Future M-cars Turbo Powered

[triggerhappy21]

So it looks like the current line of M cars are to be the last naturally aspirated.

Next gen M3 and M5 are opting for 6 pot turbo and twin turbo V8 respectively.

Personally i think its a shame, any thoughts?

[oakey]

It is a shame but how can they compete with other manufacturers by staying N/A? MPG is so much more important to people nowadays

[Morat]

repost, but... it had to happen. Seems to me the latest M5 only just held together and anything more extreme than that V10 on the road would be slightly mad!

[Blitz]

They don't make them like they used to.

[Hyperion]

End of a legacy, but i think it is what they need to do!
audi and merc are doing it to beat them so now they need to up their game.

[Felix79]

They don't make them like they used to.

1st thing I wanted to say was "thank god" but then thought actually your right , the level of enginering is not the same as it was for longevity.

Wouldn't a turbo actually make the cars more thirsty than a N/A one? Ferarri manage to make a good range of their cars with out a turbo ( I can only think of the F40 with it's twin turbo v8 ) so surley BMW can still do it?

[ShepsEvo3]

Ah, they did a 308tB and a Mondial QV tB too... both turbo cars

[madaboutthe30]

MPG is so much more important to people nowadays

A person that is willing to pay over 40k for an M car isnt really going to be bothered about the fuel consumption.

Those concerned about the fuel consumption are already those driving around in 118d or 320ds.

[Boyraceruk]

And turbos aren't so bad on fuel consumption next to 5 litre V8s and V10s. I was wondering why BMW weren't turboing cars actually, it's the low-hanging fruit of performance. Plus you don't need a quarter-ton engine to make 300+bhp any more, you can use a much lighter engine to make a faster vehicle.

NA or FI, carbs or injection, whatever I use I'm only interested in performance. To have an ideological opposition to something which makes a car better is, I think, stupid.

[Jon_Bmw]

And turbos aren't so bad on fuel consumption next to 5 litre V8s and V10s. I was wondering why BMW weren't turboing cars actually, it's the low-hanging fruit of performance. Plus you don't need a quarter-ton engine to make 300+bhp any more, you can use a much lighter engine to make a faster vehicle.

NA or FI, carbs or injection, whatever I use I'm only interested in performance. To have an ideological opposition to something which makes a car better is, I think, stupid.

+ 1

Off boost they are super efficient as well. Try getting more than 20mpg around town out of my 540i. But a 2.5 litre turbo which would have the same performance, if not more, would nail 30mpg.

[capri_rob]

But what were the reasons manufacturers moved away from Turbocharging ? for example Ford had the RS Cosworth as well as RS Escorts and Fiesta's - a good run of Turbo cars from the mid 80's to early 90's and then the plug was pulled ( why ? ) and the "Performance" versions were all naturally aspirated after that.

Problem with turbo cars is that by their nature they are going to be more highly stressed than a naturally aspirated motor - manufacturers will over-engineer them up to a point to compensate for that but Turbo car buyers will always want to mess about with them when they get used to the boost - which will lead to plenty of them with blown head gaskets in a cloud of steam at the side of the road.

I'd still like one though

[triggerhappy21]

And turbos aren't so bad on fuel consumption next to 5 litre V8s and V10s. I was wondering why BMW weren't turboing cars actually, it's the low-hanging fruit of performance. Plus you don't need a quarter-ton engine to make 300+bhp any more, you can use a much lighter engine to make a faster vehicle.

NA or FI, carbs or injection, whatever I use I'm only interested in performance. To have an ideological opposition to something which makes a car better is, I think, stupid.

Hmm... Good point and nicely put.

Suppose FI just seems like an easy option though. I think people appreciate the engineering required to squeeze massive hp from NA engines.

It's probably a pretty dated viewpoint going back to 80's Group B & F1 though. Like what was mentioned, getting 30mpg out of a 300+bhp car is the real show of engineering prowess these days.

[Blitz]

Turbo charging is an easy way out. There too lazy to do another NA engine.

[Morat]

More power and less weight: what's not to like? Turbo engines are great fun and give loads of torque, and torque is what it's all about imo.

[stonesie]

It's already happening, the M versions of the X5 and X6 have a twin turbo 4.4 V8, 555bhp and 501 Lb:Ft..... would go farely well in a E30

[R4N_S_S]

turbo power is the way forward.

reason turbo cars were stopped in the 90's was due to emissions and bureacracy, etc.

[Jon_Bmw]

It's already happening, the M versions of the X5 and X6 have a twin turbo 4.4 V8, 555bhp and 501 Lb:Ft..... would go farely well in a E30

Hmm, don't tell me things like that. I now know where to get a pair of turbo manifolds from.

[stonesie]

You know the turbo's sit within the Vee? makes them much more compact... No turbo Vs chassis rail conflict

[Jon_Bmw]

That must have opposite inlet/exhaust ports to my heads then, or some crazy complicated exhaust manifold!!

Any pictures, not that I should be enquiring really...

[stonesie]

Google provides..











It's engine code is N63... more wiring than enough

[Jon_Bmw]

Complicated engine that, but as suspected it is the reverse head design of mine. Boo!

[Rich_W]

So long as Audi and Merc don't fit Turbo versions of the C63 and RS4. The M3 will NEVER be Turbo'ed.

[Eddie25]

Fair play i say.

Can't beat the noise of a v8 but there has been the 2002 turbo before, the Alpina E34's and E30 M3s with turbos and didn't they do a turbo 7 series many moons ago?

[Blitz]

So long as Audi and Merc don't fit Turbo versions of the C63 and RS4. The M3 will NEVER be Turbo'ed.

I'm afraid they are.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=259763

[320ise]

a good read that was, it is the end of an era though and may effect the sales to the hard core nasp mpower fans but i suppose will attract many boost junkies lol! i think its ashame as ///m will no longer be ///m to me anymore as it stands (in my eyes) for somthing different now. you can see it in the future when people are selling e36,46,92,39 etc m5 and m3's "last of the real M cars allot better than the turbo rubbish!" etc lol

[Alex]

why not build an N/A V16

i would like them to stay N/A but everyone else is going that way, give it 5-6 years and i recon most petrol cars will be turbo charged aswell, except small town cars and cheap cars etc

who knows petrol might become popular again

[anothere21323i]

Just have a look at the current 335i - I'd say that's easily the best 6 cylinder engine BMW has ever produced - silky smooth ,economic, very torquey and powerful. And it's a twin turbo.

And probably nicer to drive than the current M3.....

[Alex]

Just have a look at the current 335i - I'd say that's easily the best 6 cylinder engine BMW has ever produced - silky smooth ,economic, very torquey and powerful. And it's a twin turbo.

And probably nicer to drive than the current M3.....

what about the 135i

[e30bmlover]

i do like the 1 series... the 135 would be a weapon!! ( with a remap )

[anothere21323i]

Yup, 135i is an awesome weapon but maybe I'm just getting a bit soft in my old age - 335i is a much more roomy and comfortable car.

Plus a LOT more stable whilst maxxing it out on the autobahn....

[Rich_W]

So long as Audi and Merc don't fit Turbo versions of the C63 and RS4. The M3 will NEVER be Turbo'ed.

I'm afraid they are.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=259763

I'll believe it when I see it quite frankly! Nearly all manufacturers will be missing Euro 5 emissions so i expect a change in the rules before anything drastic happens.

oh and you do know that article was from Evo. A magazine so very keen on writing "Evo understands" when it means "Evo made up"