Playo's Awesome M3. DYNO results.

[ShepsEvo3]

Right, Just done some live mapping on Darrens car today and he has asked me to post up some of my findings as some of you guys maybe interested. I only attempted mapping Full throttle and very low RPM light load sites as I have some problems to sort with the Uni-Q AFM to TPS conversion, but anyway, just a quick remap of the Full Throttle has given the following results:

Before, with AFM fitted..........
ATW 190.4 bhp @ 7046 RPM
Flywheel 234.8 bhp @ 7084 RPM
Flywheel Torque 180 ftlbs @6502 RPM

After, with CF airbox & UniQ..
ATW 219.4 bhp @ 7579 RPM
Flywheel 263.0 bhp @ 7916 RPM
Flywheel Torque 185.8 ftlbs @ 6908 RPM

Ok, Fueling is still all over the place as, like I said, I have a small problem where the fueling adjustment is too coarse and for some reason the fuel map is lost during downloading into the Unichip, but after 6000 RPM the AFR's are all 12.8-13:1.

Normal format for this type of conversion involving the CF Airbox is Alpha N. This is a great system and allows you to modify the fuelling to suit the extra air which is going into the engine. With the S14 it is pretty well known for having a restriction in the intake system.. namely the AFM being the main culprit. The CF airbox and Alpha N conversion takes away the AFM and converts a signal used from the TPS to show the ECU load. It is a very good system and works extremely well. Also, you the customer can fiddle with it whereas the Unichip has to be left to a Unichip dealer to make adjustments for you. This is done on a dyno and is what Unichip is all about... live tuning YOUR car.

Do a test on the S14 with a vac gauge attatched to the FPR vac pipe and you will see what I mean. Darrens car had the equivelent to 1psi of depression at 6000 RPM and rising over that. Depression started at around 4000 RPM.

The way we decided to do Darrens car was to use the Dastek Unichip Q so we are able to map ignition timing as well as fueling. This involves a modification to the ECU printed circuit board and a couple of wires comming out of it to the Unichip so it can alter the ignition timing. This is due to the S14 having 2 crank sensors and is a bit complicated. On top of this, a TPS has to be fitted to the throttle body to take care of load signals the same way as the Alpha N. Also to take care of intake temperatures another Temp sensor is fitted into the intake of the CF airbox snorkal and is hard wired into the loom of the AFM connector. Obviously some work!

Luckily for me, My Evo2 has the same conversion except I have retained the original plenum. I uploaded the map from this Uni-Q and downloaded it into Darrens UniQ so atleast it would run. I set the ignition map all on zero and downloaded that. This is the point where you would normally drive the car with the AFM fitted and TPS fitted so the UniQ can learn both signals and match them uptogether.

Ignition timing is affected big time with the addition of extra air going into the engine. I have seen this with an M30 I did another similar conversion to. Ignition timing was different throughout the revrange before and after the AFM was removed. So it was no suprise then that Darrens M3 ignition was vastly out on firstly light throttle loads upto 1600 RPM (I have mapped no further light loads upto now, but will) and I needed to both retard and advance the ignition timing on full throttle. Retard by upto 6 degrees and advance upto 10 degrees.

The ignition timing is where the main power came from. Usually a CF equiped S14 will release around 15 bhp, but as you see from the figure above, I have found another 14 bhp on top of that.

On top of this at low RPM Darrens car was unbelievably undriveable, Full throttle couldn't be applied below 2000 RPM without it trying to buck and stall. Now you can hit full throttle at 1000 RPM with no bucking and the engine is very smooth now all the way through. I just don't know how he put up with it before.

I have some graphs printed off, which I will scan. I will try to email them to Darren who will hopefully post them up, or Simon if I can have your email.

Cheers, Paul.

[maxfield]

That's an awesome gain!

And giving awesome power!

What cams are in there?

[ShepsEvo3]

Both the above figures are the best figures I had before and after, The car does have a consitent 259BHP time and time again and before it had a consistent 232/233 BHP.

This S14 is also a 2.3ltr also NOT a 2.5ltr.

[ShepsEvo3]

Schricks 276/284 I believe, and we understand that the engine is standard apart from that, but I have my doubts lol.

Exhaust is Miltek.

