M50 Developments - considering an M50? Read this.

[6potWil6pot]

Dammn they gave you a 2.0 M50, i hope u got ur Ԛ£ back

Non Vanos M50 is nice anyway

[Brianmoooore]

Some of the wires are a different colour on the engine (plug) side of the loom than they are in the body (socket) side of the loom.
Pin numbers should be correct.

[randomdave325]

Some of the wires are a different colour on the engine (plug) side of the loom than they are in the body (socket) side of the loom.
Pin numbers should be correct.

i thought of that last night. cheers for that brian . just got all the gaskets etc from bmw. (Ԛ£100 ) so should all be on for tommorrow.
i bought the e28 m5 mounts and they are no different in size to the e34 525 ones. one is identical. so sump will still be low. i had to try tho. another unnecessary Ԛ£50. i do have a habit of breaking the standard e30 mounts (done about 6 now) as i think they get too old and can't hack the abuse. new ones should last a few years now
it will be nice to have the extra 500 cc. it's mad how different they are. i can't drive it as a 2.0. it's too disheartening. all noise and no go

[randomdave325]

Do you have a vanos M50 loom dude? I have a non vanos loom if you want to swap? what ecu no were you running on the vanos M50?

i'm just gonna use the loom i already have as the one on the 36 lump is butchered. use whatever ecu/loom came with the engine. you know it's right then. especially if you have the ews setup. it's all matched

[ian332isport]

i bought the e28 m5 mounts and they are no different in size to the e34 525 ones. one is identical. so sump will still be low. i had to try tho. another unnecessary Ԛ£50

Send Buster a PM, he's currently getting parts together for an S50 conversion, so will be needing those mounts (assuming he hasn't got them already).

See here:

http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... pic&t=8243

Cheers,

Ian.

[randomdave325]

Dammn they gave you a 2.0 M50, i hope u got ur Ԛ£ back

Non Vanos M50 is nice anyway

i straight swapped for the 2.5 lump. the least they could do really.
i quite like the idea of non vanos as it's less to go wrong. i'm gonna put the biggest lairyest cams i can get in it so it only just ticks over.
not that fussed about low end drivability. just have to rake it more
i love the way it revs through to the red now with the m50. with a chip and cams i can get more out of it again. it loves it. it will take a lot to beat my old 316 (minibim r.i.p) on rpms. i used to rev that to 12mpg! sounded sweet through a carb. bit excessive for this one tho.

sorry for doing 3 posts in a row to answer questions. had to get the post count to 325. just wish my car was now

[randomdave325]

Send Buster a PM, he's currently getting parts together for an S50 conversion, so will be needing those mounts (assuming he hasn't got them already).

nice thought mate. but i think i'm gonna fit them anyway. plus i wouldn't want to lose any money on them so with the postage it would be cheaper to get them from bm. sorry

[iKst]

Tnx for wiring instructions

btw...why dont you guys use custom made mounts ? They are cheap and you can get them made from your specs. There should be someone who makes this kind of stuff. You just tell them how big and hard it has to be. I paid around 25 euro for a pair.

[Andy325i]

Do you have a vanos M50 loom dude? I have a non vanos loom if you want to swap? what ecu no were you running on the vanos M50?

i'm just gonna use the loom i already have as the one on the 36 lump is butchered. use whatever ecu/loom came with the engine. you know it's right then. especially if you have the ews setup. it's all matched

I don't have the ECU with the M52 mate, converting to ODB1, which is supposed to release more power. Hence got to use an M50 vanos loom and ECU. I have a Burgandy 413 one which I am told is the right one but need to double check this. Do you know what your M50 Vanos ECU no is off hand?

Can't wait to get it done now!!!!

[iKst]

Im just back from my garage and i have some problems with wiring loom. I dont think i understand this completly, so help please.

I have too much wires I connected those 2 round connectors. I found the right wires and matched E36 and E30 ones together. Then there is a big red wire that is connected to starter, and there is slightly thinner red wire that goes on + right ?

But there are some more wires comming from that wire box. Originaly those wires are connected to E36 fuse box, but im using E30 fuse box. The problem is i dont know where to put those wires that should go to E36 fuse box

I know its confusing, but if someone know what im talking about please help. Pics of engine bay and loom would also help.

