My budget tech 1 turbo

[b12rlw]

Abandoned Car ('86 325 with all the toys) - £1000
1st MOT after 3 yrs - £3
Turbo Kit inc massive intercooler - £800
310mm Wilwoods and Calipers - £1000

Thought I'd tell you all of my project e30 and hopefully get some feedback/ideas. I sold my £20k Impreza WR1 last year as i fancied a change. I heard from a guy at work, that his brother was toying with selling his e30. The car was Stripped bare in 1996 and a local garage owner carried out a £17k resto. It was featured in one of the beemer mags, cant remember which one, but i've got a copy somewhere. Anyhoo, I went round to the guys house and knocked on his door, he seemed pretty surprised that some random dude was here trying to buy his car. Before he knew it we were peering thru his kitchen window at an e30 under a car cover. The only sign of what lay below was a glimpse of a 17" alpina rep with a flat tyre. On closer inspection, I revealed a good, solid, lowered zinnobarrot tech 1 '86 325 with fully retrimmed black leather...nice! Cutting a long story short I bought the car for £1000. A new battery, MOT, costing £3 (a windscreen washer t peice from the scrappy and a £2 bulb) and 6mths tax later and I was legal. I managed to get hold of a nice T3/4 hybrid and all ancillaries for only £800 (including manifold, ext wastegate, huge intercooler, pipes, connections etc. This week the car has been running 0.6Bar boost, M535i afm and flys. I'm looking at management and fueling (pump/injectors etc) just now and will be installing/mapping it at the turn of the year hopefully. pics will be uploaded ( some on here already somewhere)and comments/thoughts are more than welcome

[b12rlw]

Here are a few links to the pics posted here with the car as std.

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... fullsize=1
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... 1139&pos=1
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... 1139&pos=2
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... 1139&pos=3

[327ire]

hey, how are you fueling the boost at the moment?
Iv kinda finished a turbo project myself but im getting weird lean mixtures after a few minutes of using the car. She flys when its running right, getting to 60mph in 6 seconds but then the fuel dies off and it turns into a slug.

Im running all sorts of injector/ecu/fmu combos but Im sure my problem is a mechanical problem. To get the car running the right mix of fuel even on a standard ECU I have to use 19lb injectors

[b12rlw]

Its running stock pump and injectors, FSE regulator @3.5Bar and superchips 2.7 n/a chip. Runs and boosts strong and early but ive wound it down to 0.5bar boost as it leans off over 4500rpm. Its running mega rich to help keep the pistons cool. Its got a good sting in the tail now. I want to go standalone but i'm lost as to what injectors and ecu to go for. Ive seen a 1.5 bar spike in boost when we were mucking about to start with and it screamed - faster than my WR1 impreza but i dont want to kill it. Cant wait to get the fueling sorted.

[b12rlw]

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... &pos=-1347
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... =441&pos=5
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... =441&pos=4
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... &pos=-1348

[327ire]

I have a spare 19lb turbo chip, bought 2 by mistake. A guy in the states live mapped his turbo on 19lb injectors and now he sells copies of the chip. I think I could have a spare 24lb injector version to, Il take look if your interested.

Im a bit sick of my turbo project, Iv had sooooo many problems. Mostly hidden little bast@rds of problems like a blocked fuel return that I spent countless hours wasting my time

[b12rlw]

Can anyone advise on suitable injectors for my build. I've been thinking bosch '803 greens. Any suggestions on where to aquire such items?

[b12rlw]

So, today is a day for slight progress. Looks like the budget has grown too. Megasquirt ECU ordered along with innovate wideband controller. Need to sort out injectors and fuel pump but at least were making progress. The fun bit is just round the corner!!!!! Assembling a new loom.....good job I dont mind spaghetti. The plan is though, to spend the time and get everything nice and neat

[Ilkorin]

Good shout! Don't underestimate the importance of engine management on a turbo build. The rich running will strip the oil off the cylinder walls and wear the engine pretty quick!

