Help!! - 325i running problems (head gasket?)

[andyaskew]

My 325i has been stood for 3 months since I bought it and stripped it out and sorted the bodywork, now that its taxed and on the road I have done a few short journeys to work and back etc and I seem to have a problem.

When starting on a morning it fires almost instantly and then cuts out unless you floor the throttle. You can then restart it and give it some revs to keep it running. For the first 5 mins or so it runs like an absolute pig, borking on part throttle, cutting out at traffic lights and only going anywhere when you floor it. Once warmed up it seems to run and idle OK. But if you stop it and try to start it again (while still warm) it does the same, runs like a pig for a few minutes.

What do you think it might be? I have replace the plugs to no avail, given it a service, checked for splits in the intake air intake pipes etc, the local garage couldnt find anything obvious, all he said was that it sounded like it was running a modified cam until it was warmed up?!?

[abelai]

Check the c191 (injector loom) connector under the inlet manifold pull back the boot on the lower half. Your looking for corrosion or breaks in the wires as the boot tends to trap moisture.

[andyaskew]

Forgive my mechanical stupidity, but will this be obvious to see or do I need to remove the inlet mani (as you said its underneath) ie, is it sandwiched between the manifold and the block or is it just directly under the manifold if you are looking side-on??

[Jay07]

Alrite mate - I was just thinking if your battery was disconnected while sitting for those 3 months or at any point during that time, that may suggest that the ECU will require some time to adjust before the car runs smooth again. Just a thought...

[andyaskew]

Yeah, battery was disconnected for 3 months, also the fuel tank was totally empty so some crud could have been sucked through and blocked somewhere too. I thought a good thrashing might help, but it didnt (was fun though)

[Morat]

ECU learns pretty fast, it might be down to the blue temp sensor having failed and not giving the ECU the correct cold running info. That doesn't really fit with the warm start issue but its a good one to eliminate. You might want to have a look at the Idle Control Valve as well. A combination of the two might explain it.

[abelai]

The c191 connector is easy to get to and looks like the big round connector on the firewall next to fuse box only smaller untwist the the centre and then pulls apart it's the lower half of the wires you need to check. If you do a search for injector and loom you'll find some more posts.

[abelai]

Also this:

http://member.rivernet.com.au/btaylor/B ... itE30.html

[Jay07]

Thats a great article mate... Really hope with the amount of zoners effected by this problem we can get to a conclusive solution... I cant stand not knowing exactly what it is, oh well finger crossed

[abelai]

I found another article and it describes same sort of thing. I not saying that this is deffinately your problem but it does seem very possible and is also mentioned in the BMW service bulletin in about 1991

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthread ... light=c191

[andyaskew]

Thanks for all this, I will have a play at the weekend and report back.

[Jay07]

Brian if you read this thread is this what you were telling me to check out ? (RE: the thread talking about reving and cutting out)

Cheers abelai, thats a big help!

[Brianmoooore]

The c191 connector is easy to get to and looks like the big round connector on the firewall next to fuse box only smaller untwist the the centre and then pulls apart it's the lower half of the wires you need to check. If you do a search for injector and loom you'll find some more posts.

The big round connector on the firewall (bulkhead in English) next to the fusebox is designated C101 not 191, and does not give problems.
The C191 connector is a miniature version of the C101, and is mounted on the black metal brackets under the centre of the inlet manifold. This connector gives plenty of trouble, with water being trapped in the lower rubber boot, and causing extensive corrosion, with wires rotting right through.
Can be seen easily enough with the air meter/filter out of the way, but a bit difficult to work on with the engine in place, although by no means impossible.

[abelai]

Sorry I didn't word it very well .

I did say "looks like" . Probably did more to confuse than help hehe, Brianmooores explanation is what I tryed to say.

[Jay07]

Thanks guys! sound like a pain to get to but I'll check it out on saturday am... I have to check out my air filter anyway so i'll just take it out - fingers crossed for good weather! apart from the forth coming gails!!

