Buyin advice for an ex- H27 owner

[alanpina]

Hi all, well I'm moving on...After 3 years with my beloved H27 drop top my business has taken off...So it's time for something with a "bit more".

I have no intentions of leaving this forum, it's been great for me over the years, I've never posted many threads, but when I have, I've always got good sound advice and credible support.

So this is my last question as an official e30 owner (Just sold the H27...I'd keep it but no space).

I'm now in the market for a 'super-saloon'...I'm lucky enough to have enough cash to buy something half decent, and I know this is a beemer forum and this is not strictly an e30 related question, but please try to be as objective as possible...

Right, I'm torn between an e39 M5 (2002) and a B5 RS4 Avant (circa 2000)...Is there anyone out there who has had the luxury of driving both???

The M5 is deffinitely a nicer place to sit in from what I can tell, but I'm a 'driver' not a sales rep...

Feedback will be taken notice of.

Thanks...Oh, I will post photos when bought. Ta

[E30BeemerLad]

I'd personally go for the Audi, I believe the E39 M5 to be a bit of a troublesome ownership prospect.

[alanpina]

"I'd personally go for the Audi, I believe the E39 M5 to be a bit of a troublesome ownership prospect."....Thanks, what 'horrors' have you heard?

[daimlerman]

It's the 'M' bits that make them special,and it's the 'M' bits that cost the money,although I expect that you already know that from the H27..

[E30BeemerLad]

mainly in the suspension and brakes dept, but some electrical gremlins also.

Being honest with you, i have no experience of either car, have read of owners with constant problems with suspension issues such as anti roll bar mountings failing and other problems with bushes.

I also have a bit of a fetish for Audi Avants whereas the beemer is a bit bland compared to it's performance credentials.

So my guidance is pretty poo to be honest

[Jhonno]

The M5 needs to be properly looked after.. If your gonna get one make sure its had its recalls and has FBMWSH

I would go for the M5 better drivers car than the Audi, there is a black one for sale on e36coupe atm, with stunning leather interior (iirc Hartge upgrade..) cant remember its SH situation tho

[snoops]

whats your budget? how about an e60 m5 touring?

out of the cars above i would go for the audi

[alanpina]

It's a real toughy....They both return almost exactly the same performance...with the m5 having a better torque curve in higher gears...It's that old Turbocharger VS 'good old grunt' arguement.

[alanpina]

Budget not that good I'm affraid...e60 about 40 grand too much

[march109]

I would have thought a sandbankers could stretch to the extra 40g's

I have also heard horrors about the m5, but have no experience of the audi, why not contact respective owners and ask their opinion, or check out the top gear drivers survey for those cars, which will also retun matches for the specific years your looking at too.

[Andyboy]

The M5 was a superb car when new, but the bills are just scary. Add a couple of Vanos units to the bill if you're unlucky. I'm with Beemerlad on this, the Audi could be a better idea. If you can find an unrusty one (harder than you thing) an E55 AMG is worth a look as well.
If you want to go the E39 route, a manual Alpina would be a better idea - the V8 B10 is a weapon.

[march109]

http://www.topgear.com/content/carsurvey/2006/

This is the 2006 survey its not as good as I thought so forget it, but some quick research on the top gear site did reveal some good reads:

http://www.topgear.com/drives/A4/E3/roa ... 20/01.html
http://www.topgear.com/drives/A2/A4/roa ... 05/01.html

[alanpina]

Thankyou all very much, however, if you're visiting this post for the first time, please feel free to leave more feedback as I dont want to close the thread...The more opinions i get, the more chance I'll make my mind up, and you lot have certainly got the most informed opinions of most othe car forums I've visted.

March 109

"I would have thought a sandbankers could stretch to the extra 40g's "

LOL...The people who really have the money down here, don't actually live here in the winter like us scumbags, they just park their Gin Palace here every summer...I'm not one of them unfortunately

[march109]

Thankyou all very much, however, if you're visiting this post for the first time, please feel free to leave more feedback as I dont want to close the thread...The more opinions i get, the more chance I'll make my mind up, and you lot have certainly got the most informed opinions of most othe car forums I've visted.