Tnx

[randomdave325]

I don't have the ECU with the M52 mate, converting to ODB1, which is supposed to release more power. Hence got to use an M50 vanos loom and ECU. I have a Burgandy 413 one which I am told is the right one but need to double check this. Do you know what your M50 Vanos ECU no is off hand?

theres an 95 e34 525 vanos up the road that they are breaking. i can get the loom off that for you if you like. it'll have ews tho. don't know if it's got keys (or if they could be bothered to find them more like). failing that i can just get the ecu number for you. let me know asap init. got no t'internet at home and it shuts at 1 2mo. my ecu is going back with the engine. 2.0 is no good 2 u anyway or me for that matter .
whats obd1? excuse my ignorance

[Brianmoooore]

Plain red wires generally connect to the battery +.
There are more wires in the E34/E36 loom connector than in the E30 socket, but all the ones that are needed are there, except the grey one for the ECU fault light.
If you look at my post above, you will see that several E34 wires are not used, mainly associated with the aircon.
Rather than leave these wires floating, and possibly suseptable to static, I connected them all to earth, via 1000 ohm resistors.

[buster]

reardiffraver,i'll buy them off you and pay the postage if you want to sell them.I have paypal or cash/cheque.

Let me know as i will order them saturday if not.

thanks

cheers Ian for the shout also.

[randomdave325]

But there are some more wires comming from that wire box. Originaly those wires are connected to E36 fuse box, but im using E30 fuse box. The problem is i dont know where to put those wires that should go to E36 fuse box

i used the e34 loom and all i disconnected was the live and earth next to the ecu. the ecu and the big multiplug. i had none going to the fusebox.
if you use the wiring diagrams posted above you should have no probs really. as mine and brians both start! the ones you can't find or can't see where they go just leave and see if it starts! worked for me

[Andy325i]

I don't have the ECU with the M52 mate, converting to ODB1, which is supposed to release more power. Hence got to use an M50 vanos loom and ECU. I have a Burgandy 413 one which I am told is the right one but need to double check this. Do you know what your M50 Vanos ECU no is off hand?

theres an 95 e34 525 vanos up the road that they are breaking. i can get the loom off that for you if you like. it'll have ews tho. don't know if it's got keys (or if they could be bothered to find them more like). failing that i can just get the ecu number for you. let me know asap init. got no t'internet at home and it shuts at 1 2mo. my ecu is going back with the engine. 2.0 is no good 2 u anyway or me for that matter .
whats obd1? excuse my ignorance

Hi mate, I think all M50's were ODB1 (non EWS) if you could check how much they want for the loom and ECU or a phone number I would be eternally greatful and will sort you out for your time of course!

Kind regards

Andy

[Andy325i]

Double post

[randomdave325]

reardiffraver,i'll buy them off you and pay the postage if you want to sell them.I have paypal or cash/cheque.

i'm gonna use them now m8. this thing is gonna get some serious abuse when it goes so new engine mounts should last a bit longer than the original ones i used. i ordered them and got them nxt day so if you order 2 mo you should have them by tuesday at the latest.
keep us posted how yours is going. it will be an animal!

[randomdave325]

Hi mate, I think all M50's were ODB1 (non EWS) if you could check how much they want for the loom and ECU

no probs m8. i'm on it 2morrow! they owe me Ԛ£40 for the maf off the same car(doesn't fit the early loom). so will probably do some kinda deal. where abouts are you. i see avon. top end of zummerzet yeah

actually i know where theres a e36 325 (non vanos, non ews) breaking. i can get the loom and ecu off that if thats any good to ya. matey is sound as so won't be too much. i need the oil level sensor off it anyway.
just thinking again (gotta stop that) and theres a 96 e36 328 in the same place as the 525. so you've got a bit of a choice. which one do you want?

[Andy325i]

Hi mate, I think all M50's were ODB1 (non EWS) if you could check how much they want for the loom and ECU

no probs m8. i'm on it 2morrow! they owe me Ԛ£40 for the maf off the same car(doesn't fit the early loom). so will probably do some kinda deal. where abouts are you. i see avon. top end of zummerzet yeah

actually i know where theres a e36 325 (non vanos, non ews) breaking. i can get the loom and ecu off that if thats any good to ya. matey is sound as so won't be too much. i need the oil level sensor off it anyway.
as they say the choice is yours

Hi dude, I have a M50 non vanos loom already, but need the later M50 one to do the vanos and the knock sensors in the block. I think the E34 loom is a better option too as the ECU plug goes to the right side of the car (E36 goes to Near side). Where have you mounted your ECU?

