Front fog light/rear wiper issue!!

[Johnboy83]

Please can some one help me!!
First issue is that the front fog lights don't work on my e30 (1991). I have had the car for just over a week and today I have checked the fuses, bulbs and relay. All the other lights work, the front fog light symbol doesn't light up on the dashboard as the rear does. I have had the switch out today but it does seem to come apart like the e/w switch does?
Second issue is the rear wiper wasn't working so I changed the fuse and it works but doesn't switch off? The rear wash doesn't work either even though I have filled the bottle.

Any help or suggestions please?

[Johnboy83]

Any help??

[Brianmoooore]

Monday evenings are not a good time to get help from me! Out all evening and tend to partake of a little fermented grain.

Pull out the fog light relay K8 in the fusebox and use a short piece of wire to link together pins 30 and 87 (not 87b) of its socket. This should make both fog lights, and the tell tale on the dash, light up.

Your problem with the rear wiper motor is an unusual one, but I suspect that the problem may lie with the micro switch mounted on the motor's gearbox cover that parks the wiper blade after it's switched off. Disconnecting the black/red wire between the micro switch and pin 31b of the control module will prove if this is correct.

For the rear washers, find the black/purple wire at pin 6 of the switch, or the other end of it at pin 4 of the wiper motor, short it to a good body earth without disconnecting it, and try the washer button with the ignition on.

[Johnboy83]

Ok thanks I will try and look when the weather improves and it's light. I will come back to you.

[Johnboy83]

I have looked in the fuse box with the relay out and I can't see anything labelled 30 or 87?

[Brianmoooore]

Pin numbers are on the relays themselves.

[Johnboy83]

Ok the wire worked in the fusebox. I am struggling to find the rear wiper micro switch.??
I take it I need a new relay for the fog lights?

[Brianmoooore]

No, chances are you don't need a new relay. Life isn't that simple. This is simply the first test to determine what's wrong.
You've established that the problem is with the control circuit for the foglights, not the controlled circuit.
I'm assuming this is a UK spec. E30, as there are considerable differences in the foglight circuits for different markets to comply with local regulations.
Pull out the foglight switch, unplug it, and use a piece of wire to short together the grey wire on pin 7 and the grey/blue wire on pin 5 of the socket.
Switch on the main lighting switch and the ignition switch, and see if the fogs light.

Rear wiper microswitch is mounted inside the gearbox cover of the wiper motor itself, and is connected between pins 1 and 2 of the motor's plug.

Washers?

[Johnboy83]

Yes this is a UK spec e30, I will do It tomorrow, if this works what next?

[Johnboy83]

If it works is it the switch that's faulty?

[jmc330i]

The front fog lights on my Sport didn't work when I first got it (12 years ago). I was at BMW and one of the old techs said the contacts in the switch gum up through lack of use. He said to just flick it on/off for 10mins to clean the contact up...
So 5 mins spent in the drivers seat pushing the switch in and out had the tell tale light flickering on. Another few mins had the lights working.

Not quite as technical as above, but sometimes the simple things work.

[Johnboy83]

Ok cheers, I have had the switch out before and it does seem to feel different from the rear fog light. It feels like the contacts are my as strong as the rear one, anything is worth a go thought so thanks

[jmc330i]

The BMW tech said it was quite common for cars to come back in with non working front fogs. In most cases it was a gummed up switch because nobody really used them.
From memory, the rear fogs on mine were also a little temperamental (it had been a garage queen for 8-9 years before I got it), but the same process sorted those out as well.

[Brianmoooore]

Yes this is a UK spec e30, I will do It tomorrow, if this works what next?

What next depends on the results of this, and the other tests. I don't guess at what's wrong, I test logically until I prove what's wrong, but since I'm probably a long way away from you, I require you to be my hands, ears and eyes for the tests.

[jmc330i]

No guessing Brian. If the OP follows your test (shorting out pin7 and pin5 of the socket) to find the lights work, then operating the switch on/off constantly for a few mins will usually see the lights flicker into action. The advice was from a BMW tech with 30+ years experience (back in 2002), who could just as easily of said 'book your car in so we can carry out some tests to determine what's wrong, at £££per hour'.

As I said above, its not as technical as your test but, its simple to carry out (for those not blessed with your knowledge/confidence when working on cars) and saves stripping the switch down to clean it up - which will be the next step if the OP finds the lights work when bridging the pins in the socket.
FWIW, the fogs on my Sport have worked fine since 2002 and I've never taken the switch apart.

[Johnboy83]

Ok, the lights work with the wire on pins 7 and 5. I have messed with the switch but still the same?

[Brianmoooore]

It is the switch that's faulty, but 90% of the time they are easily repairable.
Easy to dismantle - just flip the little tabs at the back carefully, and lift off the shell keeping the buttons facing upwards. Clean all the bits, add a small amount of silicon grease and snap it back together. Won't give any more trouble for the next twenty years.
The 10% that can't be repaired are the ones with burnt out contacts that have been possibly caused by operating the switch on/off constantly for a few mins until the lights flicker into action!

[Johnboy83]

Ok cheers I will look at getting it apart today and repairing, thanks.

[jmc330i]

The 10% that can't be repaired are the ones with burnt out contacts that have been possibly caused by operating the switch on/off constantly for a few mins until the lights flicker into action!

Maybe if they've been flicked on/off for a few mins every time they've been used over the last 20+ years. But for a few mins to see if the switch is worth taking apart to clean, I think it will be ok.
I never said it was a cure for the problem, just a simple way of checking the switch... I did say the next step will be to clean the switch.
My Sport had the on/off test once, 12 years ago. The switch has been fine/the lights have worked since, so I've never actually cleaned that particular switch.

I have seen plenty of broken little tabs where people haven't been so careful in trying to get the switch apart, a task as you rightly say is fairly straight forward, but with age the plastics can become brittle.

I don't recall seeing a switch that hasn't worked, once I've tried it as above and then cleaned up the contacts.

[Johnboy83]

Ok guys, many thanks I am now a proud owner of an e30 touring with working front fog lights!! Started on the rear washer and wiper but it got a bit dark. The drivers handle doesn't seem to have a back plate, if I buy another is it an easy swap? This car was bought as a bit of a project with quite a few little faults. I am not a mechanic or mechanically minded but I love this car! So bear with me!!

[Brianmoooore]

The drivers handle doesn't seem to have a back plate

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[Johnboy83]

Well the drivers handle seems loose when you open the door?? Outside!

[Johnboy83]

Brian, where are you located?

[TPS]

Fixed my non-working Rear wiper, the other day, traced it back to fuse 6! Now working again, fine.

Hairline crack in the fuse, I have a rear Brake light, which has been working fine with the 15A fuse.