Another e30 V8 (m62 b35 tu) project

[Jonsku]

if you get the 6 speed, don't listen to people telling you it won't go un as one unit - It does! Jack the front high enough and remove the "heater blower plate thingy on the bulkhead", and it'll drop in nicely.
(still f*** tight, but the 6 speed is heavy, and probably more of a pig to do separate unless you've got proper transmission dollies)

Oh yes it does I wouldn't want to bolt the transmission on under the car, it's way too heavy for that and there isn't much space after all..

[PiLLLe]

Don't realy know, what is wrong with the pics. There seems to be a small problem with moj-album.com or something.

Anyway, things are moving along, i'm mostly cleaning and washing parts (dash, all the plastic parts...etc) to get the smells out of the car (i like my cars, clean and with nice fresh smell to it ), lots of small parts are missing (due to the fact i bougth car in allready dismantled state
This weekend i'll probably go and see what's up with the 4.4 and if's what i expect it to be (good shape, with no additional work needed on it), i'll buy it, and hurry with the instalation. I have roughly a month to finish it, and still, I have things that are bothering me, like cooling, wirinig, exhaustm, propshaft, hydraulic handbrake, fuel system and much more The list of things to do, just keeps going on

[suzie650]

Jesus! You made it hard on yourself with that left manifold!

Good job you had the car on high dollies: if it's too low, you run out of space to "tip the engine into the bay" (the g/box hits the floor before you've got the sump in)

[PiLLLe]

Well this is it. Remember the 4.4 i was telling you about. Well i have seen it, and it's in a terrible condition. Left head valve cover has a hole that is about 10 square cm big. The wires have been cut allround. Half of it it's missing, the oil dipstick is missing, so i'm thinking that motor is probably good only for a table or something. I think it could be saved, but not sure, of the condition of the insides of the engine. But if it could be saved, do you think it's worth it. I could use wiring harnest from my 3.5l engine, but then i have the same problem as i did before no diy for wiring problem
But then again, i'm thinking what about a speed signal. Does anyone know what kind of signal is it. Will it be ok, if i just took the signal from one of the valve position sensors or could i simulate it somehow?

Anyway, bottom line i'm screwed don't know what to do, and i have less than a month to finish it

[Jonsku]

Oh damn, bad situation :-/

You could use all the ancillaries of b35 engine with the b44 but anyhow, you won't know in what shape the engine is before you start it.

The engine works fine without speed signal, though you can rob it from instrument cluster but it only affects +250kmh speeds if i've understood correctly.

[PiLLLe]

But what i was told, is that if you don't have speed signal, engine revs to 5.5k and then ecu switches to safe mode.
I know i can get the speed signal from instrument cluster, but i'm afraid that it's not the same as an e39 original signal. Mainly becouse the e30 is more or les + - type of signal (hope you understand..) and in a e39 it's all digital.

[Jonsku]

But what i was told, is that if you don't have speed signal, engine revs to 5.5k and then ecu switches to safe mode.
I know i can get the speed signal from instrument cluster, but i'm afraid that it's not the same as an e39 original signal. Mainly becouse the e30 is more or les + - type of signal (hope you understand..) and in a e39 it's all digital.

Well, that could be the situation (not tried myself) but as i've understood the engine works just fine without the signal.

You can take the signal out of E30 instrument cluster, not sure what kind of signal it's (or what kind is needed), though.

Gotta try out then, right?

[PiLLLe]

Will do that coz9 what do i've got to lose except ecu maby for now i'm waiting for that 6speed tranny, and then i'll move on to instalation of the engine.
Found a exhaust silencers that were on tuned s50, so i think they'll do just fine so for now i'm doing most of the easy work, like changing suspension, instaling rollbar, brake assembly, cleaning up the stuff and such

A couple of pics:





Talk about clearance

[PiLLLe]

Man this wiring can be a such a headache,but I'm half way there. Got allmost all of the wires marked up, and as I see it, it will be a miracle if it starts

Btw which throttle cable shoul I use?

[suzie650]

A rhd e34 one worked for me, and I'd expect any lhd e34/32 one to do the job fine. No guarantee though.

[Jonsku]

I've normal E34 V8 throttle cable, works fine but it makes quite a big round on the intake manifold. Doesn't matter, though.

Hopefully you got the thing started. Remember that you don't have to connect all the wires at the same time. Only ECU +, starter and petrol pump ;)

[PiLLLe]

I know that I see there's a lot of wires i'm not going to use but one thing that i did found, is that germans made it a bit complicated, becouse let's take engine control lamps for example. They go from engine to light module, from there they go to instrument cluster, and some of them go back to DME/ecu. Bit stupid

Anyway let's say i've some idea which wire is for what, so now i have engine on the stand, to finish up the exhaust manifolds, and then i'll drop the engine into the car, and test if my wiring is any good

Stay tuned updates will follow

btw WDS is not so bad, after you get used to it it requires a lot of clicking to get a simple information what pin of what connector is for what

[v8kris]

Yes, or use one from different body. Personally i wouldn't put the ABS pump too near to wheels / ground, too much sand etc flying around there..

