Weichers cage is in.
Moderator: martauto
I appreciate that you are working on a tight budget. For a start I don't charge friends for work I do for them, only customers.Weeman wrote:Its not a specalist, he's not a motorsport preparer, he's a welder, and despite me asking for a bar on the cross, he knocked this up. he charged me 125 euros for the lot as he's a friend, so I'm not dissapointed, yes its not the greatest job in the world, but I'm not biulding a DTM car here, I'm biulding a road legal car that gets used on the Nordscheife,
If you are going to the Nordschleife, you shouldn't skip on safety related features. Try to stay close to german TUV regulations and you will have a good guideline what's safe or not. Or FIA regulations (google, they have a nice booklet for attaching harness and cage to the car
I don't think it's a good approach to say it's only driven occasionally. It's driven MAINLY on track --> fast, pushing the limits....Weeman wrote: maybe some peoples cars on here are perfect in everyway, but I dont have the time, nor money to spend a fortune on it, plus I have a new golf gti that I use every day so this will be driven very occasionally. I wanted some protection and despite your concerns about the welds I'm sure it offers that.
You won't be only occasionally dead if I am right, will you?
I am not trying to knock you or talk down to you, I am just concerned.
I fully agree, a lot of people on the Ring are pushing their luckWeeman wrote: Theres plenty of people that run trackcars and DRT's without the cage etc, I'd rather have something than nothing at all. This is my first track car and e30, and I'm learning as I go along, and trying to keep it as low cost as possible, while still making it safer than it would of been.
If you don't do the job properly your missus will fly to New York on your life insurance money.Weeman wrote: The larger plates are missing as it was suppose to be a bolt in cage, and there wasn't room to clear the sunroof with those on, But should I of done that, no doubt someone would of complained that bolt in's aren't good enough. Its my hobby, when I ever have enough cash to do the job properly i will, until then the missus still wants to go to new york and the caribean on holiday, so I have to keep to my budget.
To me there's no excuse to skip on a safety job as long one has the cance to get it right. You could just cutted the plates of the pipe, cut some larger plates and weld everything back together nicely. How's about that?
I do no try to know the work you are doing to the car and your efforts. Even if it sounds like that to you. I have seen many bad jobs with the excuse of not having the right tools or material present at the time. What is forcing you to complete a job wrong? Just stop and carry on when everything is right.Weeman wrote: I've listened to what everyones said and i value the input, I WILL be getting bars welded onto the cage for the harnesses, I'm not going to risk my and my passengers safety, for something I can simply unbolt and remove anyway. The part in question is not in doubt, its the car beneath it thats the weak point, and he wasn't to know that without the encyclopedic knowledge that some people have.
Thanks for the input everyone.
[quote="UweM3"]If you are going to the Nordschleife, you shouldn't skip on safety related features. Try to stay close to german TUV regulations and you will have a good guideline what's safe or not. [/quote]
Given the TUV related changes at the ring this year, you may well not be allowed on with that harness arrangement.
Given the TUV related changes at the ring this year, you may well not be allowed on with that harness arrangement.
With all due respect to everyone on the thread .......
I'm not a lover of Weemans harness arrangement, although if welded in place it looks like it could provide a reasonably strong solution. I have spoken about it with him in private and given my welding / harness bar comments too.
To say that his missis can fly to New York on his insurance money is too strong in my opinion and would have been better left unsaid.
As a reality check when was the last time you saw an incident on track or at the ring which deformed the area in question enough to cause concern? If it did indeed happen perhaps a proper harness bar arrangement would have moved and caused concern too?
It is easy for people in the business to say what others have done wrong, it is one of the reasons I dont have many close up pictures on my thread.
I bet if everyone posted pictures of their cages, harnesses, seat fitment we would all be able to find something we didnt like.
Just my two pennith worth
I'm not a lover of Weemans harness arrangement, although if welded in place it looks like it could provide a reasonably strong solution. I have spoken about it with him in private and given my welding / harness bar comments too.
To say that his missis can fly to New York on his insurance money is too strong in my opinion and would have been better left unsaid.
As a reality check when was the last time you saw an incident on track or at the ring which deformed the area in question enough to cause concern? If it did indeed happen perhaps a proper harness bar arrangement would have moved and caused concern too?
It is easy for people in the business to say what others have done wrong, it is one of the reasons I dont have many close up pictures on my thread.
I bet if everyone posted pictures of their cages, harnesses, seat fitment we would all be able to find something we didnt like.
Just my two pennith worth
I have been involved in the construction and TUV approval of seat frames for Vans and coaches with seat belt attachements. Some off the stuff we thought would pass with flying colours was just ripped apart like cardboard by the testing rig.
Northloop bud, I did comment on NL ref weemans harness fitment, & that I thought it was not good.
Now I thought about this it today, its not weemans fault he doesnt know & took advice from the man who built it, but its all the comments on here & on NL that got my goat, the 'oh yeh that looks great' etc, not many voices of decent, ok in fact a couple here, but other then me= none on NL
Now there is utterly no doubt that that harness set up is utter rubbish, its just awful & simply no place in a track car, weeman has taken the advice of those with a clue & will do it properly now= result, but genuinly it scares me that folks that really have no clue & should just not comment as there lack of knowledge is dangerous & have dished out advice that really is fecking dodgy.
