RR'd puts out at least 190bhp, fit one a bit more, the later 24V have 208bhp!

I'm not suprised you managed to beat your mate in his VR! Your e30 weighs about 200kg less and since I'm guessing it's not standard and probably pushes close to or more than 200bhp the BMW wins hands down! think you may find a better match against a corrado VR! Not really the same league though...Put your mates VR up against an e36 328 and the Beemer would be toast! Or have a play with a Mk2 Golf VR6 and then see where your smile is

There is a nice rusty p-reg e36 coupe that lives on my estate, rusty back arches and bubbles all over the sunroof! BMW are just as capable of making rust buckets and friday afternoon cars as VW are!

My sport is standard apart from a 6 branch BTB2 and puts out 185bhp and 190lbft.

VW's figures for the 2.8 VR6 are 174bhp and about 180lbft and his completely stock VR6 put down pretty much these figures on a dyno. 300cc more to get 3bhp more.... awesome!

I am a technician and MOT tester so i have had thousands of cars pass through my hands on a daily bassis and i have NEVER seen an E36 rust as bad a a mk3 golf.

Anyone who says an E36 is a crap car is clearly retarded! BMW did slip up with the Nikasill issue but 90% were sorted under waranty anyhow.

Case in point, my mrs drives a 98 R reg 323i saloon. Its done 170000 miles and its still on the original clutch! It has no oil leaks, no rattles, every elctrical item still works includng the digital dual zone climbate and i would lay money on it still putting out factory power if strapped to the rollers.

Poor build quality i think not!

I am not the sort of person who is biased towards BMW's, i love my 70's and 80's Ford's but for someone to come and say that some italian Alfa or Fiat scrap is better car than an E36 needs to be told! are you on?!

The bottom line is FWD is gay, even to homo's on Top Gear said that last week!

[oakey]

Put your mates VR up against an e36 328 and the Beemer would be toast!

This really is not true. a 328i coupe IS a quick car. Even a earlier 325i could handle a vr6 rado. I test drove a few vr6 rados/golfs when I was a dub deviant but I ended up buying a e30 325i as I found it to be a better car for me

[Nay]

I am not the sort of person who is biased towards BMW's, i love my 70's and 80's Ford's but for someone to come and say that some italian Alfa or Fiat scrap is better car than an E36 needs to be told! :WTF: are you on?!

I'm currently robbing the parents Alfa (156, 2.0L T Spark) as they have just bought a new Mini Cooper S and the Alfa isn't really worth selling. I must say its a lovely car, a drivers car and nice to drive. But its not impressive in any way. Makes a nice noise.... bout it really. And I love the small wooden steering wheel. I'd personally have an E36 anyday over that though.

A friends just bought a VW Mk4 1.8T (yesterday actually). Looked like really good nick, test drive was fine.... So, first day of owning it he decided to see what it can do, and a little bit of hard acceleration has caused it to stall every time he comes to a stop.... And it really isn't quick at all. The turbo is pure shite. I'd rather a Focus ST.... FORD!

[Benho]

I am a technician and MOT tester so i have had thousands of cars pass through my hands on a daily bassis and i have NEVER seen an E36 rust as bad a a mk3 golf.

Anyone who says an E36 is a crap car is clearly retarded! BMW did slip up with the Nikasill issue but 90% were sorted under waranty anyhow.

Case in point, my mrs drives a 98 R reg 323i saloon. Its done 170000 miles and its still on the original clutch! It has no oil leaks, no rattles, every elctrical item still works includng the digital dual zone climbate and i would lay money on it still putting out factory power if strapped to the rollers

rusty mk3 golf? they must have been owned but utter retards then.

my brother owns and thrashes on a regular basis a mk3 gti 16v and the only spec of rust on the thing is by the sunroof and below the rear window. this is only surface rust. however, ive seen e36's which are basically falling to pieces because of the rust =/

as for reliability, straight through drive to the ring, thrash it for 3 days with about 15 laps, then drive straight back home. any problems? no. in fairness, the only problem with the whole convoy was the e36 m3 but that was because he stuffed it on the track!

this debate is simply down to personal experiences and your allegiance to one or the other manufacture.

[bss325i]

this debate is simply down to personal experiences and your allegiance to one or the other manufacture.

No, its down to 11 years in the motor trade seeing first hand what is what!

It is a well known fact the mk3 golfs rot, badly!

Door bottoms
Inner and outer Sills
Strut towers FFS!
Roof skins
Rear arches
Front of bonnets
Slam panels
Front crossmembers
Bulkhead
Tailgates

All common places for them to rot!

