Track Day Tyres - What's Best?

[furbster]

Hi Guys,

I have been toying with the idea of getting some part worn slicks (I have spare wheels and a roll cage) for track day use but after reading several threads on several sites I am not sure if they would be any better than the R888's as I have read that they take longer to get up to temperature and go off much quicker...... is this true?

Has anybody had any exerience of using slicks and if so what do you recommend?

P.S I have not used the R888's yet, I am currently wearing out some proxies.

[shorty73]

Slicks have a small window of grip (they need to be at the right temperature) and when they let go they give very little warning. Not really ideal for trackdays as you never know what the weather is going to be like!!

The R888's are a very good tyre. They are good from cold and give plenty of warning. Both the PBMW and TTRS races use them so there are plenty of part worns floating around. Might be worth finding a set just to try.

[cragles]

And of course the R888's are road legal so you don't have to bugger about changing wheels at the track!

[furbster]

Thanks guys.

I won't bother with slicks then.

Any ideas where would be the best place to get some part worns.. other than ebay?

[bramley]

Toyo R888s are simply awesome tyres, I've only done one track day with them but that was 180 track miles so I feel qualified to comment. You can really push them HARD. I couldn't unsettle the back end at all through power alone, no matter how early or hard I got on the power. It took a scandinavian flick or trail braking to unstick the rear.

Personally I'd never go for full slicks as I've heard they're a bit all or nothing, whereas the R888s were very smooth when they lost grip and not at all intimidating.[/i]

[UweM3]

no offence against anyone, but there's nothing wrong with using part worn slicks.
BUT some points to consider:

-- are you a track day newbie? (better to go with your road tyres first to gains some "feel" of what a car does when driven fast)

-- are the slicks still in good condition? (wear dimples are still visible, evenly worn contact patch?)

-- how heavy is your car and how much oomph have you under the bonnet? (no need for super super grip if your're running a stock 318i)

-- how good are your brakes, suspension, ball joints etc??? Slicks will transfer A LOT more force into your running gear. Everything wears by the factor 3

slicks are not dangerous to drive. Yes they do need one lap to warm up (but so do ALL tyres/brakes) and if treated without respect they will bite you back. But to get to the points where slicks let suddenly go (and I am not talking of some old worn out crappy slicks) you need to be FAST first. Very fast.

My advice, if you are not running stock suspension or mildly lowered/sport type setup STAY CLEAR of slicks and get some R888 or something along thosse lines.

But if you have the right setup, slicks will be F U N !!! (and cheap as they will last much much longer than R888's)

[agent006]

There's a huge variation in compounds on slicks. Some take no warming up at all (hillclimb/sprint tyres) and endurance spec compounds will take more warming.
Also lots are still crossply construction and not radial so will behave differently.

[bramley]

agent006 - you're in Cheltenham I see, me too. What car have you got I'll keep an eye out for it

[agent006]

White 325 in Leckhampton. Pics in the track cars thread.

You?

[shorty73]

slicks are not dangerous to drive. Yes they do need one lap to warm up (but so do ALL tyres/brakes) and if treated without respect they will bite you back. But to get to the points where slicks let suddenly go (and I am not talking of some old worn out crappy slicks) you need to be FAST first. Very fast.

That was my point really Uwe. You have to be travelling V.fast but when they do let go your travelling at a rate of knot's where you better be bloody good to save it!

888's are more predictable than slicks but as you say wear a lot quicker. But your a Dunlop man though aren't you? Everyone has there favourites........Kumho's suck!!

[furbster]

Thanks for all your advice guys.

Car spec is..

325i 2 Door
Engine is completely std
Stripped as much as possible - only dashboard left
Leda Fully Adjustable Suspension
Polybushed all round
M3 Negative Camber Top Mounts
M5 Engine Mounts
OMP Roll Cage
OMP Anti Roll Bars
Front Strut Brace
LSD
B&M Short Shifter
ATE Power Discs
Standard Calipers with DS3000 Pads
Braded Hoses
ATE Super Blue Racing Fluid
Sparco Ultra Seats
Luke Harnesses
Fibreglass Bonnet (Yet to be fitted) but thought i'd list it anyway!