Before stripping the original loom out consider using it... it's not hard to get megasquirt attached to the motronic connector and you won't have issues with crank sensor noise etc. due to a homemade loom (not saying you will, just that mistakes are easy to make)

Injectors wise... whatever you like, provided they are top feed. If you get fancy low impedance ones, megasquirt can handle that so no problems there. I've got skyline GTT ones in mine, simply because they provide enough fuel if I ever go turbo (not likely now I found one premade)...rewire the connectors and it works a treat. Watch on ebay for secondhand injectors and get them rebuilt.

A lot of good advice regarding M20 turbo conversions and megasquirt can be found on E30tech... some cracking cars on there!

[ross2009]

im nearly tho building mine to if ya need any wiring diagrams maps etc just ask ive got every thing ive used my original loom and made a harness out of an old ecu box to my squirt works a treat
as for fuel pump use a e36 m3 pump good for up to 400bhp and the actual pump will fit in the e30 pump body thats what ive done
i bought my injectors from the states i think they were 220 shipped 42lbs bosch lime greens
check mine out if ya like
http://s924.photobucket.com/albums/ad86/Rossco1980/

[b12rlw]

Cheers lads. Just priced some units from the states and i'm being quoted around the £200 mark for a set of genuine 440's and 550's price the same. Can anyone suggest pros and cons?????? tempted to go for the 550's cos i'm a man and bigger is better right??

[ross2009]

42lbs will be plently big enough for 400bhp plus 550s are way to big lol imo

[b12rlw]

So, MOT expired and the car is off the road and in my brothers garage. Pretty depressing for both of us. my beemers parked up for a while and his broken 450bhp MR2 is above it on the ramp. boo! time for a brain transplant tho. yeah! Used coilpack has arrived £16 from fleabay, bracket to be fab'd tomorrow. Also been creating a gauge pod in the driver side heater vent. should look shhmoothski after another smear of plastic bumper filler and a squirt of matt black paint, AFR guage looks pretty clean in it. ecu to be here soon along with knock conditioner. My old laptop has been brought back from the dead ready for data logging and ive been thinking about using modified e34 v8 header tank for the cooling system keeping everything out of the way????. Also do i go for the profec e-01 boost controller???????? can i justify the £300++??????? (maybe)... Downpipe to come off and have the o2 bung welded in then wrapped. busy couple of nightshifts and weekend ahead...............

[b12rlw]

Megasquirt unit arrived the other day but sadly due to a little mis-communication, it's gone back for a knock input to be added. Today we started stripping the old loom. I'm not gonna be doing the chop it short and leave it thing. All unused wiring is coming out and all fresh stuff going back in (nicely heat shrunk). I've got imobilisers that need to come out so i'm guessing that could be an @rs3 of a job. Also timing belt kit and water pump ordered still tyring to source injectors, would like 52lb (550's) but think the ones i can find are a bit short 65mm as opposed to 75??? so it looks like its gonna be 440 green giants. ripped my arm on the rusty wing i love so much (only spot of rust and gives a bit of character) but the bastard is coming off and its gonna be replaced. the list is getting longer!!

[staley_turbo]

I think 440s should be ok for what your running. For a cheap option used skyline gtr/pulsar gtr injectors.

[b12rlw]

Ok boys and girls, today I started stripping the wiring loom 8-( Looks like the fud that carried out the rebuild last time has bodged some sttuff. W@NK3R!!! Anyway, engine loom is out and lighting loom is going to have bits and bobs chopped to accomodate the washer bottle/ horn relocation etc. Ive also discovered a nice hole under the fuse box which i'll need to deal with too. Think i'm gonna run into issues removing the afetrmarket alarm/immobiliser looking at the mess behind the glovebox. 440cc injectors are ordered along with a walbro 255. Waterpump and timing belt kit arrived today too. Megasquirt is getting the boost controller added along with fan output, meaning the viscous effort will be held delete making space for a thicker rad I'm also going to fabricate a custom tapered inlet manifold using the original flange and injector sockets and the throttle body will be mounted just above the alternator. work list is getting longer, we'll get there! It will run again!

