which is the better engine???

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:45 am

Widge wrote:
Andy325i wrote:
Am I right in thinking it was the M10 blocks that BMW used in the old F1 cars? Think thiey got about 1500 BHP out of them!!!!!

Also heard that they used to leave them outside to "weather" for a time
The M10 blocks were stored out side the smoking door of the Brabham (Sh1t I think it was Brabham - any one...) F1 team who used the BMW engines and the guys used to pi55 on them, this "accelerated" weathering was to relieve internal stresses that would lead to hot spots with the immense turbo charging.

1500bhp was achieved- and BMW even developed a funny head which had a nam beginning with A (I'll look it up I know where the magazine is) which put the valves in a mini V8 kinda lay out, this was for F2 I think and gave increased Bhp due to increased valve area and using 2 cam shafts. I'll scan the article if anyone is interested.

im interested in seeing that scan

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:47 am

ian332isport wrote:
318-is wrote:ians running a 3.2 litre with a 6 speed int he

wondeer if he has had ne VANOS problems
Nah, mine's been fine

Vanos get's a bad rap, but is not all that bad in my opinion. Maybe I'll change my mind when I get a Ãƒ”šÃ‚£1500 bill

Ian.

sorry have to ask what's a vanos???

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:50 am

318-is wrote:hahah

dusnt insurance cover it?

does it make a noticable differene when u drive

also i heard it makes some strange noises.

ian im guna b cheeky: n e chance of a blast in your beast of a car 2moro ?

Unfortunately, Insurance does not cover it. Not even sure a warranty does these days

I'm sure if it wasn't there, I would miss it. Makes a big difference to low down Torque apparently.

It can get rattly, but not really any 'funny' noises. Mines sweet

Yeah, I'm sure we can sort something out. I'm installing the air con at the moment, but it can be made drivable fairly easily.

See ya tomoz.

Ian.

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:50 am

sweet!

this is guna be the best day of my life!!

look forward to it pal, c ya moro

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:53 am

It truly is a sight one must see.

A

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:54 am

wayneE30 wrote: sorry have to ask what's a vanos???

It's BMW's version of variable cam timing. I was going to say it's a bit like Honda's VTEC, but it's not really.

Info here:

http://www.bmwworld.com/technology/vanos.htm

Ian.

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:54 am

im never guna forget it

iv also made sure there is room on my phone for pictures

im more excited about seeing the car than getting the bumper to complete my kit lol

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:04 am

Saab is working on a solenoid system which has infinite timing and lift potential as well as no cams. Now that is ultimate performance/economy.

A

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:05 am

fookin hell
never thought ud get that from the same country that produces volvos

500 posts nearly!!

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:16 am

lotus been working on road going pneumatic valve engines im sure i read someplace

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:19 am

jees this shits crazy

i need to learn some stuff about timing n that im pretty behind!

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:34 am

Simon13 wrote:my moneys well and truly on the 3.0 litre lump bulletproof. Plus 3.0 lumps actually make the claimed HP output

i agree the 3.0 is a much stronger unit.
ive heard of them with 200k on the clock and still going strong

not heard of them making stock (still good tho) from what i gathered on the m power forum my m8s on (he owns an e36 3.0 M3)

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:09 am

what about the 3.0 M54 for a conversion engine?

similar weight to m20, more power than a modded m52

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:12 am

Chaos wrote:what about the 3.0 M54 for a conversion engine?

similar weight to m20, more power than a modded m52

It has potential, but also has a lot of wiring issues getting it to run in an E30.

I believe the M54 needs to see the orginal Instrument cluster to work, and you also have fly by wire throttle to deal with.

I think Brian is working on this conversion at the moment.

Ian.

Post Wed Jul 27, 2005 8:16 am

With double-VANOS, the opening period of the intake valves are extended by 12 degrees with an increase in valve lift by 0.9 mm.

Taken from that site, not sure it's entirely accurate.

Might they be talking about increasing lift on overlap, not absolute lift? The operating principal behind VANOS is quite simple as it just swings the cams about, that can't increase lift!

Similarly, it can't increase the amount of time a valve's open for.

Tis a brilliant idea though, you can have buggerall lift on overlap at low engine speeds so that all (most of) the air through the TB gets trapped in the cylinder (hence lots of low end torque, good emmisions and economy) and then you can have masses of lift on overlap at high revs for maximum scavenging effect from the exhaust

Post Sat Jul 30, 2005 1:14 am

Widge wrote: The M10 blocks were stored out side the smoking door of the Brabham (Sh1t I think it was Brabham - any one...) F1 team who used the BMW engines and the guys used to pi55 on them, this "accelerated" weathering was to relieve internal stresses that would lead to hot spots with the immense turbo charging.

1500bhp was achieved- and BMW even developed a funny head which had a nam beginning with A (I'll look it up I know where the magazine is) which put the valves in a mini V8 kinda lay out, this was for F2 I think and gave increased Bhp due to increased valve area and using 2 cam shafts. I'll scan the article if anyone is interested.

Shame we haven't got an insider at the Motorsport division

Just for reference there is a company in the midlands who can repair vanos units for a lot less than a new one.

Also there is a company in Bristol who can play with the 6 speed 'boxes.

From what I understand the 6 speed box is sealed for life. BMW do this by using a kind of internal circlip arrangement, so once the two halves are mated, they stay that way. Apparently there is method of getting the box apart, which involves breaking the circlip and not the casings. Hence repairs/mods can be made.

Andy