Fitting bucket seats without a roll cage - help appreciated

[moggy]

I've noticed in the zoners track car thread that some of you have fitted bucket seats without rollcages.

I've got two bucket seats sat at home waiting to be fitted. We aren't going to fit a roll cage for some time. I think we are OK with the bolting of the seats to the floor, but we are undure where to attach the harnesses.

I can see some pics in the other thread but I wouldn't mind a little more detail of where the harnesses have been secured to?

Any help appreciated.

The car is being stripped this weekend so it would be nice to fit the seats at the same time.

[1an]

ive got my harness mounted to where the rear seat belts bolt into the car,

im also running without a cage which in a ideal world isnt a good thing just incase you do roll the car.

[UweM3]

ive got my harness mounted to where the rear seat belts bolt into the car,

im also running without a cage which in a ideal world isnt a good thing just incase you do roll the car.

In my opinion that's the worst place to mount your harness. Just look at the "triangle" this creates and your spine acting as one side of the triangle.
Just imagine how this triangle will react if you have an frontal impact.

@moggy
from my point of view you have two options:
A: keep the three point OEM belts (where to attach the bottom belt with the OEM seat removed???)

B: buy/make a harness bar (do a search here, there is info)

[1an]

Uwe, i understand exactly what you are saying but i have fitting instructions on a piece of paper in front of me and they state the sholder straps can be moutned at a maximum of 45degres which is what they are in my car. im not going to argue as i know that they should go on a roll cage but they can be fitted at that angle,

[Trise30rally]

I used the oem rear belt mounts and drilled a hole in the transmission tunnel for the left hand bottom one.

If you are using 6 point harnesses which i am, i drilled 2 holes under the seat and used the fia approved backing plates.

[UweM3]

Uwe, i understand exactly what you are saying but i have fitting instructions on a piece of paper in front of me and they state the sholder straps can be moutned at a maximum of 45degres which is what they are in my car. im not going to argue as i know that they should go on a roll cage but they can be fitted at that angle,

I started with "in my opinion" didn't say "hey you're doing wrong ! "

[moggy]

@moggy
from my point of view you have two options:
A: keep the three point OEM belts (where to attach the bottom belt with the OEM seat removed???)

B: buy/make a harness bar (do a search here, there is info)

Thanks for the fast replies, and that what I was thinking about the mounting at the rear seatbelt points.

In answer to your two points:

A. The OEM seat has the seat belt attachment built into the side, so how could I CONTINUE TO USE THE OEM SEATBELTS?

b. It's a 4 door - I'm not sure how a harness bar could be put in?

[AlpineAde]

I have a Recaro shell and I use the OEM belt.

Schroth, for example, make a 4 point harness that bolt mount to rear seat lap belt anchorages or wrap mounting to a harness bar.

[UweM3]

@moggy
from my point of view you have two options:
A: keep the three point OEM belts (where to attach the bottom belt with the OEM seat removed???)

B: buy/make a harness bar (do a search here, there is info)

Thanks for the fast replies, and that what I was thinking about the mounting at the rear seatbelt points.

In answer to your two points:

A. The OEM seat has the seat belt attachment built into the side, so how could I CONTINUE TO USE THE OEM SEATBELTS?

b. It's a 4 door - I'm not sure how a harness bar could be put in?

You will have to make a compromise. If you want to run bucket seats with harness ---> loose your back seats
There is no such thing as free lunch. But there is always a solution if you are prepared to spend enough money to overcome possible downsides.
But what's the point of that? Or you just accept that with your circumstances it doesn't make sens to fit bucket seats and get some "sport" seats suitable for the OEM belts.

"A. The OEM seat has the seat belt attachment built into the side, so how could I CONTINUE TO USE THE OEM SEATBELTS?"

that was the point I am making, there is nothing to attache the belt too. Unless you fabricate something and mount it throught the seat bolts in the floor to transfer the load.
AND YOU DON'T NEED TO SHOUT AT ME, I am not deaf

[moggy]

I have a Recaro shell and I use the OEM belt.

Schroth, for example, make a 4 point harness that bolt mount to rear seat lap belt anchorages or wrap mounting to a harness bar.

Don't understand the 1st para - can you elaborate?