Darren, your car sounded nice before, now is just bloody awesome from 6000 onwards

[1an]

Paul another load of impressive results,

[Ant]

good gains as expected.

Paul, the before figures, are they with a stock Eprom file and the cams or with a tuned file on the board ?

[ShepsEvo3]

Paul another load of impressive results,

Thanks Ian,

Shame I couldn't map the car without the CF airbox first. I wanted to do a few remaps with it, Just standard with AFM, then CF airbox with mapping just fuel, then ignition timing to show how important the ignition timing is, but I don't have the time unfortunately and understandably, Darren is itching to get his car back lol.

[ShepsEvo3]

good gains as expected.

Paul, the before figures, are they with a stock Eprom file and the cams or with a tuned file on the board ?

Ant, thanks buddy. The before figures are very good anyway, but yes, it already had an EPORM change as it revs upto 8000 RPM already. Fueling was sh1te low down though, making it totally undriveable below 2500 RPM.
Also, it is with the cams too.

The after is just adding the CF airbox and Unichip Q mate.

[glenn]

those figure's are well impressive darren
well done paul

[maxfield]

Schricks 276/284 I believe, and we understand that the engine is standard apart from that, but I have my doubts lol.

There has got to be more to it than cams!

[Gunni]

Can you explain more about the ecu mods to control ignition?

Could the unichip not take in the coil signal, then output the non coil signal into a ignition amplifier.
thus input is only 4 signals per rev in a square wave, and output easily changeble?

[ShepsEvo3]

Can you explain more about the ecu mods to control ignition?

Could the unichip not take in the coil signal, then output the non coil signal into a ignition amplifier.
thus input is only 4 signals per rev in a square wave, and output easily changeble?

If only it was that simple, if it was I am sure the Motec conversion wouldn't need its own crank sensor and a wheel on the front crank pulley and the Alpha N would probably be ignition mappable too. Because the ECU has to see signals from both Crank sensors you have to modify both signals equally. A resistor has to be soldered into one link and 2 wires into another link. As per Dastek agreements between itself and us the dealers, I cannot say what mods are done, but they are very reversable.

[Gunni]

Ok, cause when I installed a SMT6 on a older 325i, that has two sensors, I´m able to take the coil signal into the
smt6 and mod that, then output to a plain ignition amp and from there over to the coil.
ECU still sees it´s original signal it´s the output that is changed. I thought that was something similar.

[ShepsEvo3]

Yes Gunni, I see what you mean, but I am sure the S14's motronic is even more un-necessarily complicated than the early 325i. Also it is susceptable to electrical interferance where all other are more tolerant.

Thanks Glenn

[maxfield]

The graphs:

[ShepsEvo3]

Thanks Jamie, much appreciated.

Run number 6 on the 1st graph is after I downloaded the first map, it shows the big gain above 6000 RPM, but the torque is all over the place as the fuel map was lost during the download. It was fine above 6000 RPM though, so I just edited the full throttle fuel map for the second graphs, which as you can see the torque is much better (flatter). This is the problem I need to sort out with loosing the fuel map on downloading.

[playo]

Paul,

Thanks for starting this thread on my behalf!

To say i'm plessed is an understatement! I never thought for a minute I'd see such a jump in power.

Like you said it ran terrible @2k rpm and that was the main issue is was looking to iron out, plus with the aid of the cf airbox a little more power to be shown.

But damn, when you called yesterday saying it's giving too much power it took my a couple of minutes to realise what you was saying! Hell it didn't sink in till I put the phone down

So BIG thanks to you Paul for all your hard work and dedication put into my car, things have taken longer than expected and I was getting itchy for the car to be ready (sorry mate ) but as they say good things come to those who wait It's great to finaly see what is possible.

As for exactly what previous mods my car has had I (and Simon as he was prest when I bought this car) can honestly say the only mods mentioned were Schrick cams and a scorpion exhaust (which i removed in place of a Miltek) So I suppose it'll stay a mystery as to if any other mods have been done.

Thanks for all the comments guys! +Jamie for putting the dyno graph up

[ShepsEvo3]

Thanks Darren, as you know I am held up further now, but I have managed to get that torque curve much smoother now. Will get another graph sorted for you when its finished.

Paul.

