325 wont turn over!!!!!

[H-M3]

I drove it friday night, went back to start it sat midday. bugger thing wont start! tried jump starting it no joy. it tries to start but just dont turn. tried jump wiring without the fuel relay but still no joy. it was playing up normally first thing in the morning, it was difficult to start, but would eventually start. But now it wont statr at all!!!
help

[smithy318i]

Will it not turn at all, or just not start?
Check for spark
Check fuel supply

[rowemeister]

If its cranking over I would suggest its the fuel pump. Lift the rear seat up and twat the black oval cover (drivers side) whilst turning the key. If it fires up you either have a bad conection or dodgy pump.

[H-M3]

Will it not turn at all, or just not start?
Check for spark
Check fuel supply

sorry for the late response. it turns but fails to start!

[Simon13]

has your flywheel lost too many teeth?!
stater motor is ok then?

[rowemeister]

Loosen fuel pipe to fuel rail, if there is no fuel pressure it's defo the pump.

[H-M3]

easy guys this is all new to me.. sorry ill have to check when i get home from work that is. Bloody blackwall tunnel is closed or something.. Il give the fuel pump a try see if any joy.

[H-M3]

has your flywheel lost too many teeth?!
stater motor is ok then?

sorri simon what the flywheel and how do i check the starter motor?

cheers guys

[smithy318i]

sorri simon what the flywheel and how do i check the starter motor?

that doesn't mean 'what's the flywheel' does it?

[Simon13]

i think it does so tell him smithy!

[smithy318i]

Okay, Okay!

The flywheel is a big hunk of metal inside your engine with teeth round the outside edge (ring gear)
It is attached to your engine and rotates.
The starter motor turns this disc when you turn the key.

the teeth on the outer edge get worn down and sometimes broken off.

If the starter motor turns but the engine doesn't, this is a sign of the broken teeth.
If the starter motor makes a clanking noise when you turn the key, this is a sign of a worn starter motor and/or ring gear.



If you know what a flywheel is, then disregard all of the above, and then shoot me in the head!

If your engine turns over, also disregard the above, but don't shoot me!

[Brianmoooore]

If you want us to sort your problems, then you need to give accurate details of the syptoms.
I still can't work out if the engine turns over or not!

[H-M3]

cheers guys. dont worry im not gonna shoot anyone except myself, coz this is really annoying me. the engine does turn but it does not start. The head was done about a thousand miles ago, and as i said it was all running fine the night before!!

Thanks for the decription of the flywheel guys well explained.

NB: sorry for the late replies, its only im at work and were restricted to use the internet at working hours. sick huh?

[smithy318i]

Okay, I don't want to sound like im taking down to you, but this is an easy to follow guide to what you should check.

Disconnect one of the HT leads from one of the spark plugs (i assume you know what they are)
Sick a screwdriver in the end of the wire and lie it down near a bare metal part of the bodywork (like the front suspension mount.
Turn the key to start the car. You should see sparks jumping from the screwdriver to the bodywork. (DONT HOLD THE HT LEAD IN YOUR HAND, because you will get a NASTY shock or two)

If you have sparks, put the HT lead back on the plug.

Next, loosen the fuel pipe clip as it enters the engine, The fuel system is under pressure so you should expect to see fuel leaking or spraying from the loose clamp.

Do both of these checks and let us know the results.

[rowemeister]

I have had this fault on two E30's and it was the fuel pump on one and the fuel pump connector loose on the other.
Another way to check the pump is to switch on your ignition, remove the fuel pump relay and short the two appropriate pins to fire up the pump. If the pump is ok you will hear it kick into life and you will hear the fuel in the pipes until full pressure is there.
With these shorted and the pump running start the engine, if it fires up then bingo.

[H-M3]

[quote="smithy318i"]Okay, I don't want to sound like im taking down to you, but this is an easy to follow guide to what you should check.

Cheers smithy, ill give that a try when i get home tonight. sorry has anyone got a picture of the fuel pipe in connection? coz i dont want to pull the wrong hose off.

cheers everyone for the detailed and helpfull advice.

[rowemeister]

Now don't laugh but I have drawn a really good quality pic on paint. Hope it helps.

So basicaly loosen the fuel pipe(wrote in red) going to the fuel rail.
If loads of fuel comes out or squirts out the fuel pump is ok. If it dribbles look at the fuel pump.

[H-M3]

[quote="rowemeister"]Now don't laugh but I have drawn a really good quality pic on paint. Hope it helps.