[moggy]

A. The OEM seat has the seat belt attachment built into the side, so how could I CONTINUE TO USE THE OEM SEATBELTS?"

that was the point I am making, there is nothing to attache the belt too. Unless you fabricate something and mount it throught the seat bolts in the floor to transfer the load.
AND YOU DON'T NEED TO SHOUT AT ME, I am not deaf

Thanks

Oh, I hav every intention of losing the back seat, but as you said I'm a bit concerned about the extra stress that could be caused on the back.

Could I leave the passenger seat in and connect the seatbelt to the passenger belt attachment?

[AlpineAde]

Don't understand the 1st para - can you elaborate?

I run a Recaro Pole Position racing shell (fixed bucket) in my 325i and I use the OEM seatbelt. Keeping the OEM seatbelt presented no drama whatsoever.

[moggy]

so how have you connected the OEM seatbelt without the seatbelt attachment on the OEM seats?

[AlpineAde]

so how have you connected the OEM seatbelt without the seatbelt attachment on the OEM seats?

Like this:




right click and choose "show/view image" for the bigger pic.

I can take a more detailed one for you tomorrow if you wish.

[1an]

with my harness i have drilled a hole through the gear box tunnel, and using a spreader plate and a harness eyebolt have mounted my harness there.

[moggy]

so how have you connected the OEM seatbelt without the seatbelt attachment on the OEM seats?

Like this:




right click and choose "show/view image" for the bigger pic.

I can take a more detailed one for you tomorrow if you wish.

Thanks

So it appears the part nearest the door is held in place by a bolt through the seat and floor. What about the side nearest the gearbox?

[UweM3]

so how have you connected the OEM seatbelt without the seatbelt attachment on the OEM seats?

right click and choose "show/view image" for the bigger pic.

I can take a more detailed one for you tomorrow if you wish.

Thanks

So it appears the part nearest the door is held in place by a bolt through the seat and floor. What about the side nearest the gearbox?

drill a hole and attach a spreader plate (OUTSIDE!!). As 1an decribed it correctly

[fuzzy]

i also had my harnesses bolted into the rear seat belt fixing point under the rear seat base. obviously the rear seats had been removed. using these mounting points worked perfectly and saved me in a very heavy high speed front,side and rear spinning impact of 3 complete spins. they even continued holding me down and stopped me and the seat getting thrown around when the force of the impact ripped the whole bucket seat out of its floor mountings. walked away with very minor leg and head bruising

[fieldl]

http://merlinmotorsport.co.uk/product_i ... m=Shopping

Spreader plate - for reference. Otherwise I will forget.

[e30matt]

Very good and safe way of mounting the seatbelt, NOT!

How about running the belt THROUGH the seat as it was
designed to be used. Unless your slightly on the large
side, you must rattle around like a prick in a bucket.

[AlpineAde]

so how have you connected the OEM seatbelt without the seatbelt attachment on the OEM seats?

Like this:




right click and choose "show/view image" for the bigger pic.

I can take a more detailed one for you tomorrow if you wish.

Thanks

So it appears the part nearest the door is held in place by a bolt through the seat and floor. What about the side nearest the gearbox?

The Recaro kit has a plate as part of their base-frame. The buckle attaches to that...much like the OEM fitment.

[AlpineAde]

Very good and safe way of mounting the seatbelt, NOT!

How about running the belt THROUGH the seat as it was
designed to be used. Unless your slightly on the large
side, you must rattle around like a prick in a bucket.

I assume you're talking to me?

The photo above was taken during the installation.

We tried various ways of setting the seat up. That was one of them.

That photo was on hand in my Photobucket account ~ primarily to illustrate the seat in the car ~ it was just an easy picture to post that illustrated the attachment point of the OEM seatbelt..

My seatbelt IS properly installed. It DOES pass through the belt guides. It IS entirely legal and, no, I DON'T "rattle around like a prick" as you so charmingly out it.

Fair enough?

[furbster]

My seatbelt IS properly installed. It DOES pass through the belt guides. It IS entirely legal and, no, I DON'T "rattle around like a prick" as you so charmingly out it.

Isn't it it annoying when you have a rant at someone and then realise you have a typo! lol

[AlpineAde]

Not really.

I should edit it but what the hell!

The typo lends a certain elan, a passion, to the rant. LOL!

[AlpineAde]

[moggy]

Thanks for the replies - we are having a bit of a think about what to do. No rush as I'd rather do it right first time to save hassle later.

Until then we have the standard seats in the car