hartge v alpina
Moderator: martauto
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whiterhino
- E30 Zone Camper
- Posts: 1019
- Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: south london
is a h27 hartge faster than a c2 2.7 alpina and is there much between a 325i sport and a h26 hartge.
H27 cs C2 - nothing in it in terms of power.
However they are two very different cars. Engien wise they are different as the H27 has a wilder cam and will rev better top end, The ALpina will have more bottom end/midrange grunt but only slightly.
The H27 has superior suspension by a long long way though is it was fitted. The springs are softer as are the shocks so give a more comfortable ride and they use huge anti roll bars to stop roll.
Alpina on the other hand use very stiff Bilstein shocks and very stiff springs with no work done to the anti roll bars. The result is a horrible stiff ride which rolls alot.
The Alpina does have other tricks up its sleeve though like harder rear subframe bushes, offset front top mounts.
My personal opinion which has developed over the years is that the H27 is the better car overall.
The H26 is much more lively than a 325i/sport, it revs very very well and isnt that much slower than a H27/C2. Anyone thats drivena proper one has always come back and raved about it.
The Alpina C2 can be made into a much better car than it is by simply changing the cam to a 284/272 and change the suspesion to H&R Cup and add H&R Anti roll bars. This really brings the beast alive and makes it an even better car than the H27.
However they are two very different cars. Engien wise they are different as the H27 has a wilder cam and will rev better top end, The ALpina will have more bottom end/midrange grunt but only slightly.
The H27 has superior suspension by a long long way though is it was fitted. The springs are softer as are the shocks so give a more comfortable ride and they use huge anti roll bars to stop roll.
Alpina on the other hand use very stiff Bilstein shocks and very stiff springs with no work done to the anti roll bars. The result is a horrible stiff ride which rolls alot.
The Alpina does have other tricks up its sleeve though like harder rear subframe bushes, offset front top mounts.
My personal opinion which has developed over the years is that the H27 is the better car overall.
The H26 is much more lively than a 325i/sport, it revs very very well and isnt that much slower than a H27/C2. Anyone thats drivena proper one has always come back and raved about it.
The Alpina C2 can be made into a much better car than it is by simply changing the cam to a 284/272 and change the suspesion to H&R Cup and add H&R Anti roll bars. This really brings the beast alive and makes it an even better car than the H27.
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Simon13
- The longest resto in the world !
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alpinas had far more research and development done to their cars, which hartge don't do
alpinas had an adjustible rear anti roll bar!
they also had a better bottom end engine too
hartges are god and a bit more extreme but they seem to break alot. Alpinas will do the same mileges as a normal bm
alpinas had an adjustible rear anti roll bar!
they also had a better bottom end engine too
hartges are god and a bit more extreme but they seem to break alot. Alpinas will do the same mileges as a normal bm
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Simon13
- The longest resto in the world !
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they do i can think of a few hartges that have had porblems and alpinas which don't
for a start the alpina has the forged steel crank which u can't break, and the hartge has the monkey metal eta thing
for a start the alpina has the forged steel crank which u can't break, and the hartge has the monkey metal eta thing
lol dude chill out i ent bothered!! im only saying im a hartge man and when u proper look into there heritage u will know they produce some incredible reliable monsters thus does alpina!
Hartge h35 e30... ( for sale in near future )
bmw 328i sport e36
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Demlotcrew
- E30 Zone Team Member
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Hartge all the way!
Andrew
Andrew
Nothing wrong with an ETA crank. Very very difficult to break.
It is true that the Alpina cars had to meet much more strict regulations and had to last just as long as a normal BMW which they indeed do.
The engines however dont seem to be as durable as a 325i. A 325i will make 160+ BHP even after 150k miles. An Alpina however will make 20bhp less than what it should even after 100k miles. So many bottom ends have had to be rebuilt - maybe because they get driven harder?
Hartge are a tuner and not a manufacturer. Again, they get driven very very hard and its likely they are going to break more aswell. No one spends Ԛ£5000+ on a H27 conversion and drives like a nanny! They give it hell.
Anyway, If a full blown H27 ever comes up I will purchase it.
It is true that the Alpina cars had to meet much more strict regulations and had to last just as long as a normal BMW which they indeed do.
The engines however dont seem to be as durable as a 325i. A 325i will make 160+ BHP even after 150k miles. An Alpina however will make 20bhp less than what it should even after 100k miles. So many bottom ends have had to be rebuilt - maybe because they get driven harder?
Hartge are a tuner and not a manufacturer. Again, they get driven very very hard and its likely they are going to break more aswell. No one spends Ԛ£5000+ on a H27 conversion and drives like a nanny! They give it hell.
Anyway, If a full blown H27 ever comes up I will purchase it.
Yeah and that gets plenty of hard driving and nothing has happened.
Nothing wrong with an ETA crank!
Nothing wrong with an ETA crank!
Nice, not sure about the wheels thoughTheo325 wrote:Take a look at this hartage, very tasty.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... %3AIT&rd=1
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Andy335Touring
- Married to the E30 Zone
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Sal, are you sure about those Alpina harder subframe bushs as i need mine replacing for the MOT.
Are they some where in between standard rubber and poly bushs ?
I suppose the big question is are they still available and how much $$$ ?
May be you could offer them on the Zone shop ?
Are they some where in between standard rubber and poly bushs ?
I suppose the big question is are they still available and how much $$$ ?
May be you could offer them on the Zone shop ?
Dude,
I was told by Andrew Everett - they are in the Alpina parts catalogue so should still be available.
Not putting them on shop dude.
Try Munich legends, they can give some good prices on this sort of stuff or go for the poly ones and feel every bump - but never replace them again!
I was told by Andrew Everett - they are in the Alpina parts catalogue so should still be available.
Not putting them on shop dude.
Try Munich legends, they can give some good prices on this sort of stuff or go for the poly ones and feel every bump - but never replace them again!
I must admit the ones in the Alpina arent as harsh as they were when they were just fitted.
It is alot more bearable now after about 2 months.
Handling is super tight!
It is alot more bearable now after about 2 months.
Handling is super tight!
Heart Ga
Too many people say "Heart -Age"
Too many people say "Heart -Age"
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Andy335Touring
- Married to the E30 Zone
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cheers for the info Sal, i will ring Sytners tomorrow.
Do you have the number for Munich Legends ?
Do you have the number for Munich Legends ?
01825 740456.
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Andy335Touring
- Married to the E30 Zone
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Ever help full !!!M5pilot wrote:01825 740456.
Cheers dude
lol yeh iain thank god ehh!! can pronounce it properly but too many ppl call them heritage or har tage! lol here iain im gonna call u soon lol
Hartge h35 e30... ( for sale in near future )
bmw 328i sport e36
he amount of people I have to correct is unreal!
Oi! What do you posting on here? Your meant to be fitting those ARB's!!! 
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Demlotcrew
- E30 Zone Team Member
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- Location: East Anglia
Im with Sal its Heart GA!
Andrew
Andrew
I dont care.....thats sounds gay. Its HartGAjonb wrote:wrong again sal.M5pilot wrote:Heart Ga
Too many people say "Heart -Age"
its pronounced "hart-gee".
think "meh" with a G thats how you say it (I speak German so I should know 
)
"hart - geh"
Can be heard in these videos:
http://www.hartge.de/html/videoger.html
(I speak German so I should know )"hart - geh"
Can be heard in these videos:
http://www.hartge.de/html/videoger.html
