This has probably been done a thousand times already, but i'm new so forgive me.
I want a bit more power from my e30 318is. The engine is out at the minute so i figure now is the time. Also i'd like to point out i'm not rich so cost is a factor.
Thanks for any help.
Newbie asking about m42 tuning
Moderator: martauto
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jagtech2002
- E30 Zone Newbie
- Posts: 140
- Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 11:00 pm
- Location: cheshire
well i guess it all comes down to how much you can afford and your technical knowledge, without sounding brash mate!
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Gwynleym10
- E30 Zone Addict
- Posts: 3650
- Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: London/Cymru
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have a read of this thread....
http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... ic&t=28199
and this one
http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... ic&t=40329
http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... ic&t=28199
and this one
http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... ic&t=40329
Technical knowledge isn't an issue. I'm a mechanic in a BMW, Ford, Mitsubishi dealership. But I can afford **** all.jagtech2002 wrote:well i guess it all comes down to how much you can afford and your technical knowledge, without sounding brash mate!
I'll check out those threads, thanks everyone.
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jaistanley
- E30 Zone Addict
- Posts: 2517
- Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: Coventry and Essex
First thing you can do then is reset the cam timing. Mine was way out when I got the car and it made the idle unstable and reduced the low down torque. SOme people advance the inlet a bit which might be worth investigation..
You could fit the M44 chain tensioner whilst you're at it for peace of mind, but probably not neccassary if you're timing gear is silent.
These engines responde well to mapping I hear.
Jai
You could fit the M44 chain tensioner whilst you're at it for peace of mind, but probably not neccassary if you're timing gear is silent.
These engines responde well to mapping I hear.
Jai
I take it they are rear wheel power fiqures? Sounds good to me!! 
Is it just a BBTB youve fitted with a remap?
Is it just a BBTB youve fitted with a remap?Gaffa tape is like "the force" - it has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together.
There's nothing that shouts "Poor Workmanship" more than wrinkles in the Gaffer tap
There's nothing that shouts "Poor Workmanship" more than wrinkles in the Gaffer tap
er no. that would be like an m3 figure rwhp.benjy wrote:I take it they are rear wheel power fiqures? Sounds good to me!!
2.1 318is, MS, LPG. 200bhp, 175ft/lbs GONE!
Boxster, e46 m3, e36 sport touring and alpina B3 3.0
BigJ, where did you get the BBTB and the remap done?bigj wrote:Hi had my is mapped today,was suprised how much difference it's made up to 163bhp from 118.
bbtb is v good cured the flatspot at 3k ish and throttle response is so much better
What was the cost??
Cheers
Benjy, wish they were m8 .97.7 rwhp a lot of tranny losses? just tb at the moment itg to follow then some cams when the card recovers a little.
Huge i got the bbtb and remap thru the zone shop m8 speak to Sal he'll sort you out.
I did a full service and changed any hoses etc before remap
Huge i got the bbtb and remap thru the zone shop m8 speak to Sal he'll sort you out.
I did a full service and changed any hoses etc before remap
97.7 rwhp is very low! even for the 118 its quite a low figure. mine factory made 106 ish iirc, 113 with megasquirt doing the fuelling (still motronic timing). whats responsible for the massive losses?
2.1 318is, MS, LPG. 200bhp, 175ft/lbs GONE!
Boxster, e46 m3, e36 sport touring and alpina B3 3.0
no, rwhp is measured, the flywheel horsepower is the one that is calculated. The rolling road normally does a coast-down to calculate the flywheel figure, and for some reason your losses are absolutely huge by the sounds of things. under 20% is usual for a rwd car.
why was your original power figure so low btw?
the old bosch rollers i used (shepsevo3's) at castle combe don't calculate flywheel horsepower, but are tried and tested at wheel figures and i'm happy that i got accurate figures.
i do find it really interesting, because i'm intrigued at the high flywheel figures people are getting with the 318is.
when I r/r my I know the engine was tip-top as I've since disassembled it since and it was low miles fsh, it had great compression on all cyls, i'd had it diag'd recently and replaced TPS and cam sensor, in fact I brought carsoft with me to the rollers to diag it when pissing around with MS, it had elec fan, sebring exhaust, coolant ran straight from block to head etc. We spent a few hours on the rollers testing various things and setting up megasquirt making sure everything was spot on, and in 4th gear (1:1) we made 107 rwhp on motronic iirc. This was with high 13s AFRs throughout, which is how they fuel out of the factory. With MS fuelling we made 113rwhp, bringing the AFRs down to around 13.0:1. In other words I can understand a few horsepower gained at the flywheel by adjusting the fuelling, and mb there's a bit more to come from adjusting the timing.
i know the car felt as fast as any other 318is as I've driven a few others, it also held its own against my bro's more powerful m44 e36 (bit heavier though), so i reckon those wheel figures are about what a 318is should do.
But by normal calculations mine made around factory flywheel figures using a 20% transmission loss.
why was your original power figure so low btw?
the old bosch rollers i used (shepsevo3's) at castle combe don't calculate flywheel horsepower, but are tried and tested at wheel figures and i'm happy that i got accurate figures.
i do find it really interesting, because i'm intrigued at the high flywheel figures people are getting with the 318is.
when I r/r my I know the engine was tip-top as I've since disassembled it since and it was low miles fsh, it had great compression on all cyls, i'd had it diag'd recently and replaced TPS and cam sensor, in fact I brought carsoft with me to the rollers to diag it when pissing around with MS, it had elec fan, sebring exhaust, coolant ran straight from block to head etc. We spent a few hours on the rollers testing various things and setting up megasquirt making sure everything was spot on, and in 4th gear (1:1) we made 107 rwhp on motronic iirc. This was with high 13s AFRs throughout, which is how they fuel out of the factory. With MS fuelling we made 113rwhp, bringing the AFRs down to around 13.0:1. In other words I can understand a few horsepower gained at the flywheel by adjusting the fuelling, and mb there's a bit more to come from adjusting the timing.
i know the car felt as fast as any other 318is as I've driven a few others, it also held its own against my bro's more powerful m44 e36 (bit heavier though), so i reckon those wheel figures are about what a 318is should do.
