valves out

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 4:58 pm

merry xmas all.
Had a split hose which I changed, but led to bad coolant leak last weekend, pi**ing out of sump. I thought this would be head gasket, but took head off today and two of the valves are poking out, one inlet and one outlet.
Also fitted a non zone chip last week a few days before.
What now? This is the first time I've had an engine apart and have just finished so am now gonna cry in my beer.
Forgot to mention all pistons have what looks like valve marks on them, more prominent on the intake.
Should outside pistons be up and rest down?

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 5:49 pm

I don't mean to be rude but from your description you don't sound too sure on your knowledge of how an engine works.

When you say the valves are sticking out, do you mean they are open or are they sticking out because the head of the valve is bent where it's hit the piston ?

As for the pistons they have small indents because the clearence to the valves is so small.

This is what the 320-318 pistons should look like, if its a 325 then they are different again

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 5:51 pm

i dont get the coolant pissing out of the sump?

how would that happen?

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:01 pm

Sounds to me like the gasket has gone or the head has corroded at the rear water channels (if it's a 320) and is over pressured thats why the hose blew. I've got an idea DazzyA's description of the sump is the rocker cover

DazzyA as for the pistons being up and down i don't think you need to worry about that. If that had somehow magicaly changed from the norm you would probably have noticed the engine come through the bonnet.

If you need a new head and not just a new gasket i know of a guy in Chigwell that has one (well he did last week)

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:04 pm

you're right martin, I have limited knowledge. I did mean open, ports 2 and three and the pistons 1 and 6.
The head gasket looks ok and pretty new, there was beige colour oil/coolant on block and in one of the cylinders.
Valve marks look similar to yours.
Head is pretty new also nice and shiny.
The coolant looked like it was coming out of the sump gasket and running down the lwest part of the sump.
Its a 325.
I thought that when at top dead centre all the valves would be closed, is this not the case.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:14 pm

If the only reason you took the head off was for coolant loss then the timing gear should be OK, But thats your call.

Check around the rear water channels for what looks like chipped corners on the head. (there are some pictures on here somewhere from someone that had a similar problem)
And have a look at the gasket for distorsions or pieces missing, then the mating faces of the head and block for signs of water of oil crossing from one hole to another.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:22 pm

the valves are never all closed at the same time so that sounds ok
I think the pistons on the 325 are different from the pic but the trouble with that head is if it overheats it can crack and become pourous rendering it as scrap, have a look below the camshaft for hairline cracks and also in between the valves of that cylinder.
If you rebuild it you will also need a new sump gasket as it sound like that has blown as well.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:25 pm

DazzyA wrote: I thought that when at top dead centre all the valves would be closed, is this not the case.

Nope! When one cylinder is at TDC the others aren't...

I correct myself two cylinders will be at TDC at any one time, but one will be on it's firing stroke, the other on the exhaust stroke.

If all the valves were all shut all at the same time, then the engine wouldn't turn over very well...

I hope you plan to use new head bolts when putting this lot back together, and triple check the cam timing too!

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:27 pm

She's a 325.
Had a new bare head in August with gaskets. I bought the car end of October and have only done about 100 miles.
The water hose had suffered from wear from the fan catching it. I didn't notice this till it was too late.
I started the car on The cold Sunday morning, she was running for about five minutes and when I opened the bonnet I saw the water spraying from the hose.
I replaced hose and fan, refilled coolant and found there was no hot air in the cab so took of the hose at the firewall and replaced and then ok, took for a spin about 1 mile got back and engine overheating. Jacked up the front and when running the coolant looked like it was running out ot the sump gasket, really fast, not when running though.
This is why I thought it may be head gasket.
I have a new one so will put back on and try.
I thought that at top dead centre all valves would be closed.
I also wondered whether a bad "chip" could mess up the timing.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:32 pm

e30mark, thanks for that, feeling a bit better, have got new bolts, found out today one was missing from originals. Could just be the head gasket then.
I have no idea on the timing, will need BMW to sort that out I think.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:35 pm

The timing is set by the timing belt but a dodgy chip could possibly fire at the wrong time casuing the head and gasket undue stress.

Is it possible to post a pic of the gasket and face of the head ?

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:37 pm

If theres a bolt missing then whoever did the work before is liable.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:40 pm

Will try and get photo's now, reason I asked about the chip was that I had loads of problems with guy and ended up claiming through paypal, so now wondering whether he might have done it on purpose.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:46 pm

If i were you i'd worry more about the missing bolt, it could have warped the head.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:12 pm

Oh dear, I guess that would explain the leak. The previous owner had the new head fitted by a mechanic "friend".
Don't know whether these photo's are relevent now. It was bolt number 11 that was missing.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:33 pm

I'd say get yourself another head gasket (and sump) and bolt it back together.
Looks like you got off lightly.
Read some of the previous threads on filling and bleeding the coolant system and all should be fine.

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 9:23 pm

How the hell can anyone fit a head and miss out a bolt? You'd think they'd miss it when torquing down!
If the head replacement was this amateurish, then you might be lucky and get away with just a head gasket.
My first E30 (a 318) came to me many years ago with a well blown or cracked head, following a recent gasket replacement. Paid about a quarter of it's real value for it.
Found wrong length bolts in various places, washers where there shouldn't be washers, missing washers where there should be washers, and torques all over the place. Obviously seriously amateurish workmanship. Changed just the head gasket, and sold it four yours later for twice what it cost me!

Post Sat Dec 24, 2005 10:29 pm

I found it strange that the guy had all receipts for new head/gaskest and timing gear but no receipt for fitting. The inlet manifold had 3 different kinds of nut, some of the rocker cover studs stayed in and some came out. I didn't check torques before removing head bolts, but they felt all different torques.
Least it will get me out of the house tomorrow.
Only real problem I had was getting lower camshaft cover off, bolt was ever so slightly too long and jammed against vibration damper(need a new cover now).