Project-M45 super charger (developments)

[tim_s]

just been looking at this thread again, makes great reading! great workmanship and design, and the results speak for themselves. Totally in awe of this

[appletree]

Cheers tim, means alot coming from some one whos put as much work in to a M42 as you have.

How is yours going now? havent heard or seen anything from you in abit

[tim_s]

lol no worries, it is a wicked project, you shoud be proud!
there's plenty more to the story of mine since I've last seen you. was a bit neglected really for a while. Got new place and job tail end of last yr, meant car had to do a lot more miles and sit on a street. these changed priorities meant I got LPG going quicksharp, and ran like that for a while. LPG is great, slight performance loss, but massive cash gain. Drives pretty smoothly too. Have actually sent the injectors off to be modified to get more power out of it as it's leaning off slightly at high rpm.
When the small end bushes on my new block failed and I had a quick 2 wk turnaround full rebuild (remember the unidentified slight ticking when you came in it), did some more tweaks while there, but didn't put the ITBs back on, wanting to keep it simple to run it in etc. Then found i had little time or inclination to put them back on - it was quieter on the mway without, nicer in traffic and easier for the missus to drive. So Dan bought them off me and the old squirt.
I then tried a perfect power SMT piggyback, didn't really work that well for my setup so i flogged it on. Since then things picked up with it, got MS2 extra in there to replace the PP which i'm running both for fuel and sparks, that still needs some tuning and tweaking, been short of time. Also done a COP conversion, and have an even better new flowed cyl head on the way with larger throats, 3 angled valves and seats, chamferred guides, skimmed to go even higher CR. should flow much better than my current 6mm head, i have high hopes for it. have about a wk off the wk after next so will hopefully fit it then, and hopefully get some new cams in. if not, they'll come in august when i have some holiday from work. At the moment it nails a 323 and is about the same as a 328; will hopefully soon see it a bit quicker, there's a good deal extra still to be unleashed.
have actually stumbled on some free TBs again, and its feeling a bit rude not to. but we'll see!
all said and done i'm loving the car to drive at the moment. it delivers its power really well and is a hoot to drive, while remaining pretty usable. Have also done 20k since the original rebuild. here's the only recentish pics i have

[toby]

That insurance is expensive but good for you for paying it

Fantastic project - very well done. I've been following this for ages!

I think the 318is should have come with boost as standard!

A standard 'is' always seemed to lack something in perfomance to me, especially low down. Too many revs and not enough ponies.

[appletree]

Tim that sounds very cool are you thinking of taking it to any shows this year? we'll have to meet up again!

i have done some thing a little norty as regards ITBs, ive just bought a billet CNC machined adaptor and trumpets to fit hayabusa throttle boddies to the IS from a guy in the US ! yet to arrive but look the dogs

might do something like a rotx centrifugal supercharger set up next on a low comp engine with the throttle bodies and or put the plenum streight on to the adaptors to keep everything realy neat and compact

Not to sure about how well ITBs work on a boosted set-up allthough they do the converstion on the M3 so i cant be to muchof a problem

[tim_s]

you bought david's adaptor, lol small world! Looks like a really nice bit of kit too! he nearly bought my ITBs a while back, I was busy and didn't really get back to him very well about it all cos it wasn't really a priority, then they went to dan!
not really got any plans for shows, send us a pm when you're going to one and i'll see what i can do, would love to do a 1/4 mile against yours too, somehow i think it'd be a tall order for my NA engine though.

[Toby_Unna]

these two cars would look really good together in a mag, two very different but equally impressive ways to make an iS much much better

Appletree, ITBs work fine with FI as far as I know

[appletree]

these two cars would look really good together in a mag, two very different but equally impressive ways to make an iS much much better

You offering toby?? ED hall's got my details

[tim_s]

i'd love that

[jkarran]

Matt, I've put some pics up on photobucket of the (limited) progress I've made so as not to swamp your thread, I'll just post the one, the rest are linked here http://s118.photobucket.com/albums/o118 ... n/?start=0



The runners have ~10mm 1/4 radius bellmouts for good flow. There's a hollow stay welded between top and bottom, it controls balooning and allows me to bolt the plenum to the TBs. The runners are all aligned quite well with the TBs though the outer ones are about 1/2mm out of alignment due to distortion from the heat. I welded a couple of bosses into the plenum to tap for inlet temp and a pressure signal for TB diaphragms and dump valve. The IC will weld on and the water jacket will then glue on with Araldite 1421 <edit: that should be 2014 > high temp chemical resistant epoxy. The spraybar will hopefully ensure cool water is distributed evenly throughout the cooler.

