Turbo or Nos?

[320ise]

Nos seems to be very cheap and is good for fuel etc as u only have it when you need it, can a nos shot be compared to a turbo in anyway? allso can some one list all the parts needed for a turbo conversion and a rough price guide (and the same for nos aswell please) how hard is nos to fit?

[320ise]

allso what is the difference between wet/dry kits? and what sort of power gains are recomended safe? on a standard engine?

[Templ8e30]

A wet kit adds fuel as well as nitrous, this is the type of kit you need. A dry kit only add nitrous, usually fitted to diesels.

50% increase over standard power is the usual 'safe' limit.

A brand new wet nitrous kit can be had for £400+ and would take most competent diy mechanics a day or so to fit.

The big advantage of nitrous over a turbo is the fact that when not in use your engine will return standard mpg and will drive as normal. The disadvantage is having to get the bottle refilled at a cost of £5 per Lb when you run out.

The driving experience of nitrous is a strange one, when the system is engaged (above 3000rpm for safety) the 'hit' of the torque is immense, usually breaking traction in the lower gears. A mate of mine compared it to being rammed by a big rubber lorry. The grin factor is huge.

Cheers,

Iain T

[mattG]

Long term use would be turbo but the cost is a lot higher £3000 upwards to do properly including getting your hands dirty.

I have had Nos installed before the turbo conversion & was great fun, but the refilling issue is a pain & costly, since having larger injectors & remap done by Ant the car is alot faster than NA+Nos, FI+Nos I would emagine would be insane but my clutch does not want to play at the mo.


Hear are some NA+Nos dyno graphs on page 1 & FI graphs on page 2

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... ic&t=47175

Page 3 might have FI+Nos dyno graphs one day

[ric325i]

with nitrous is it a case of push button for each squirt in each gear or is it, hit the squirt button and bang through as meany gears as you want until you turn of the nitrous?

[jaffro]

with nitrous is it a case of push button for each squirt in each gear or is it, hit the squirt button and bang through as meany gears as you want until you turn of the nitrous?

have i got you thinking now mate lol

[Templ8e30]

with nitrous is it a case of push button for each squirt in each gear or is it, hit the squirt button and bang through as meany gears as you want until you turn of the nitrous?

Neither.

When the arming switch is on, floor the throttle in any gear and the nitrous will start to flow. When you lift off the throttle the system stops, gear change then back on full throttle and the nitrous flows again etc etc.

The use of a nitrous 'button' isn't recommended as it's all too easy to activate the system accidentally and blow your engine.

I use an 'rpm window switch', set to engage at 3000rpm and disengage at 6000rpm. This prevents the system activating at too low an rpm or continuining to feed nitrous through the rev limiter, either situation will probably result in a massive backfire blowing the inlet manifold apart or worse.

I'll hopefully have my own nitrous refill service up and running tonight, a full refill of a 10lb bottle like the one Jaffro is selling will be £50.

Cheers,

Iain T

[mattG]

You can also get sophistated(sp?) pulsing controlers that come in a lot softer & increase the Nitrous shot.

[midnight]

both

[carnut]

hi i am thinking of going the nos route too how long will a 10lb bottle last is it like 10lb = 10mins playing or longer

[midnight]

turbo

[rwdonly]

A good Nitrous supplier will only sell you a small kit to start with and as time goes on and you dont blow the engine increase the Hp avaliable.

It really is a quick burst thing, i would seriously research it before fitting as getting it wrong can be a real nightmare.

The pictures below are the result of a Nitrous system failure.





YES THAT REALLY WAS NITROUS!!

[maxfield]

I'm sure Iain will now alter his opinion of nitrous

[rwdonly]

I dont want to scare anyone, im new to BMW's but not to the performance world.

I just want people to realise that it can be a fantastic mod, but if poorly done, deadly!

[march109]

I dont want to scare anyone, im new to BMW's but not to the performance world.

I just want people to realise that it can be a fantastic mod, but if poorly done, deadly!

I've seen similar damage from things as trivial as 'power boost valves' and crap like that, when used properly and controlled Nitrous is awesome and perfectly safe.

You can even put fires out with compressed nitrous.

[rwdonly]

Absolutely, what worries me is the "fleebay" type traders that will flog almost anything to anyone without actually looking into what they are getting into.

Fires, yes but not with Nitrous oxide!, just Nitrous!!
can you imagine the fire brigade grabbing a bottle of N2O !!

[whipsey]

Absolutely, what worries me is the "fleebay" type traders that will flog almost anything to anyone without actually looking into what they are getting into.

Fires, yes but not with Nitrous oxide!, just Nitrous!!
can you imagine the fire brigade grabbing a bottle of N2O !!

i can't believe after all this time you actually know something usefull

[march109]

Absolutely, what worries me is the "fleebay" type traders that will flog almost anything to anyone without actually looking into what they are getting into.

Fires, yes but not with Nitrous oxide!, just Nitrous!!
can you imagine the fire brigade grabbing a bottle of N2O !!

