M50 Exhaust options

[stulane]

Hi,

Ok guys so i just need to check if i would be able to use a e36 320i exhaust downpipe if i cut it just before the cat?
I was looking at realoem.com and the exhaust appears to be very similar until the cat.
325i
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=18&fg=10

320i
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=18&fg=10

Also, would the oxygen sensor from a 320 e36 be ok?

Has anyone got any advice on what to do for the exhaust. Its my biggest worry on the swap.
I've got welding equipment but i havn't done any welding before so i dont know how hard its going to be.

I've got e34 or e36 manifolds, was going to use the e36 ones with e36 downpipe and then attach it to a e30 325i exhaust system.

Thanks,
Stuart

[jmc330i]

Have a look here.
First 3 or 4 pages has some manifold discussion and pics for the M50 swap, that might be of some help to you.

[stulane]

Hi James,

Read through all of that and im still not sure what to do.

I'm happy enough to get the e36 downpipes attached to the original e30 exhaust for now but how much modification is needed on the manifolds? Would it be easier to try and get a m3 manifold (If i can find one) or just get someone else to do the work for me? Would i be able to goto any garage or has it got to be a specialist?

Also, does the e36 steering rack make much difference? I've got one to wack into the car once engine is out.

Anyone have any advice?

Thanks,
Stuart

[jmc330i]

Will the M3 manifolds fit an M50?

Your still going to have problems getting the M3 manifold to fit. Im doing mine in a day or 2, but its going to need a fair bit of modding to fit. More than the E36 325i manifolds I reckon.

The pics that Dave posted show what he did, how much he cut from his E36 manifolds. Its a job of trial and error I think. Offer the manifolds up, chop a bit out, offer them up again and see if they fit. If not chop a bit more out. Keep going untill they fit.
I think its the back manifold that needs most of the work, the front may just fit.

I cant suggest where to get it done though. A mate is doing mine now, but its going to take a while just to figure out how to fit the manifolds.

The E36 rack conversion moves the steering joint closer to the engine, so leaves a bit less room to fit things in.

[stulane]

Hi,

So is it really worth changing the rack for the e36?

If your buddy does a good job would it be worth me paying him to do mine? I'm a way from even fitting the engine as yet anyway so i can easily wait until yours is sorted.

Are you fitting a different engine to me or is it going to be the same sort of deal with the manifolds?

Thanks
Stuart

[jmc330i]

The E36 rack has less turns lock to lock than the E30 rack. A few people on here have done it now and say its worth it.
Ive only been towed in mine with the E36 rack, so I cant really say how much of a difference its made yet.

Im fitting an E36 M3 engine, so the conversion is a little different to the M50 conversion. My manifold is the M3 6 branch, which I would of thought makes it more difficult to fit than the E36 325i manifold, due to the extra length of the pipes etc.
My manifold looks like this...


Yours should look like this, and be easier to fit...



My mate would probably do your manifolds, but he isnt an exhaust specialist or anything. He is a metal work/fabricator guy who is shit hot at what he does, and so he charges a premium rate
He has done work on 4 and 6 branch manifolds for a company who make exhausts and manifolds for race cars, and is always saying what a PITA manifold work is.

I would have a look round for anyone local to you. As long as youve seen their work and trust them to do a good job, its probably your best bet.

[stulane]

Hi,

Well i'll have a look around locally, if anyone knows someone in east sussex that could help modify my manifolds, pls let me know. How much do you recon your guy would want for the work?

MK2 golf servo: I found one in a scrap yard this morning, cant guarentee its a 1.3 but it looks small and i wrote down the part number:

ate 3.6732-0401.4
192.612.105.b

is that something that would work? It looks like a pig to get out so i dont want to go get it unless it will work.

Thanks
Stuart

[glenn]

james,
that manifold looks awesome!

[jmc330i]

MK2 golf servo: I found one in a scrap yard this morning, cant guarentee its a 1.3 but it looks small and i wrote down the part number:

ate 3.6732-0401.4
192.612.105.b

is that something that would work? It looks like a pig to get out so i dont want to go get it unless it will work.

I cant help with VW part numbers Im afraid. If you can compare it to another Mk2 servo than you will know if its the smaller 1.3 servo. I think the larger Mk2 servos are about the same size as the E30 servo.
Oh, and the servo should be on the passenger side of the car, with a linkage across the bulkhead like the E30 has, or altleast it is on the Mk1 Golf.
I think the Mk2 larger servos (GTi etc) are on the drivers side tucked right up against the bulkhead, almost under the scuttle panel. Im not sure if all Mk2 servos are there or not.

I havent seen a Mk2 1.3 servo, but I was told they are about the same size as the Mk1 GTi servo Im using.
You can see here the difference in diameter that allows the Golf servo to fit...


The servos are a bit of a git to get out. The first one I removed was easy (ish) because the master cylinder and brake pipes had already been removed, the second was a bit more difficult.
You kind of have to reach up from below the bracket that holds the servo to undo the bottom bolts, and the retaining clip from the linkage isnt easy to get at, but unclips the same as the E30 clip.

I cant remember if the bracket unbolts or is welded in, but take a hacksaw with you, because you might find it easier to cut the bracket free and pull the whole lot from the car, then remove the servo from the bracket.


I couldnt say how much my mate would want paying. He charges by the hour and he is not cheap It would obviously depend on how long he worked on it.
He does a lot of work ranging from decorative metal gates to 'I' beam frames for buildings, barn conversions etc.