In the 2nd pic, where has the brake MC and servo been placed, or is it not running a conventional setup?

Kris

[oze30]

it's still there, behind and under the fusebox. You can just see it. Im guessing they dropped the engine as low and as far forward as possible for the MC to clear the left bank and used a very flat servo.

[suzie650]

The S62 sump is much less deep than on the m6x, so that will have helped as well.

[Jonsku]

it's still there, behind and under the fusebox. You can just see it. Im guessing they dropped the engine as low and as far forward as possible for the MC to clear the left bank and used a very flat servo.

Firewall has been modified a lot in that car, and the MC / servo is moved to the left quite much.

Friend of mine test-drived that car. It's really a piece of art, he says, and goes like hell

[Frenchguy]

Hi,

any updates?

[PiLLLe]

Hi

Sadly no major updates
I'm doing small things like replacing old brake lines with new ones ( i dont trust them 20years old rubber and alu pipes), and i'm trying to fit, those huge exhaust mufflers i bought... (pics will follow, just need to find time to make ones) Oh yes and i found another m60 4.0, so engine is still not in.

But to be honest, i just can't find time to do anything with my bimmer. I have too much work (job), my truck keeps braking down (it's third time this year I'm changing my brakes, had some oil pressure problems, broken rear axle...), and when i do have some spare time, i need it to rest a bit it's not easy to do 10 to 14hours shitfs

btw is there any difference in size of a clutch plate m62b35 and m60b40?

[suzie650]

btw is there any difference in size of a clutch plate m62b35 and m60b40?

Yes, m62b35 is supposed to be 240mm while M60b40 certainly is 265mm. But if you've got the flywheel with the rest of the clutch, there's nothing stopping you putting a clutch unit on an engine it wasn't planned for. - the splines and outer dimensions are the same as far as I know.

The one thing you have to be aware of is that the m62bxx engines have the crank (TDC/rpm) sensor on the flywheel, and that therefore only a m62bxx flywheel should be used on these engines unless you want to hit major trouble.
(and the pickup point for TDC is offset between m62 and m60 by about 20 degrees as well, so no easy way around)

...

Hi Greg!

[Jonsku]

Hopefully you get her up'n'running for this summer anyways

It's the old dilemma, when you've money you don't have time and vice versa..

btw is there any difference in size of a clutch plate m62b35 and m60b40?

Yes, m62b35 is supposed to be 240mm while M60b40 certainly is 265mm. But if you've got the flywheel with the rest of the clutch, there's nothing stopping you putting a clutch unit on an engine it wasn't planned for. - the splines and outer dimensions are the same as far as I know.

Yes, but remember that the clutch axle diameter is different in 6-speed and 5-speed boxes.

The one thing you have to be aware of is that the m62bxx engines have the crank (TDC/rpm) sensor on the flywheel, and that therefore only a m62bxx flywheel should be used on these engines unless you want to hit major trouble.
(and the pickup point for TDC is offset between m62 and m60 by about 20 degrees as well, so no easy way around

Yes but you don't have to worry about that because in M60 yo don't have any sensors on bellhousing. That problem occurs only when trying to use non-M62 flywheel in M62. S62 has also the tooted flywheel and that exactly has the 20deg offset in TDS ..

[suzie650]

The one thing you have to be aware of is that the m62bxx engines have the crank (TDC/rpm) sensor on the flywheel, and that therefore only a m62bxx flywheel should be used on these engines unless you want to hit major trouble.
(and the pickup point for TDC is offset between m62 and m60 by about 20 degrees as well, so no easy way around

Yes but you don't have to worry about that because in M60 yo don't have any sensors on bellhousing. That problem occurs only when trying to use non-M62 flywheel in M62. S62 has also the tooted flywheel and that exactly has the 20deg offset in TDS ..

That's what I meant, but as PiLLe might find another engine by the time he puts one in, I wanted to warn him.

I didn't know that the input shafts were different between 5 and 6 speed, though.
IIRC the e39 m5 and manual e39 540 (using the same s6s420g) also have a 240mm clutch plate... only the m60b40 engined cars had a 265mm plate.

I certainly have a 240mm clutch in front of my 6-speed box.

[PiLLLe]

About the clutch, i was just curious becouse i'm selling this engine, and i might take off the clutch, just to have a spare one that's the first reason, the second one is, that i found a m60b40 engine with 6 speed trany, but the clutch is fried so i was thinking of swaping them

And again i have a question, or should i say the buyer has one:) what's the tunning potential of a m62b35 engine?

Btw thanks for help and usefull info guys!

[Jonsku]

About the clutch, i was just curious becouse i'm selling this engine, and i might take off the clutch, just to have a spare one that's the first reason, the second one is, that i found a m60b40 engine with 6 speed trany, but the clutch is fried so i was thinking of swaping them

Yes you could use the pressure-plate of m62b35 but the clutch disc won't fit. M62B44 or S62B50 clutch discs will fit but i'd get new pressure-plate and pressure-bearing at the same time also. Not nice to open the whole package too soon again ..