<edit: Datasheet http://ww1.huntsmanservice.com/tds/Hunt ... 14-1_e.pdf >

Other jobs done: make adaptors to connect pneumatic fittings to 1/2"NPT oil cooler (cheap but turned up damaged from ebay) and I've turned a few odds and sods for the chargecooler fittings. Unfortunately there'll be no more progress this weekend as some dickhead (me ) left the Argon on over night so now I'm skint (it's $$$ ) and have no welder

jk

[Kedge]

these two cars would look really good together in a mag, two very different but equally impressive ways to make an iS much much better.

All you need now Toby is a turbo'd car to go with these two, i'd best get on with my rebuild

I'm hoping both these cars will be at Gaydon chaps so i can have a butchers

[appletree]

Mine will be in the car park, i it set up like santa pod at gaydon? where you park in the show?

kedge your not that far from me are you? sure ive see you at the ferrybridge meets, if you want to come and have a look pop over some time.

[Kedge]

Yea i'll probably be in the car park unless the iS is back on the road in which case i might be able to blag it since it's got a car club sticker in the windscreen, worked at Donnington without even trying

Yea i was at Ferrybridge when you'd not long had the car, i'm down at J22/23 on the M1, would be up for coming to have a look once mines sorted, fingers crossed i'll have it done for Gaydon though.

[ShepsEvo3]

Old thread I know, but just wondered how the car is going Matt? I saw the write up in the Performance magazine and she looks good ;)

[Gortour]

Old thread I know, but just wondered how the car is going Matt? I saw the write up in the Performance magazine and she looks good ;)

Bugger, missed that. Which mag and date?
Anyone fancy posting the article - if not already done... would really like to read it.

[appletree]

Its still out its the issue of Practical Performance Car with a VOlVO amazon on the front.

Hi shep. the cars going realy well thanks, sorted a bit of vibration i had by slakening the belt abit, think i had just overtighted it abit, its not slipping so its ok.

there was another slight problem i had were the water pump for the charger cooler was overheating and cutting out on the thermal cut out if there wasnt enough airflow past it like in traffic but i sorted that by rolling some copper pipe round the motor of the pump and then running the charger cooler water through that (after it had been through the cores) and that solved that.

Ive also just fitted a 3.64LSD to it drop thr revs abit in top as it was running 3-3.5 krpm on motorway driving and it ment everyrthing was working harder than it realy need to with the new diff thats dropped to nearer 2.2.5Krpm which is alot better and quiter

[ShepsEvo3]

Yes, I've been driving my mother's 318is over the last week, and I was thinking the diff would need chaniging for forced induction, would probably make the car alot nicer to drive too ;)

[snoops]

I bet it goes like stink!

[appletree]

I havent posted up on this thread for a bit partly due to the fact ive been living at work and also because i got abit dispondent about not being able to solve the vibration i had around 2-3krpm, i thought i solved it at one point but it ternd out not to be.

any way the other day i was looking round the engine bay with the car running and found that the rose jointed mount form the Supercharger to the engine mount looked to be vibrating alot, so i took it off and found there to be some play inbetween the brass bush and the housing.

next i wedged a piece of wood in the space it should have been and try reving the engine slowly to the place it was vibrating. NO VIBRATION


So i made up a new mount with out rose joints and then fitted to stiff rubber bushes in the mount so that there was just alittle bit of damping and haypresto!!!!

I excitement i went for a drive and found a silicone hose place and bought some hose to redo the hoses from the rad to the engine they also make hoses to spec if you need them!! Hose Direct- Harworth near bawtry/doncaster.

Ive also been thinking of what the next step in the build would be and have talked to Ant about low-comp and a rotex centrifugal charger and also looked at a twin screw wipple charger but last night sealed the deal when a Eaton M62 with electric clutch came up on e-bay for a reasonable price, this may not be the most effeicent type of supercharger but i know about them, there sealed units and the M62 is almost the same size as my M45 but has much easyer ports to mount to!