March 109

"I would have thought a sandbankers could stretch to the extra 40g's "

LOL...The people who really have the money down here, don't actually live here in the winter like us scumbags, they just park their Gin Palace here every summer...I'm not one of them unfortunately

I'm in the same boat I'm a queens park resident, although you do live in the 4th most expensive place to live in the world! thats impressive.

If your willing to consider other cars there are many good alternatives to the two you've mentioned. The sort of money your thinking of spending I'd get out there to dealerships and get some test drives, you have BMW woods in poole, theres an independant on the same road that does second hand mercs, beemers, ect, the Ferndown has the Porsche garage, and if your feeling proper flush theres the really nice place Bramshaws between boscombe and bournemouth.

[bloom_meister]

Hi all, well I'm moving on...After 3 years with my beloved H27 drop top my business has taken off...So it's time for something with a "bit more".

I thought Iain had the only current UK Hartge H27 drop top?

Anyway, as to your question.

The E39 M5, as has been stated, can have some scary bills, having said that, fabulous car and relatively cheap now.

A real 'Q' car alternative would be a E55 AMG Estate, not quite the handling of the M5 but good enough for the public roads and a great engine.

Another often overlooked Merc would be the S55 AMG, same as above but more luxury.

From left field i can personally reccomend the V10 Diesel (yes I said diesel) Phaeton! I have had one for a weekend and it was both super quiet, really comfortable and luxurious yet had enough torque to pull trees out of the ground, amazing value secondhand too (they listed around 70k new) at about £20-30k

Depending on your budget you may be able to stretch to a new shape 745i, these things were stupidly expensive new and can now be picked up for well under £20k, yes its a big car but thats a powerful motor and they usually come with all the toys as it was the top model at the time (the 760 came a bit later).

Another one you either love or hate, the Chrysler 300c, but with the 5.7 Hemi engine, is a real brute and has the presence to make most other cars simply pull over on the motorways, bit oldschool on the corners but it doesnt half shift! now can be had for low 20's if you shop around.

I'm sure there are more that I'm forgetting but i reckon thats enough for now

Tim

[alanpina]

Thanks Tim...I've heard loads of great reports about those e55's, thing is mercs have never really floated my boat, and I assume (although I've been known to be wrong on many occaisions) that they are all auto (or tiptronic)?????Got to be manual, hired a track day with an f430, and I just aint got the co-ordination for tip-shift changes, especially going into a corner...I'm all over the place, it's hillarious ...Good call with the Phaeton, I've seen a couple of them and think they look really really well, f$@ck, didn't know it was a v10...Do you know where I can get some 'real world' performance figures for that car, I've tried googling, but haven't come up with anything...You know how it is, you can always find bore and stroke, and how fast the car goes in 3rd gear, but never the meaty stuff, like 'what's the bhp'? and 'how fast to 60'?...You know, the really important stuff...

That 300c is a beefy monster too, I believe you can even buy a 'Bentley look' grill, although why anyone would want to do that, I have no idea...If you can't afford a Bentley, get over it, that's what I say ...Still love the car though...Thing is, my top end budget is 20k, and I don't think I'll find one in that range for a year or so...Thanks all the same.

[bloom_meister]

Thanks Tim...I've heard loads of great reports about those e55's, thing is mercs have never really floated my boat, and I assume (although I've been known to be wrong on many occaisions) that they are all auto (or tiptronic)?????Got to be manual, hired a track day with an f430, and I just aint got the co-ordination for tip-shift changes, especially going into a corner...I'm all over the place, it's hillarious ...Good call with the Phaeton, I've seen a couple of them and think they look really really well, f$@ck, didn't know it was a v10...Do you know where I can get some 'real world' performance figures for that car, I've tried googling, but haven't come up with anything...You know how it is, you can always find bore and stroke, and how fast the car goes in 3rd gear, but never the meaty stuff, like 'what's the bhp'? and 'how fast to 60'?...You know, the really important stuff...