[andyaskew]

Checked out all the plugs and wiring and they were fine, gave the air intake and air flow meter a bloody good clean though and that seems to have worked wonders. Took it out for a little drive and went OK so it must have just been years of built up crap that was causing the problem

[Jay07]

You may have been lucky there mate, i did the same thing this am but just now when i went for a drive the revs dropped again at the lights. Im mapping my progress on the following thread which has been going for a while...

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... 12#1025512

[andyaskew]

Right, I need help. The bm is running rough again and the problem is as follows...

Very difficult to start and once it does it sounds like it running on 5 cylinders, very lump and hesitant. This remains for the first minute of driving and then the problem disappears and the car runs smoothly. Driving is fine but when I come to a halt in traffic and its idling for approx 30 seconds it starts to run on 5 again and i get puffs of white smoke from the zorst.

WTF!?!? HELP

[pimp_mobile]

Sounds very similar to mine, though it varies on how rough it is when you start it. Currently I'm investigating base idle and fuel injectors on this... not sure whether that helps you any...

Had it the garage and the idle mix is way too rich...

[andyaskew]

Think I've found the problem, the head gasket is on its way out

[Brianmoooore]

Think I've found the problem, the head gasket is on its way out

This is the conclusion I came to, on the strength of your last post.
What makes you think it's the head gasket?

[andyaskew]

just found a little mayo on the oil filler cap

[Brianmoooore]

Should have asked earlier - Does the car use coolant and need topping up?

[andyaskew]

Only yesterday, it was fine till I got the new radiator fitted last week.

[andyaskew]

What do I need if I am going to do the head gasket myself, parts list and approx cost please lads

[Brianmoooore]

You need to have this confirmed first.
Take out the plugs and see if one looks different from the others.
If the gasket leak is only small, the problem may not show up on a compression test, but a leak down test should reveal all, including bubbles coming through the coolant.
I wouldn't dream of taking off a head and refitting it without a bit of reconditioning, and the total costs for parts and machining work (no labour removing or refitting head), comes to around the £300 mark.

[andyaskew]

It's getting recovered to a garage on tuesday so we'll see what happens, he's a bmw specialist with a good rep so I don't think I'll get ripped.

[Jay07]

Hey People!

I haven't updated here in a while, sorry to say i've had no progress. I've got used to psyching myself up before each drive! - My car does smoke on start up after its been sitting for a while but not while it drives. (Is that head gasket issue?) The symptoms occur only at idle, i dont know the system well enough to eliminate the particular parts. EG. The car is idling what is doing what? - as i press the accelerator, sometimes the power is there sometimes it hesitates before moving off, at worst it will cut out completely. When sitting at idle and the revs drop the oil light comes on (don't know if that says anything new). So at the lights I sit in Park and hold the accelerator at 1000rpms thats enough to stop the car having the opportunity to drop out. So this is how i've been driving, the worse senario is crawling through traffic where its not appropriate to stop and start. Here the idle is low and the jumping starts!!!

Im going through this all again hoping that something may jump out - maybe wishful thinking on my part but the alternative is a loan to pay for a new second hand car! Could this be a fuel/pump issue? or auto gearbox prob? (it doesn't feel like it but i'm ou of ideas)

I just want to say i really appreciate all the help that has come form this thread thus far.

[insertnamehere]

What is your idle speed shown on the rev counter (without holding it on the throttle)? Dont think it should be much less than 1000 anyway, probably around 900rpm. Also, when moving the throttle from inside the engine bay can you hear the throttle switch clicking just as you start to open it from idle position?

[Jay07]

Insert' - my normal idle rev is roughly 700 not as high as 900.... I have checked the TPS and it does click when the throttle is opened!

[insertnamehere]

Insert' - my normal idle rev is roughly 700 not as high as 900.... I have checked the TPS and it does click when the throttle is opened!

Right, is the click right at the point where you just touch the throttle? Just wondering if the idle speed could be turned up manually (by adjusting the stop) without interfering with the switch & whether this may help.

Don't take it as gospel about the idle being 900 by the way, that's just approximately what all my previous cars have idled at.

[Brianmoooore]

DO NOT, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, TOUCH THAT STOP!
Check that the TPS is working. Just hearing it click isn't proof.
Idle revs should be 760 +/- 40 RPM, and is not adjustable.