E36's generally only rot the,

Rear arches
bottom of front wings
Rear spring upper platfom but this is quite rare

[bss325i]

rusty mk3 golf? they must have been owned but utter retards then.

my brother owns and thrashes on a regular basis a mk3 gti 16v and the only spec of rust on the thing is by the sunroof and below the rear window.

A GOLF, ie 1!

I have seen up close hundreds of the things!

They suck, BIG TIME!

[pacerpete]

Apart from a mk4 TDI wagon to haul frag whilst doing 50 + MPG, why would any one want a VW ?
For just about every model VW, there is a BMW equivalent that is better in every way for similar money

[On_a_Roll]

Can we ban the VW deviants now and be done with it.

[Andyboy]

When it comes to Golfs:

The Mark 1 was alright, 25 years ago. The Mark 2 was a whole load better though and if any Golf deserves to be a classic it's that. But horses for courses. They were both great in their day.
The Mark 3 was a piece of rubbish. A good (for 1994) TDi engine wasn't enough to make up for abysmal handling - the Mark 3 is in fact a toshed up Mark 2 with softer springs and shocks. The build quality was dire - we had two, a GTi 3 door from 1992 and a VR6 from 1995. Squeaks everywhere, rattles from the headlining, unstoppable rust and bits dropping off. They were Ford/GM standard garbage. The VR6 was a useless pudding that did about 22 mpg, handled like a 1750 Maxi (sorry BL) and wouldn't see which way a 328i went. The only one I ever drove and liked was an automatic 3 door - the auto sort of suited the car as a cruiser. As a performance car it was a joke. Okayish in a straight line. It sounded nice in a 2.8i Capri sort of way. A whole tuning industry sprung up around the Mark 3 Golf because there was so much to do to make it a decent car.
The Mark 4 was much better made car and it looked good with a superb interior. But the Ford Focus was about 100 times better to drive and the handling was in a different league because the non GTi versions were so soft and wallowy. But for housewives to potter about in, the Mark 4 Golf is okay. Trouble is, they've become a thug/dickhead chariot now.
The Mark 5 is a nice car and a massive improvement. Everything feels well made, the handling, steering and gearshift are all fine. The Golf Mark 6 is better still. I had the pleasure of using a GT TDi 140 recently and loved it. It did everything well and averaged nearly 60 mpg to boot. As an everyday do everything car I found it to be perfect.

As for regular Passats, Audis etc they are indeed a nicely badged appliance with no memorable driving qualities. Respect though to the W8 Passat, Phaeton and almost any A8. Great cars to buy for £2000 when near the bottom of the depreciation curve.

[Jon_Bmw]

Haven't driven a mk4, but I always liked the mk5 gt tdi sport. A genuinely capeable car and with the 6 speed stick or dsg and I am sure they would return a proper 50mpg. Time will tell how well they are built I guess, but everything felt pretty solid. Only downside was that it was a fairly harsh ride, but with 170bhp they can't have it floating about and the 17inch wheels didn't help ride comfort. Equally I liked the passats just as much, again the 170bhp ones. If you could ignore the depreciation(compared to a golf, not a mondeo!) that is a good load lugger.

Also I liked the mk2 golfs, but I had a one as a first car, and most people adore their first car.

BMW do pretty much everything better but on a brand new car the premium can be eye watering.

[Mandeep_VW]

Previous to my E30 Sport i owned a 25th Anniversay Golf 1.8T 180BHP.

The golf felt a quicker car, however no where near as much fun to drive as the E30!

[B7]

this debate is simply down to personal experiences and your allegiance to one or the other manufacture.

No, its down to 11 years in the motor trade seeing first hand what is what!

It is a well known fact the mk3 golfs rot, badly!

Door bottoms
Inner and outer Sills
Strut towers FFS!
Roof skins
Rear arches
Front of bonnets
Slam panels
Front crossmembers
Bulkhead
Tailgates

All common places for them to rot!

E36's generally only rot the,

Rear arches
bottom of front wings
Rear spring upper platfom but this is quite rare

you're spot on my man. You knew my 99 323 convertible and was there a spec of rot on that at 10 years old on 69000 miles? It was basically as close to as new as you could get.

My mk3 GTI was a f*cking rotting sorry spastic at 7 years old and on 73000k. Andyboys right when he says they rattle. The sunroof in my Mk3 sounded like it was falling out, The doors rattled constantly because the door panel clips kept breaking (I still have a stock of them in the garage now!), the wiper linkages were changed 3 times to try and stop the knocking and VW had to delete the glove box because it had the passengers airbag!!!!! WTF is that all about? The only thing that was any good were the front seats. Why? cause it had the optional recaros.............and thats because they were made by Recaro not VW in 1995!!!!!!

Build wise there is no comparson.