[Simon]

Excellent results, can't wait to have a drive!

Paul, does this mean it's not going to be ready for tomorrow?

[ShepsEvo3]

Excellent results, can't wait to have a drive!

Paul, does this mean it's not going to be ready for tomorrow?

Simon, in reality it isn't going to be ready untill the weekend. A hose I was going to advise Darren on from the heater matrix to cylinder head split, so I am stalled untill a new one arrives. It was ballooning and looks like the original hose. I had one go on my Evo2 aswell, so pretty common.

Its a bummer as I know Darren wants it back ASAP and I can't wait to see his face when he drives it, but things like this can't be helped and does happen. Good job it was on the dyno and not a couple of hundres miles away from home on the motorway.

[playo]

No problems Paul!

Like you said better to have gone there than on the M4.

Weekend it is then. I think I'll still come up tomorrow with Simon for him to get his dyno'd

[ShepsEvo3]

I think I'll still come up tomorrow with Simon for him to get his dyno'd

Ok Darren, any idea what time he's thinking of comming up? I've kinda had to re-arrange some stuff in light of whats happened, but can still get him in no worries, just ideally like a time.

[playo]

I think we'll be down for about 1.30-2.00pm.

If thats a problem, and you'd like Simon earlier. Let him know as he's only leaving so late coz i'm nights, I dont mind if he comes up without me if it makes life easier for you.

[curryp]

some nice gains there darren.i bet your loving it.

[maxfield]

More graphs:

[ShepsEvo3]

Cheers Jamie,

The top graph is after the ignition is set and some fueling sorting, still not 100% happy with it yet, but Torque is upto 194 ftlbs now. Power is still over 260 bhp but the torque curve now is much smoother as you can see.

The bottom one shows wheel power also and losses and is another version of the first graph shown in this topic, with pretty rubbish fueling upto about 6300 RPM.

[playo]

Thats great news Paul!!

I'm gonna fall in love with this car all over again when I get it back

[ShepsEvo3]

Thats great news Paul!!

I'm gonna fall in love with this car all over again when I get it back

I must say even now the light throttle is much nicer than it was and I havn't mapped them above 1600 RPM yet.

The rest of the work is completed now, just needs some more tweaking on full throttle fueling and then remap the part throttles right through.

Its nice and quiet while cruising and driving with the flow as they say, but floor it and get above 4k, not to mention over err...

[maxfield]

Impressive torque figures for a 2.3 too

[playo]

Impressive torque figures for a 2.3 too

Not bad at all

[maxfield]

To say our council chariot only has 199lb/ft, then it's very impressive!

[ShepsEvo3]

These S14's are weird, you can get the torque to hang on for much longer, and so the power increases, but the peak torque never really increases as impressively as the bhp.

Never the less, it is impressive for a 2.3ltr.

Now what I would like to do is Unichip an M3 with Alpha N already fitted and do a before and after for that.

[ShepsEvo3]

Well, this car is all done, fully mapped and was quite a way out with both ignition and fueling. Picked up 25/30 horse power on alot of the light load sites. Engine now feels much more eager and I can't wait to see Darrens face when he drives it. Are you sure you want to wait untill Saturday to collect it now Darren?

I'll leave it for Darren to post results once he has the graphs.

[Ant]

Sounds like its all good there then Paul

Just a Q, how much mapping time has this had now ? having to map both the moronic and the uni Q must eat more hours dude ??

Also, I need a lil favour if I may, can you squeeze a phone call in tomorrow sometime plz ?

[ShepsEvo3]

Hi Ant, Darrens car took ALOT of mapping, basically 13 load sites from 800,1000,1200,1600,2000 upto 5600RPM and then full throttle to 8000RPM.

I left the Motronic, only mapped the Unichip. Was all day on it today. Did a fair bit on full throttle sites, but I had probs with downloading into the Unichip where the fuel map kept corrupting every time. I had to do a site and make a note of the fuel value and write it down. I had to do this on every site and then edit the maps manually before downloading. This could be my laptop causing the problem, but we think its a software or serial port problem.

It shouldn't work like that and I could have mapped it in just a couple of hours normally, but hey ho... its done now and its bloody awesome.

Call me anytime Ant, I'll pm my number to you,