Just thought, would be interested in the prop off that E36 if its available mate, are there any fancy bits on it as I have a mate with 2x 325i E36's

Thanks for all your help


Kind regards


Andy

[randomdave325]

cool i'll grab the e34 one then. i'll get a price on the prop b4 i get it. they might have one off anyway.
ecu and relays are just resting on the battery tray atm. my mate is sorting a watertight battery sized box when he gets round to it. handy my battery is in the boot really as i don't know where it would go otherwise. got to get a gert gromit for where the original ecu loom went. it leaks enuff water as it is. doesnt need any more help

[Andy325i]

cool i'll grab the e34 one then. i'll get a price on the prop b4 i get it. they might have one off anyway.
ecu and relays are just resting on the battery tray atm. my mate is sorting a watertight battery sized box when he gets round to it. handy my battery is in the boot really as i don't know where it would go otherwise. got to get a gert gromit for where the original ecu loom went. it leaks enuff water as it is. doesnt need any more help

Cool! Cheers dude

LOL! I know about the water!

was thinking about extending the ECU wires to sit it in the normal place

[Brianmoooore]

I extended the ECU wires by 300mm. Wouldn't do it again, took a long time to do. Next time I'll go with the waterproof box on the battery tray.

[ian332isport]

I have too much wires I connected those 2 round connectors. I found the right wires and matched E36 and E30 ones together. Then there is a big red wire that is connected to starter, and there is slightly thinner red wire that goes on + right ?

But there are some more wires comming from that wire box. Originaly those wires are connected to E36 fuse box, but im using E30 fuse box. The problem is i dont know where to put those wires that should go to E36 fuse box

I had the same wires on my S50 engine. As already stated, the big fat red, and the smaller red both go to the battery. The wire that comes from the wiring box, and went to the E36 fuse box is the main power feed into the fuse box for the rest of the car.

On the E30, there is a separate wire (not part of the engine harness) that does this, but on the E36, they built it into the engine loom. I chose to remove the original E30 wire, and use the E36 one as it was a bit neater, but it would work just as well if you kept the E30 wire, and insulated the E36 wire and tucked it away somewhere.

Cheers,

Ian.

[randomdave325]

mornin people. has anyone got a manual or autodata book with the torque setting for the mainend caps on a 92 325 m50? i've just taken the sump off and have to remove the bracket for the e36 stainer to make the 2.0 e36 spec. this is held on by the mainend cap bolts unfortunatly so am kind of stuck without the torque setting. if you have got a book could you please look and let me know asap. i've been on it all night as need the car to get home tommorow. the time now is 3.45am so am gonna try and get some sleep. it's been a long day and this is the last thing i need.
please please help. thanks. dave

[ian332isport]

M50 main bearing caps should be torqued to 20Nm, and then a torque angle of 50 degrees.

Cheers,

Ian.

[randomdave325]

thanks ian. you are a star. i blatently owe you a
i can get back on it now. all been well she'll be flyin later 2day.
nice one

[iKst]

after 2 days of fuc***ing with all those wires i finaly started the engine. The reason it didnt turn was faulty key lock When i took it off and turned that start switch with a screwdriver it started to turn...me happy

[buster]

hi guys
Got the S50 out on sunday,took me and a pal 6 hours !

Im very concerned about the wiring,i think i will go back to the car today to make sure i got it all.

To the left of the engine where the wires come from the box on top of the engine i have the service indicator plug,and a large red wire and small red wire which were bolted to a strange junction block.

To the right of the box,one bit plugged into the ecu behind a panel on the firewall of the e36 and then another bit went to the fuse box where 3 relays were clipped to it,i removed them.Then there is 2 round plugs.i had to unplug them as they ran into fuse box.

Where does the EWS box live,and how is it connected to the loom??

heres a pic of the s50.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v481/busteruk/s50.bmp

notice the weapon of choice,Hammer !!!!

cheers guys
andy

[buster]

hi guys,heres a better explanation to what i was asking on last post.

Heres my pics



I am going to remove those stupid ecotec valves.Notice the small green filter under the big green filter,it goes to the air pump thing.Can i remove the air pump or should i leave it on ? If i remove it do i leave the metal pipe on and block the end of it ?

This is the left side of the engine loom.



where do i put these wires ?

Heres the right side of the loom.