Actually I did mean Nitrous Oxide and I am correct (because I used the word compressed), compressed nitrous oxide can and will put out a fire if done correctly......

http://www.technical-forum.com/nitrous- ... +fire.html

pictures for proof on the thread above. Love the fast and Furios references they hate it as much as we do!

[rwdonly]

Yeah i hate Fast and Dubious too!

I must admit ive never seen that done before! and ill be honest i dont think i'd want to.
The Wizards are great guys and have earnt their reputation.

The explosion pictures i posted refer to a system failure, indeed any compressed gas can cause considerable damage.

Thanks to Fast and Dubious, people have a sudden interest in Nos and dont even know how or why it works, this is where i feel the danger lies.

You obviously have to reinforce the rivets that hold the chequer plate to the bottom of your car!!

[march109]

I know what your saying just illustrating that what every one 'thinks' they know about NO2 because of films is pure bull.

NO2 isn't the flamable flamethrower type gas people think, just because its an oxidiser doesn't mean its a good one, it has to be heated to 575degrees (iirc) before the Nitrogen and Oxygen components split and aid normal engine combustion.

Chequer plate reinforcement is the first thing I do to any motor I purchase, it has to be done before anything else. Then I add under body neons so I can see what I'm doing when working under the car at night and paint it in some god aful luminescant colour because I'm forever loosing my car in car parks. I then spunk 2 months giro on UHU glue and ram raid the local halfrauds.

[rwdonly]

We stand together my freind!!

This bit is FANTASTIC......
Chequer plate reinforcement is the first thing I do to any motor I purchase, it has to be done before anything else. Then I add under body neons so I can see what I'm doing when working under the car at night and paint it in some god aful luminescant colour because I'm forever loosing my car in car parks. I then spunk 2 months giro on UHU glue and ram raid the local halfrauds.

you the man!

[rwdonly]

youll like this one!!

[whipsey]

wheres leepu

[rwdonly]

Hufords has nothing on this guy!

[GrindCulture]

I'd never seriously given any consideration towards nitrous oxide as an alternative to forced induction. Might be food for thought in future. Would it be feasible to equip an M42 with it rather than going down the SC route?

[march109]

yes you can fit it to any engine even an is, but as we have discussed it needs to be installed properly and don't go mad and spend the extra money on a progressive controller to protect your investment IMO squirt and go systems are for experts or nutters.

[rwdonly]

Yep as above!

Too many people have jumped on the bandwagon and will sell " a kit " to anyone.

Go to a trusted dealer / supplier and enjoy the fun of a good kick in the backside!

[maxfield]

yes you can fit it to any engine even an is

What about diesels?

[Alex]

turbo

[Templ8e30]

yes you can fit it to any engine even an is

What about diesels?

N20 works very well with diesels.

Even when properly installed and controlled a small dose of nitrous can rape an engine. I cracked a piston with a mere 50bhp shot of nitrous, this was mid-way through a run as well, not as the solenoids opened giving that intial 'hit'.

My system is coming out and will be sold via fleabay ASAP.

Cheers,

Iain T

[march109]

yes you can fit it to any engine even an is

What about diesels?

Yes max I said any engine and that does include diesels! however if you said steam engine or possibly wankle engine (since I have never seen anyone NO2 one of those!) then you would have had me.

N2O is an oxideser most engines require oxygen to aid in combustion (even if the combustion is achieved through compression ignition).

[rwdonly]

Ive seen a TD run at the POD with N2O and very quick it was too!

Its the O in N2o that does the magic!

Templ8e30, what system were you running?

[fuzzy]

Even when properly installed and controlled a small dose of nitrous can rape an engine. I cracked a piston with a mere 50bhp shot of nitrous, this was mid-way through a run as well, not as the solenoids opened giving that intial 'hit'.

My system is coming out and will be sold via fleabay ASAP.

Cheers,

Iain T

you need to stop giving your nos kit such bad references then as it will surely effect the chance of a sale.
"for sale- 1 nos kit, melts pistons on small doses"

[rwdonly]

Ill take SIX !!! one for each piston!!

[march109]

Ive seen a TD run at the POD with N2O and very quick it was too!

Its the O in N2o that does the magic!

Templ8e30, what system were you running?

Exactly the air we breath is only 21% oxygen, some of the air contains gases that are cobustion inhibitors but most is Nitrogen and this is inert so lets just assume for arguements sake that air contains 21% oxygen and 79% other gases that affect combustion in no detrimental way. Now thats the same air thats in the cylinders of our vehicles.

At about 585 degrees celcius N2O becomes 2N + O, ie the oxygen and nitrogen split and the oxygen is available for combustion, before that it is not as nitrogenoxide is a non-flammable gas until super heated and split into its core components of N and O at which point its no longer N2O!. Essentially this means N2O or 2N+O is 33% oxygen, which is 12% more than air for the same volume.

Also being stored above atmospheric pressure means when you engage N20 in an engine boosting application you will fill the volume of the cylinder of the vehicle with more N2O and air than with air alone as it will be at a higher than atmospheric pressure, similar in principle to turboing or supercharging and forcing air into the cylinder above atmospheric pressure. But this effect is small and effects reduce as the bottle empties.

Some drag cars use N2O to spool up large turbos.