I would have a look in Yellow Pages or local directory for metal work/steel fabricators local to you. At least then you can show them what needs doing.

[jmc330i]

james,
that manifold looks awesome!

I only wish mine was that clean.

And Ive got to cut it up to make it fit

[stulane]

Hi,

The servo was on the drivers side but it did look quite small. i've got a pic but i need to upload it somewhere.

I'll ask around about the manifolds, as well as modding them, do i also need to get the downpipes from an e36 modified?

Thanks

[jmc330i]

It could be that all Mk2 servos are on the drivers side. I didnt look at any Mk2s beacsue there was only GTis in the breakers!
Cant give you any help on removing the servo in that case either (it looks like fun ), other than Good Luck

I think your best bet would be to mod the E36 manifold you have. Looking at Daves pics, it only needs slight cutting here and there. Im not sure about the downpipes. I would say they will probably need a little 'massaging' to get them to fit, but having never done it I cant say for 100%. You could probably get some exhaust piping and bend that to suit.

Keep us posted with how you get on.

[stulane]

Heres the baby...



lol, sorry bout the crap pic but best i can do at a scrap yard, was trying to get a pic of the part #

[stulane]

A Guy has offered me a servo from a mk1 golf cab 1990 - is that going to be any good??

The one at my local yard is Ԛ£15 but this one is obviously newer and he wants about Ԛ£39 once paid vat+del

Is that one going to be much better? I wont have to piss about removing it but i dont know if it will work as its much newer?

[jmc330i]

Sorry mate, couldnt tell you if the Mk1 cab servo is the same or not.

If you can get a part number for it, you could check it against the other servo in the breaker, or go to a VW dealer and get them to check.

I havent got the part number on my servo, the sticker had all but disappered, so I painted over it.

[Bharat]

Hey guys

I have the VW ETKA system, so if you have VW part numbers, and want to check, let me know.

Just for your info, in general, Mk1 Golfs had a 7" or 8" servo, as did many MK2s.

The bigger 9" servo was mainly on the late Mk2 16v (1988 to 1991), and since the standard brakes on early Golfs are scary to say the least, especially Mk1, most Mk1 owners (myself included) have gone for a Mk2 16v 9" servo and 22mm master cylinder upgrade.

You will have to be careful about picking up servos, as a lot of seem to be for LHD Golfs (for some strange reason), and that might mean a little more twisting of the vaccum hose, etc.

Here's a couple of pics with part numbers/details that will, hopefully, make life easier :


Details from a 1989 Golf

Details from a 1983 Golf

[jmc330i]

Thats interesting. My servo came from a Mk1 GTi and is a 9" one.

It was fitted to the passenger side of the car on the bracket at the bottom of this pic http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/5020/image29im.jpg

You can see the difference between the three servos in this pic...


The guy where I got mine from said I should use the Mk1 GTi servo cause the brakes were bad on the none GTi. He said that the Mk1 GTi servo was the same size as the Mk2 - both 9".

[Bharat]

Hmm.

I've just checked with EuroCarParts, and the servo for an early Mk1 GTi (1984) is the same as that on a late Mk1 Convertible GTi (1991). However, it's a different part for the Mk2 GTi. The Mk2 one clearly states 9".

Typical German thing - confuse the hell out of everyone !

That's why I thought I'd put up these pics, and hopefully, make things a bit more clear for the rest of the guys.

[jmc330i]

Yup, Im confused

I've just checked with EuroCarParts, and the servo for an early Mk1 GTi (1984) is the same as that on a late Mk1 Convertible GTi (1991). However, it's a different part for the Mk2 GTi. The Mk2 one clearly states 9".

It seems that the Mk1 GTi and Convertible both had a 9" servo, the Mk1 1.3 was 7".
The Mk2 GTi also seems to be 9", but maybe a different design to the Mk1 version, hence the different part No.
On ECP, the Mk2 1.3 servo is shown as a 7" servo. I dont think Dave put a servo that small on his conversion, but he did say he used a 1.3 servo because the Mk2 GTi one was to big.

All I can say is that I wouldnt want a 7" servo on my E30. It would of made fitting the S50 plenum much easier, but comparing them all together and it just looked like it wouldnt cope.

[Bharat]

Bloody Germans

I think the difference between the normal 9" and the Mk2 16v GTi 9" is that the latter is bigger in length ? Look at the picture for the 89 model that I've posted - there's the 9x106 servo - 1A under the POS column, and the Mk2 (denoted by the 16V) says 9"/229mm.

I think the one you have is the 9x106, as the part number seems to be closer to the one you mentioned earlier in this post.

Did you change the master cylinder as well ?

[jmc330i]

there's the 9x106 servo - 1A under the POS column, and the Mk2 (denoted by the 16V) says 9"/229mm.

That could be what Dave meant by the 16v servo being to big.

Ive used the E30 master cylinder. It was a straight swap onto the servo and the brake lines lined up as well.

[stulane]

I got hold of a MK1 golf GTI servo in the end. Nearly got everything for my swap sorted.

Just gotta get my car through MOT and then im gonna pull the M20 engine out.

...Then the real work starts

[MtechMick]

This is what I had made for mine:



The engine is making 165rwHP as a result.

[stulane]

This is what I had made for mine:

Mick: How much did that cost you to get that made?

I'm still looking around for someone who will be able to help me.

[MtechMick]

They ended up being about $900AUD.