Sure the free advice given out on forums is worth every penny you've paid for it, but really on stuff like this if folks dont have a clue its best to stay silent.
Now I thought about this it today, its not weemans fault he doesnt know & took advice from the man who built it, but its all the comments on here & on NL that got my goat, the 'oh yeh that looks great' etc, not many voices of decent, ok in fact a couple here, but other then me= none on NL
Now there is utterly no doubt that that harness set up is utter rubbish, its just awful & simply no place in a track car, weeman has taken the advice of those with a clue & will do it properly now= result, but genuinly it scares me that folks that really have no clue & should just not comment as there lack of knowledge is dangerous & have dished out advice that really is fecking dodgy.
Sure the free advice given out on forums is worth every penny you've paid for it, but really on stuff like this if folks dont have a clue its best to stay silent.
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I don't have a problem with the "yay w00t, that looks great" comments. What i have a problem with is not posting when i see something dangerous.
I have no problem with someone making an informed choice to install devices in a certain way (i have shelf mounted belts, it's the lesser of three evils in my view), but i don't want to leave anyone under the impression that their particular setup is safe when it's not.
I have no problem with someone making an informed choice to install devices in a certain way (i have shelf mounted belts, it's the lesser of three evils in my view), but i don't want to leave anyone under the impression that their particular setup is safe when it's not.
On Northloop, I actually asked Gary and others for advice on the harness set up, I was myself concerned, but as I allready requested them, its no problem to have the bars put onto the cage. In the meantime i will run the harnesses back to the rear seat belt mounting points, Please no back breaking comments, I know that draw back.
I'm doing 30 laps a year on the NS and thats it, I'm not a JK holder doing 300, and for ever person like me, with not the greatest set up, there is another 2000 bikers with no cage or harness, risking their lives, plus the countless other people and regualr goers that dont have cages. The NS to the best of my knowledge is not a race track, although some of you may treat it that way, Its what it is, a de restricted toll road, and I drive it in such a way, I do not take stupid chances, I back off sensibly when I have to let others past, I dont pass fueled by the red mist of a clarkson beating lap time, I've done my times, in my old clio 172 and the Golf gti, both Std without cages, whilst this is the first car i have "attempted" to prep, its also the one i drive with the most respect, after alot of near misses, accident assists etc, thats I've seen and done over the four years I've been going. I've not chosen the quickest option, I've left the engine STD, I'm going out there, to socialise with friends like Northloop, and have good fun, Not set the world on fire, re living child hood dreams that I am Frank Sytner.
You talk as if I'm putting my life in danger, if that were the case, then i wouldn't drive the NS full stop, niether would I fly half way around the world with my job after watching aircrash investigations on discovery. I have attempted to make a fun (little used) Toy, that while it may not be worthy of competing in the DTM like some of yours, is safer than it was if it was running intertia reels and no cage, and I'm sure non of you can argue against that. I have said that I will make the change, I'm not sat here adamant that I wont do it, but comments on my Girlfriend travelling on my life insurance are hardly the best approach in my opinion, But thanks anyway. In future I'll make no project updates at all, if this is to be the case.
I'm doing 30 laps a year on the NS and thats it, I'm not a JK holder doing 300, and for ever person like me, with not the greatest set up, there is another 2000 bikers with no cage or harness, risking their lives, plus the countless other people and regualr goers that dont have cages. The NS to the best of my knowledge is not a race track, although some of you may treat it that way, Its what it is, a de restricted toll road, and I drive it in such a way, I do not take stupid chances, I back off sensibly when I have to let others past, I dont pass fueled by the red mist of a clarkson beating lap time, I've done my times, in my old clio 172 and the Golf gti, both Std without cages, whilst this is the first car i have "attempted" to prep, its also the one i drive with the most respect, after alot of near misses, accident assists etc, thats I've seen and done over the four years I've been going. I've not chosen the quickest option, I've left the engine STD, I'm going out there, to socialise with friends like Northloop, and have good fun, Not set the world on fire, re living child hood dreams that I am Frank Sytner.
You talk as if I'm putting my life in danger, if that were the case, then i wouldn't drive the NS full stop, niether would I fly half way around the world with my job after watching aircrash investigations on discovery. I have attempted to make a fun (little used) Toy, that while it may not be worthy of competing in the DTM like some of yours, is safer than it was if it was running intertia reels and no cage, and I'm sure non of you can argue against that. I have said that I will make the change, I'm not sat here adamant that I wont do it, but comments on my Girlfriend travelling on my life insurance are hardly the best approach in my opinion, But thanks anyway. In future I'll make no project updates at all, if this is to be the case.
Blimey what a misery I am sometimes! 
Happier mood today thankfully
Weeman I do the harnesses to rear seat belt points, its not ideal at all but is IMHO the best option other than a harness bar.
I did the same on my old car pre cage too, & i may seem daft but I knew the risk then too so I ran the harness to hold me in place properly but put the 3 point over the top to actually hold me in if i did spank it & minimise the spine snap issues
Happier mood today thankfully
Weeman I do the harnesses to rear seat belt points, its not ideal at all but is IMHO the best option other than a harness bar.
I did the same on my old car pre cage too, & i may seem daft but I knew the risk then too so I ran the harness to hold me in place properly but put the 3 point over the top to actually hold me in if i did spank it & minimise the spine snap issues
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Vehicle Transportation Specialists
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