As this has come along now i'am not to sure what to do with my throttle bodys and also my old set up as i would make a whole new manifold-charge cooler-and inlet.

[Morat]

You're nuts - but in a good way!
Why don't you get a second M42 and put the new setup on that? At least you'll get a couple of months in your car before you pull it all apart again

[jkarran]

Build it on your spare engine, swap them when done and sell the M45 setup complete with ecu (or just maps) as a proven conversion, somebody will surely pay good money for a really cool bolt on conversion with proven results.

M62, low comp engine, charge cooler and Busa bodies... you know it makes (no) sense

And if you get it all finished too quickly you can compound charge it
jk

[Gortour]

I need a lottery win... I want Matt's current engine for my Touring...

[jkarran]

Matt, I've trawled through my files, seems I didn't save any data on the M62 (it's way too big for my little engine... right? ).

jk

[Andyboy]

I drove this yesterday - bugger me it's quick! The 3.64 does blunt it a tad but it's so refined and torquey - just like a n/a 3 litre.

Excellent work Matt, very impressive!

[Gortour]

You lucky sod Andy...

Hope it was for an article in Total BMW...

[Kedge]

Had a ride in it yesterday as well, very impressive indeed!

[appletree]

Cheers boys, pleased you liked it, if you though it was quick with the 3.64 diff on you should have had a go with the 4.11!

[hoshy]

nice one matt.

Just finished reading it from the beginning in one sitting. that took some time

Mine will be starting to take shape in the new year when Alex has some time to work on fabrication for me. My parts collection is coming together now. Spare block outside, e36 crank pulley located. Megasquirt in progress. and the charger sitting in my room to keep reminding me to sort things out

I'm still interested in the debate about tb location. I'm still thinking leaving it in the standard location after the charger is appealing. Was there anything in particular that made you chose the other way ?

[appletree]

If you run it before the charger it makes it much smoother as the charger can only start to make boost depending on throttle position as the charger is in vacume all the time the throttle is closed, then as you open the throttle the vacume lessens and the charger starts to make boost.

were as if you run the throttle after the charger you've got to get rid of loads and loads of air when you shut the throttle at 6krpm so youve got to run a dump valve/valves! to get rid of the waste air which will meen its going to need a good set up for part throtthe settings as the charger is spinning fast enough to provide enough air for WOT at 6krpm and your only letting a sliver through the part open throttle! so you will end up with a SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH all the time. Also when the dump valve closes again you get a sudden spike of boost which wont be smooth or do your engine any good as it will suddenly load it!

i havent done much research into the down stream throttle, might be worth giving JK or Racecar a PM??

[Andy335Touring]

I think it depends which type of S/C you use as to where you mount the TB, Corky Bells book will have it in.

[Ant]

The Racecar thread has some info on bypass valves, Dips older thread has info too.

For the Eaton units they do manufacture a pukka bypass valve that bolts to the unit and solves 90% of the upstream throttle issues

[hoshy]

Thanks Matt, Andy and Ant. I've found the Eaton bypass valve and if I can locate a supplier I'll give it a go. I've just bought the corky bells book too.

[jkarran]

I've made my own electronically controlled bypass valve and will be running a dump valve on the plenum (which may be under ECU control if the hissing at low rpm pisses me off!).

I haven't run it all yet though so I can't comment on the relative merit.

Personally, given a reasonable choice between the two locations I'd run the TB upstream of the supercharger at atmospheric pressure for a number of good reasons.

No dump valve needed
Low/No risk of bent butterflies/spindles (scarey prospect )
No airleaks around the spindles to worry about
Smoother pressure build up/decay

jk

[appletree]

How is yours going nowdays JK, got anymore tasty pics???

[jkarran]

I haven't been in the garage for over a month other than to find a sledgehammer to adjust the E30, mostly working on timekeeping electronics for the rallying at the moment, it's interesting and can be done with my feet up and the telly on, ideal

Just waiting 'till I feel motivated again, no point doing something for fun when you don't actually want to be doing it. I think next week I'll be starting to help (as observer/welder/machinist) a mate squeeze an R1 into the front of a mini, I expect I wont be allowed to be demotivated once that arrives, he's totally psyched

That should give me the kick in the ass I need. Normal picture service will resume shortly honest
jk