And again i have a question, or should i say the buyer has one:) what's the tunning potential of a m62b35 engine?

I've heard of 350hp "stock" M62B44 engines so i'd imagine M62B35 should do almost 300hp with swapping M60B40 intake manifold (bigger) and making some rolling road tuning

[PiLLLe]

Update

I've sold the m62 engine, and it should be instaled by the end of this week, and if it runs ok, i'll go and get me this new m60b40 6speed that i've found

So hopefully i'll get the car finished sometime next month

Major issues that remain are radiator (300+€ at local bmw dealership, plus there is a delivery time of one week to one month) and driveshaft.

[Jonsku]

Update

I've sold the m62 engine, and it should be instaled by the end of this week, and if it runs ok, i'll go and get me this new m60b40 6speed that i've found

So hopefully i'll get the car finished sometime next month

Major issues that remain are radiator (300+€ at local bmw dealership, plus there is a delivery time of one week to one month) and driveshaft.

Great it's going ahead!

I bought my new e28 535 radiator from ebay.de for 120e and it shipped in 1 week .. ;)

Driveshaft shouldn't be a problem, just measure it and get it done in lsome machine shop.

[PiLLLe]

Which one did you buy? Nissens? Valeo or something like berh?

About the driveshaft.... that's the plan, I'm just a bit afraid, we might screw it up somewhere and then i'll have those annoing vibrations

[oze30]

If you go 6 speed, you'll need the front half of the prop, and the e30 rear. Rad, I can get a custom one made up for 250 quid. Triple core in an E28 size and shape.

[Frenchguy]

...

Hi Greg!

Hi,
if you think I'm the one owning a 4-door S50 E30, then you've mistaken me with someone else.

Update

I've sold the m62 engine, and it should be instaled by the end of this week, and if it runs ok, i'll go and get me this new m60b40 6speed that i've found

Keep us posted!
Will you keep your alternator relocation idea? I quite like the idea of keeping the rame rails unmolested but I'm having a hard time figuring out how to re-route the belts while retaining power steering...

Anyway, good luck to you!

[PiLLLe]

Hi.

Yes, the alternator location will stay the same. Belts are no problem, i just have to messure the lenght, and when you have the lenght it's not so hard to find one that fits from the catalog.

Well the new hold up, is that the buyer never came for the engine. It's still sitting in my garage, and till it's there, i cant go and pick up the new one. Since he paid half of the money, i don't know what's his plan. Unfortunatly i lost his phone number, so i hope notthing happened to him.

Anyway, at this moment i'm playing arround with the exhaust. Thise silencers i bought, are huge, so i'm still playing arround with them. I have 2 silencers, but the first one si so huge it sticks under the car for additional 5cm, so i'm afraid i'll rip it off somewhere. (once you see the pics, you'll see how huge they are).

Anyway updates will follow

[suzie650]

...

Hi Greg!

Hi,
if you think I'm the one owning a 4-door S50 E30, then you've mistaken me with someone else.

Will you keep your alternator relocation idea? I quite like the idea of keeping the rame rails unmolested but I'm having a hard time figuring out how to re-route the belts while retaining power steering...

Anyway, good luck to you!

Sorry, I did. He's 325igreg or summit like that on here... But there was a frenchguy on e30.de and I must have mixed people up. I'm getting lost with names as I do not have much time to be on forums anymore.

Why would you want to relocate the alternator? It's tight, but it fits. It might possibly hit on lift-off if your mounts are knackered, but I haven't had the problem so far. (E30 rubber mounts)
What certainly doesn't fit is the A/C compressor. And I haven't had time yet to sort something out for this one.

[oze30]

I dented the chassis rail just enough so the alternator doesn't hit. What problems are you having with the PAS? The setup I used was an M60b30 Early pas pump without self levelling suspension, and it was very similar to an M20 pump. haven;t tried the A/C Seb, what's the issue with it where it is?

[Jonsku]

Yes you can fit AC compressor but the body needs little modification. Friend of mine fitted it in his E30 V8, don't know if i'd do the same some day

[suzie650]

The alternator never hit on mine, but the original A/C compressor definitely did and would have needed a mega dent put in the rail to fit. When I get the time, I'll look for a smaller unit and modify the mounting points.

[Frenchguy]

Why would you want to relocate the alternator? It's tight, but it fits. It might possibly hit on lift-off if your mounts are knackered, but I haven't had the problem so far. (E30 rubber mounts)
What certainly doesn't fit is the A/C compressor. And I haven't had time yet to sort something out for this one.

Thanks for the input,

well Jonsku and a few others felt the need to dent the frame rail, that's why I was wondering about it. But then maybe there were different sizes of alternators fitted, with some giving more clearance?

[oze30]

Watercooled alternators will fit fine. The mountigns are cast into the block. Bolt on ones like the normal E30 versions are seperate so they stick out further than the watercooled ones.

Seb, did you drop the subframe or standard?