But by normal calculations mine made around factory flywheel figures using a 20% transmission loss.
2.1 318is, MS, LPG. 200bhp, 175ft/lbs GONE!
Boxster, e46 m3, e36 sport touring and alpina B3 3.0
Stock losses (according to the dyno handbook from dynapack) on the rwd bmw is 24.4%
A dyno doesnt measure rwhp, it measures torque, the hp is a calculation of acceleration/de-acceleration.
Anything that effects acceleration or de-acceleration will effect the results and a dyno is only a "guestimate" at best.
It was never designed to test power in the first place.
A dyno doesnt measure rwhp, it measures torque, the hp is a calculation of acceleration/de-acceleration.
Anything that effects acceleration or de-acceleration will effect the results and a dyno is only a "guestimate" at best.
It was never designed to test power in the first place.
yeah yeah i know. but the rwhp is a product of torque and rpm, whereas the flywheel figure is an estimate.EndaW wrote:Stock losses (according to the dyno handbook from dynapack) on the rwd bmw is 24.4%
A dyno doesnt measure rwhp, it measures torque, the hp is a calculation of acceleration/de-acceleration.
Anything that effects acceleration or de-acceleration will effect the results and a dyno is only a "guestimate" at best.
It was never designed to test power in the first place.
2.1 318is, MS, LPG. 200bhp, 175ft/lbs GONE!
Boxster, e46 m3, e36 sport touring and alpina B3 3.0
If stock losses are 24% what would account for my 40% loss?
patrick while your engine is out you might look @ swapping flywheel I think one of the m20 single mass ones fit not sure but think its 320 one. I'm sure someone will tell u for certain .
patrick while your engine is out you might look @ swapping flywheel I think one of the m20 single mass ones fit not sure but think its 320 one. I'm sure someone will tell u for certain .
bigj, m20 flywheel is a waste of time, you need to change the throw out bearing, starter gear and clutch pressure plate, the pressure plate is heavier anyway so you don't end up saving much weight.
so your flywheel figure was 163, wheel 97.7? Thats over 60% loss. i have no idea why your losses are so high, handbrake or brake disk binding or something maybe? i'd be surprised if it was caused by a slight wheel wobble. the sceptic in me suggests that the transmission losses were probably correct on the 118 figure, and incorrect on the 163 figure, as thats way too much difference between the two figures.
so your flywheel figure was 163, wheel 97.7? Thats over 60% loss. i have no idea why your losses are so high, handbrake or brake disk binding or something maybe? i'd be surprised if it was caused by a slight wheel wobble. the sceptic in me suggests that the transmission losses were probably correct on the 118 figure, and incorrect on the 163 figure, as thats way too much difference between the two figures.
2.1 318is, MS, LPG. 200bhp, 175ft/lbs GONE!
Boxster, e46 m3, e36 sport touring and alpina B3 3.0
I noticed the mention of the big bore throttle body and remap on this thread but there appears to be nowt in the zone shop?????
was the remap of the standard setup or does it require a new chip first,I know alot of standard ecu's are remappable.
Is the bbtb a homemade affair/modded standard item or a different thing altogether,Im all up for diy mods!
Was told by an old school mechanic yesterday of cheeky mod on the airflow meter to in effect richen the mixture-bit of trial and error but it made a noticible difference with my big ass filter on,free too!(apart from even worse economy)
Cheers
was the remap of the standard setup or does it require a new chip first,I know alot of standard ecu's are remappable.
Is the bbtb a homemade affair/modded standard item or a different thing altogether,Im all up for diy mods!
Was told by an old school mechanic yesterday of cheeky mod on the airflow meter to in effect richen the mixture-bit of trial and error but it made a noticible difference with my big ass filter on,free too!(apart from even worse economy)
Cheers
318 IS. Sold.
I can deffinatly recomend the ITG filter from the zone shop, alot better than a K&N or a universal fiter that i tryd before. it also sound amazing! 
BBTB is aproper bought item not a poor DIY job. although DIY is still good if done right.
BBTB is aproper bought item not a poor DIY job.
although DIY is still good if done right. Hears a link to when i took my IS to the rollers and what i found
the "after market filter" was NOT an ITG
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... ic&t=38696
the "after market filter" was NOT an ITG
http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... ic&t=38696
Cheers tim for that m8 didn't realise the pressure plate was so heavy saved me some work.
schuey the bbtb is a modded standard one ,the remap is done on via obd skt and loaded onto a new chip
Tim your prob right about the figures the car feels alot stronger now it pulls better from low revs
there is a definite improvement .
I've only driven 1 other IS n that was in poor cond so can't really compare but it feels almost as quick as my old sport. it just handles the twisties round here better
schuey the bbtb is a modded standard one ,the remap is done on via obd skt and loaded onto a new chip
Tim your prob right about the figures the car feels alot stronger now it pulls better from low revs
there is a definite improvement .
I've only driven 1 other IS n that was in poor cond so can't really compare but it feels almost as quick as my old sport. it just handles the twisties round here better