[b12rlw]

Work on the car today consisted of waterpump and timing belt replacement. I'm waiting for a toothed crank pulley to come as i'm converting from the gearbox sensors to signal the megasquirt unit. Inlet manifold is off and in the boot of the car for some bastardisation at work over the weekend. I'm also gonna get a hold of some fuel rail extrusion and fabricate my own rail. We've also come up with a plan for the throttle body. on the fromt side of the unit, where the idle valve would sit, i'm going to add an air by-pass screw assembly and remove the idle valve.

[ross2009]

with megasquirt you dont need the icv anyway

[b12rlw]

im nearly tho building mine to if ya need any wiring diagrams maps etc just ask ive got every thing ive used my original loom and made a harness out of an old ecu box to my squirt works a treat
as for fuel pump use a e36 m3 pump good for up to 400bhp and the actual pump will fit in the e30 pump body thats what ive done
i bought my injectors from the states i think they were 220 shipped 42lbs bosch lime greens
check mine out if ya like
http://s924.photobucket.com/albums/ad86/Rossco1980/

Looks pretty sweet mate. Cheers for some ideas. Thats where i'll be a few weeks after mine is running, back to the start for a full rebuild once its gone bang, but hey, at least it keeps me out of the wifes hair!!!

[ross2009]

lol ive spent a bloody small fortune on mine but hey i dont go out much i aint exactly gonna get rid of it anytime soon and its gonna be exactly how i want it when its all done a rocket on wheels

[b12rlw]

That's the plan for mine too. It's 25 years old so it's served its proper purpose, time to give it a new, modern lease of life methinks.

Today's tasks were to fabricate a dizzy cover plate and start chopping the manifold. Hard to juggle when you've got industrial pumps to strip, 70tonne overhead cranes to repair and leaking pipework to sort. Managed tho!! One of the few perks of the job is suppose!! Dizzy cover required the lip on the cambelt cover to be removed in order for the plate to sit flush, then a 2mm ally pate cut and fitted! Intake mani involved chopping with a 9" grinder, I'll be making a jig tomorrow out of 30mm plate to hold everything square while I'm milling and welding the flange, past the point of no return it seems. I'm thinking 4mm ally sheet will do for the manifold, might get away with 3mm stuff tho.

[GeoffBob]

b12rlw, there are well documented ways and means to determine the correct size injectors for your application. A major factor is sizing your injectors is whether or not you plan to batch-fire or sequential-fire them. Sequential-fired injectors need to be larger than those on a batched-fired engine producing same power output due to the fact that you do not wish to exceed a duty-cycle of typically around 60% on sequential-fired injectors, while batch-fired injectors can be run up to 80% duty-cycle.

FYI, 440cc/min injectors will deliver a maximum of 352cc/min of fuel at 80% duty-cycle (I'm assuming you will be batch-firing your injectors). Since you have six cylinders that equates to a total of 2112cc/min or 2.112 litres/min of fuel at max power output (costing you roughly £3.20 per minute ).

Now, pump-petrol has a density of roughly 1.6lbs per litre. Your six injectors are thus capable of flowing a rough total of 3.38 lbs/min of fuel. At an AFR of 12:1 you will need to flow 40.6 lbs/min of air in order to combust your 3.38 lbs/min of fuel.

As a rule of thumb, each 10hp at the flywheel will cost you 1 lb/min of airflow into the engine. Hence, assuming you will be running sufficient boost for your 2500cc engine to successfully induct 41lbs/min of air, and, assuming your engine is conditioned to handle it, then your engine will deliver a maximum of 400hp to the flywheel. Taking drive-train losses into account, around 75% of that (300hp) should make it to the wheels.

You can, thus, be satisfied in your choice of injectors provided your intention is to batch-fire them. Where I do have a concern, however, is in your choice of turbocharger. You don’t mention the details of your T3/T4 hybrid, but unless it is one of the larger trim T4 compressors (57, 60 etc) you are going to battle to flow the 40 lbs/min of air required to produce 400hp. You could potentially wind up operating your compressor very close to the far-right of the compressor map at full power, where the compressor effectively chokes. Post up the details of your turbocharger and wastegate and it would be possible to tell more accurately what will happen.