I know the ecu plugs into the large connector,the little wire near the MAF is for the MAF,although it had no plug on it,the wires were pushed onto the relevant pins,pulled it off now though.
The 2 round plugs,do i need the other side of those 2 plugs as they go into the fuse box and i can't seem to remove them,there are wires every where in that box.

Not sure where the little red wire goes.

In this pic i assume this wiring is for the lambda sensors.The loose wiring in that lot i think was for the air fuel ratio gauges the car had fitted.



Your help,comments and views appreciated .

cheers
andy

[buster]

a few more questions;
Do i need the throttle cable ?

Where is the EWS box and what does it look like ?

Will i be ok to fit the engine and do wiring last or will i need to sort any electrics out before i fit it?

[ian332isport]

hi guys
Got the S50 out on sunday,took me and a pal 6 hours !

Im very concerned about the wiring,i think i will go back to the car today to make sure i got it all.

To the left of the engine where the wires come from the box on top of the engine i have the service indicator plug,and a large red wire and small red wire which were bolted to a strange junction block.

To the right of the box,one bit plugged into the ecu behind a panel on the firewall of the e36 and then another bit went to the fuse box where 3 relays were clipped to it,i removed them.Then there is 2 round plugs.i had to unplug them as they ran into fuse box.

Where does the EWS box live,and how is it connected to the loom??

Hi Andy,

The large red and the smaller red need to connect to the battery junction point on the drivers side of your E30 bulkhead. The big fat one goes to the big fat one on the E30 (that has the battery post style connector). The smaller one goes to the smaller connector on the same junction point. This is basically the same as your current M20. I used one of these to save cutting the E36 loom apart:



On the other side, you have a medium fat red wire. This is the main feed into the E30 fuse box. If you leave the original E30 wire connected, then you don't need this wire. I chose to remove the original E30 wire, and connect this wire to the E30 fuse box. It's just a bit neater that way

The bigger of the two round connectors (the one with most wires) is what needs to connect to the big E30 plug on the bulkhead. The other plug (3 wires I think) is not used, although I seem to remember using one of the wires from it (possibly for the oil level sensor, but I would have to check to be sure). You don't need the E36 car side of either of these plugs, so don't bother removing them from the car. You need the relays, and these clip nicely on the side of the E30 fuse box. The relay near the ECU connector is also needed, and is part of the starter circuit.

The EWS box is fitted up under the dash, and does not connect directly to the engine harness. You really need to find the EWS module, small transmit/receive module, and loop antenna. If you can find them, also get the connectors that plug into them, as it will be tricky wiring it all up without them. Just cut the plugs off the under dash harness, but leave about 8" of wire to play with. You can see roughly what the EWS and transmit/receive modules look like here:

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=61&fg=25

As for the Air pump, you can bin it, along with all the pipework. BMW sell a nice blanking plate (11 72 1 402 416) for where the pipe connects to the cylinder head (under the exhaust manifold), so it's nice and easy

The wiring that goes along the side of the gearbox has the following:

Reverse light switch
Gear recogniton switch
Clutch pressure switch
2 x lambda sensors

It would be worth taking the throttle cable. I used the E36 cable, but modified it to fit correctly. The easier way is to slightly change the position of the bracket on the intake runners.

I think it would be easier to do all the wiring first, and then fit the engine and wiring together. It would be a turd of a job fitting the loom with the engine already fitted.

Cheers,

Ian.

[Karan]

nice to see another e30 dude getting a proper lump fitted

[buster]

thanks very much Ian,i owe you many pints

I really need to fit the engine this weekend as it is in someone else's garage and it needs to be moved.Will it be imposible to wire it with it in place because if it isnt i will have to sort something else out with putting the engine somewhere.

[ian332isport]

Will it be imposible to wire it with it in place.

Andy,

Certainly not impossible, just not as easy as doing it out of the car.

It's your back that will suffer more than anything

Access is actually not bad for the wiring. Once the inlet plenum is removed, it's all pretty easy to see and work on.

Cheers,

Ian.

[buster]

nice one cheers Ian.I will have to remove inlet plenum anyway (why is mine silver,all the ones ive seen are black) to address the servo problem.

I am going to size up a 944 servo and possibly fit it lower down on the bulkhead,not sure yet.Failing that i will have to do what you did on yours.
I have to pipe up the clutch aswell.I rather stupidly cut the pipe on the evo as it was the only thing holding it in the engine bay as i was tugging away at it on the hoist.