Pilot Spec is....

Relative newbie - 3 trackdays (Only one in E30 and one in three week old JAG XF round Spa which was quite sedate!!)
1 Ring Trip (Also in XF)


Do you think this combination warrants slicks or not??

Any advice greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[Nelly]

Slicks would be the ultimate tbh in the dry - if it did ever go pear shaped, these old E30's are cheap enough to pick up another and transfer the spec into the new shell - i'd say go for it and experience the difference to road legal tyres - let me know how it pan's out as i've only ever had proxies + 888's but have often thought of a complete slick set up??

Neil.

[doggydoo2000]

no experience of either but I'll be going for R888 - great feedback on them, dual purpose & sound a bit more forgiving (yep ideal for someone without too much experience). Its a no brainer. Or just buy both!

[bramley]

White 325 in Leckhampton. Pics in the track cars thread.

You?

That's funny, quite similar to my car (see top of page 5 of the track cars thread) and I reckon you live no more than 1 mile from me as I'm in Leckhampton too! My cars out of action currently due to an issue with one of the rear calipers so you won't see it around.

(sorry for the thread hijack)

[djs325]

Yokohama ADVAN AO48 FTW

[Lloydie38]

Toyo R888 after a very hot track day here on the Isle of Man - 86 hard miles later...

I've since done two other track days but they will need changing after the next one so 320 miles per set I suppose

195/50/15 £67 from Camskill on line
[/img]

[gareth]

how long do these last on the road? only i'm thinking they would be nice tyres for the nurburgring but they wouldn't make it there!

[mikekean]

ive done about 3000 hardish road miles on mine and still have just over half tread left. youd easily get to the ring and back on these aslong as you didnt do to many back to back laps to give them a chance to cool down.

[JimmyC]

Mine have lasted me all season so far

6 races, 3 quali and 3 track/testdays, just swapped left front and left rear round to get a bit more life ;)

Maybe I need to push harder, or maybe the cars just setup well?

[bramley]

I showed pics of my R888s on another forum and the general consensus was that they've worn better on my E30 than had on someone cossie and an mx5, so maybe a half decent set up on an E30 is fairly kind to the tyres. I don't have any neg camber so have rounded the edge of the front left a bit, will probably get a tyre place to swap it for the rear right. I think my tyres have done 5 or 6 track days now and still have a good few left in them.

[JimmyC]

I've got 4/5 deg neg on mine, not sure of the toe etc that was all done by Dave @ M Tech

[shorty73]

Mine have lasted me all season so far

6 races, 3 quali and 3 track/testdays, just swapped left front and left rear round to get a bit more life ;)

Maybe I need to push harder, or maybe the cars just setup well?

The grass won't wear them out Jimmy

[Jon_Bmw]

I have used part worn slicks(just scrubbed in really) on a 160bhp 205 gti. Being FWD there was some inherint problems. Warming up the rears was a royal pain in the backside. You actually had to slide it around to get some temperature in them. The reasons where as follows:

They were too wide(equvalent of fractionally wider than a 205/50 tyre.)
FWD and its fundamental issues of heating rear tyres up properly.

Driving a rear wheel drive car, you would probably only suffer one of those issues, and that is the issue that is easily solved! Choose the correct width.

A 205 slick is possibly a bit to wide for a 160-180bhp car such as ours fall into, but for FWD it is ideal as it balances the problems of the lack of weight you experience over the front wheels in a FWD car as you accelerate. 205 is too wide for the rear end of our 205 I am sure. We are going to try a 195/50r15 r888's on the back next and keep the slicks up front.(we just happen to have a couple kicking about.)

Mixing and matching will upset some, but in our shoddy car it might just work

I think part worn slicks will always be a cheaper and better* altnernative if you have 2 sets of wheels available to you. *But Speccing them properly will be the hard part as you are only buying what is available second hand, which considering clios have moved to 17" wheels is only going to depenish.