That 300c is a beefy monster too, I believe you can even buy a 'Bentley look' grill, although why anyone would want to do that, I have no idea...If you can't afford a Bentley, get over it, that's what I say ...Still love the car though...Thing is, my top end budget is 20k, and I don't think I'll find one in that range for a year or so...Thanks all the same.

First Phaeton I came across on a quick search is a 40k 1 owner with every toy you can get, full VWSH at £21,500. I think if you shopped around youd get under your budget.

An excerpt from a roadtest on the performance:
'
The Phaeton can pander to the lunatic fringe too, however: the other diesel engine in the range is the phenomenal 5.0-litre V10, a category winner in the influential International Engine of the Year awards organised by Engine Technology International magazine. Giving 313bhp and an utterly mind-bending 553lb ft of torque, it accelerates 0-60 in a supercar-baiting 6.9 seconds, though its most awesome talents are midrange. Top speed is limited to 155mph though you get the feeling that it's capable of far, far more. The anti-slip regulator and four-wheel drive put a check on wheelspinning - probably feasible in even the uppermost gears, though we were too chicken to put this too far to the test - but this is one hell of a hot rod saloon.'

I would, at the very least, reccomend a test drive before you commit to anything

Tim

[Maxus]

Choice between the M5 and the RS4 is a tough one. Both are great cars. I think it says something that on a BMW forum there are lots of votes for the Audi. I believe the later 2000 on M5's are a bit more robust than the early ones but I'm not an expert on them.

I have spent some time in an RS4 Avant and can confirm that they are solid, meaty looking and overall great cars. It amazed me at how sure footed they are. But then most of us enjoy tail out antics of BMW's.

Oh, and they are fast.....


By maxus1

[alanpina]

Testdrive booked: 2001 RS4. QST remap to 458bhp (should be interesting)..Avus Silver, 58000 miles, lambo steering wheel (cool)...That's about it really, I don't think they're big on luxury

Looking forward to it. Will let you know my findings tomorrow evening, if still alive.

In the meantime, thanks for the support.

[Simon13]

keep us posted!

[bloom_meister]

I knew I'd forgotten one..Super saloons is a favourite subject of mine.
Jaguar XJR
Looks, performance, luxury, style
Youd have your pick of nice ones for your budget, 1 owner, FSH etc
These things really shift but in an oh so civilised way
One of my mates recently bought one for 8k and he totally loves it.

Cheers,

Tim

[alanpina]

Back and living!!!...Just.

Very solid, VERY quick (in a straight line anyway - no balls to throw it through the twistys)...I did get the impression that the owner thought it was worth more than I did though, which is the only thing that's putting me off really...The B5 RS4 seems to start at about 16k, but that example will probably have 120 - 130 000 on the clock....On the other side of the coin though, this kind of pricing is a good sign that the car may be depreciation proof to a certain degree...The e39 M5 prices seem to be dropping by the week...But you can buy a clean late model with low miles for under 20k.

In all fairness (and this isn't a car review) that Audi will take some beating as far as a 'pure driving experience'. I took maybe one or two liberties from a standing start , only to notice that traction was immediate and all of the power was delivered where it ought to be, and acceleration was 'cerbera like' no BS...The photos you see of them don't do them justice either, they are a really chunky looking when you get up close and personal...Loved the carbon fibre and flat bottom steering wheel.

Hi Mr Bloom_meister...The XJR was the first super-saloon that I managed to talk myself out of....They are posh as f&$k, beautifully made, sound gorgeous and go like stink, however I reckon jags suffer a bit from 'alfa romeo disease' - ie: They look cool for about a year and then get all old and dated over night. I also think that it might make me feel a bit older than I am...At 32, I'm not sure I'm ready to join the slippers and cravat brigade...Supercharged or not

The guy who was selling it was moving onto some 500hp vauxhall or sommat, think he must have lost the plot a bit

Anyhow, this week I'll mostly be wearing a 2002 M5 and a 2003 M3 Cabriolet (I know what you're thinking...'Estate Agent'...You're probably right, but I think it would be rude not to)