HTH
Geoff

[GeoffBob]

Today's tasks were to fabricate a dizzy cover plate ...

I assume this means that you will be running a sequential ignition then? Good choice

I have the same on my turbocharged Toyota 3SGTE here, as does Tim_Haynes on his supercharged M20B25 here.

[b12rlw]

Batch fired fueling and wasted spark is what's planned. I'm going to be swapping out the hybrid turbo for a holset unit. The cars been stroked to 2.7l. Initial plan is to get the ecu installed and mapped, leaving room for expansion/ further developments in the future.

Today i made my jig and started playing with port matching. One inlet done so some more grinding and flapping required. I'll get that done once the spacer tubes and plenum side-cheek is welded as i might need to dress the inside of the tubes. Looks like ive just talked myself into heading back out to work (after having done a 13hr shift) to get some machining done, then down to the workshop to get a trial fit. late night ahead???????????????????

[b12rlw]

Inlet manifold flange has been machined to take the six inlet tubes, ports have been opened up and polished. Tubes have been welded (after spending an hour repairing the blood tig torch) but i'm not happy with the angle they sit at. I'll need to chop them off and set them at 20 degrees improving the port feed angle and adding some clearance for the engine bay. Got plans drawn up for my plemum, which will be snug, squeezed in next to the brake booster. toothed crank pulley has arrived, just need to order a sensor and a plug for the loom. i need to sort a photobucket account and link to some of the pics.

[b12rlw]

hope this works - Pics posted here -> http://s1233.photobucket.com/albums/ff3 ... 20Project/

[ross2009]

looking sweet man

[b12rlw]

oakey dokey - Manifold is 90% there, Throttle body flange has been plasma'd from the old mani and tacked onto the front of the new mani, needs turned about 5degrees to line it up with where the cooler pipes come up inside the chassis leg. Still waiting for my bastard injectors and fuel pump and ive ordered a crank sensor bracket, almost a fortnight ago and it aint appeared, not happy!! Still trying to source fuel rail extrusion. Loom will be started next weekend, should have been this weekend but i was collecting my new runabout/workhorse a '98 Skoda cubevan, dont take the piss its a cheap ass bus! pics updated

[Gunni]

Why do you need a fuel rail extrusion?

[b12rlw]

mainly for aesthetics, but the old rail mounts were chopped off with the rest of the mani. Anyhoo, my injectors are due in the morning, with only £23 more fucking pounds going to the twats that run the country!!! bonus!!!

[b12rlw]

Gunni, due to the difficulties in logistics/ procurement of an alloy extrusion, the manifold has been adapted to suit the old rail, plenty big!! looks good too.

managed to get a crank sensor bracket........£9 from a classic beemer place (which never arrived) or £6 from local dealer, happy days! need to get a hold of some screened cable for the crank pickup and finish the loom. I was looking at modifying the original fuse/relay box to accomodate the added stuff but i'll just add another box at the other side of the bay.

One question - what stuff do i need to keep from the round connector on the bulkhead??

[b12rlw]

Heres an update. Wiring is all but sorted, engine is to come out for a paddle clutch and a modified sump to be fitted. Ill have a wee peek up the bores and check all is in order (for now). Has any 1 done the z3 shifter mod?

[ross2009]

plently of people on here have done the z3 shifter mod the throws a little shorter not huge tho but a nice little easy quick shift

just wondering are you from milton keynes eaglestone nethefield area ??

[b12rlw]

The guy that rebuilt my car in 1995 made his own shifter. Dont think his machining skills were up to much as its as slack as hell and i'm looking for something a little sweeter. I was wondering if there was a parts list or something? I'm from Scotland mate, a town called Irvine, just south of Glasgow.

[ross2009]

o right ok just recognised the houses thought it was some where near me