So basicaly loosen the fuel pipe(wrote in red) going to the fuel rail.
If loads of fuel comes out or squirts out the fuel pump is ok. If it dribbles look at the fuel pump.

Rowe, you should become a artist mate. na serious thats a good drawing. perhaps we could ask our kind moderator's to make an art book section.

thanks mate i will do that, so should i not buy a fuel pump relay yet?

[Brianmoooore]

thanks mate i will do that, so should i not buy a fuel pump relay yet?

Not yet.
Remove the fuel feed pipe and turn the ignition on. Fuel should spurt from the pipe for about two or three seconds. If it does, crank the engine over a couple of times on the key. Fuel should start to flow again, while the engine is turning.
If it passes both these tests, then the fuel pump or relay are unlikely to be your problem.
If fuel doesn't flow out of the pipe, then remove the fuel pump relay (orange relay under a cover on the left hand inner wing - if were talking about a 6 pot ?).
With a small piece of wire, link pins 30 and 87 of the relay's socket. This should make the pump run.
If it does, then try a new relay, if it doesn't then you probably need a new fuel pump.

[rowemeister]

Artist lol.

But no dont do the relay yet m8!

What Brianmooore is saying is correct.

[Brianmoooore]

Probably should have said that it would be advisable to jam the open fuel hose into a container of some sort, or have someone to help you.
It's not really a good idea to have unleaded squirting all over your garage.

[rowemeister]

Good point!
BUT If you just loosen it a little it will squirt a little (unless there is no fuel pressure) and then quickly tighten it back up. We are only talking tiny amounts of fuel coming out!!!
Of course if your not sure have a rag or container ready!!

[H-M3]

thanks guys again. I did do as you guys said. I took the fuel pipe off and tried to turn over there was no squirt of fuel. although there was petrol in the pipe. which was propably from before. I also tried the spark plug check and there was continious spark. Just on a second note there is two orange relays and one white one I took the middle one off and tried jump wiring it as u guys said. Is that the right relay or is it one of the others? cheers guys I hope its not my fuel pump!!! how much do they cost??

[rowemeister]

Its the yellow one mate. Far right!
Remember to take out bottom of rear seat and the black oval cover behind the drivers seat and check the 2 pin connector to the pump (3 wire one is for the sender unit). Tap the connector whilst cranking engine to see if it springs to life.

[H-M3]

Its the yellow one mate. Far right!
Remember to take out bottom of rear seat and the black oval cover behind the drivers seat and check the 2 pin connector to the pump (3 wire one is for the sender unit). Tap the connector whilst cranking engine to see if it springs to life.

Rowe, buddy i tried without the middle relay jumped that one, so should i try with the far right one? remember this is a 325 were on about.

thanks again buddy

[rowemeister]

Mine is a 325 mate. My relays are as follows:-

White is for injectors etc and yellow for pump my middle socket is empty.

*Just added pic*

[H-M3]

thats strange buddy coz ive got 3 relays as i said, so ill check tonight with the far right one. Also on the haynes manual it mentions fuse no 11 (fuse box)is related to the fuel pump????

I dont know why you have 2 relays when mine has 3????

[rowemeister]

You must have something mine does'nt mate. Like aircon or cruise control?

[H-M3]

You must have something mine does'nt mate. Like aircon or cruise control?

I wish! its a se model tho..... I was told my car has a larger petrol tank.

perhaps anyone else might be able to shed some light on this 2 and 3 relay issue???

Cheers Rowe

[Brianmoooore]

The third relay is for the heater of a four wire lambda sensor, and wouldn't normally be fitted unless you have a cat.
The fuel pump relay is the one which has a green/purple wire (amongst others) going to it.
You can't really go by the position of the relay, because the bases unclip easily and can be replaced in the wrong order.
Check for power with a 12V 5W lamp at fuse no11. If it's a OE fuse, youcan touch your probe on the fusewire without removing it.

[H-M3]

that explains it then Brian, my f, ing things got a CAT. which i want to remove. so thats probably the other relay..
cheers Brian.

[rowemeister]

Nice one Brian. I don't like cats, much prefer dogs!

[H-M3]

i better try the bulb test on the fuse. do i just place the bottom of the bulb on the fuse wire?

[Brianmoooore]

You need a bulb with a couple of bits of wire attached. Something like the parking lamp from an old headlamp. or an indicator side repeater.
One wire touching the fuse wire, other wire to a clean earth (eg. bonnet rear catch)

[Brianmoooore]

Don't forget fuse is only live for a couple of seconds after switching the ignition on, and when the engine is turning.