Brake solution for s50/52 conversion?

[buster]

im interested in this becasue im not sure on what i am going to do yet.

Was thinking alsorts.
1.one idea was to run filter socks on the throttle bodies and have one of the runners fitted with the MAF.Im not sure this would work but it would totally do away with the s50 plenum chamber.

2.Another idea is to use the 944 servo and move it down and over a bit.Mod the plenum also if needed.

3.use the one from zoom motorsport.How much are these ??

[Jhonno]

1. wouldnt work as it would only measure the airflow across the single t'b..

could always get rid of the Vanos and fit Emerald

[jmc330i]

The Zoom plenum is about Ԛ£450 I think.

Its a direct replacement for the S50 plenum, keeping the original E30 servo and fits to the cut down plastic funnels with some silicon hose.
If you are keeping the MAF you will need to cut the end of the Zoom plenum down as it is too long to have the MAF and air filter attached - It was designed to run without the MAF.

[jmc330i]

could always get rid of the Vanos and fit Emerald

Thats what Zoom do, but not using Emerald. Cant think what mangement they use.

Or you could go for Motec - I think their management can run the Vanos but its big bucks

[buster]

Ԛ£450 i think just for the plenum is a rip off,i could have one made for half the price.Also if you junk the MAF,whats the point in fitting the zoom plenum,why not us the plastic runners with filter socks on ??

Thats what id do.How much is the aftermarket ecu ?? is it a unichip or piggy back just to control the MAF signals

[jmc330i]

I know the Zoom plenum is a well made bit of kit and the ally welding probably takes up most of the cost, but thats why I didnt go for it and decided to do my own. Ok, Ive had a few problems, but its only cost me Ԛ£50 so far.

[Jhonno]

could always get rid of the Vanos and fit Emerald

Thats what Zoom do, but not using Emerald. Cant think what mangement they use.

Or you could go for Motec - I think their management can run the Vanos but its big bucks

yeah motec can run the vanos - but as you say

[jmc330i]

How much is the aftermarket ecu ?? is it a unichip or piggy back just to control the MAF signals

I have no idea Im afraid. The problem is the Vanos. If you get Emerald for instance, I think you need to remove the Vanos.
Thinking about it, the 3.0ltr S50s have a separate Vanos controller, so maybe changing to standalone management isnt so much of a problem??

The 3.2 Evos have an 'all in one' ecu and Vanos controller which would be more of a problem Im guessing.

[buster]

im sure i remember Ian saying it isnt too difficult to remove the MAF unit.
Maybe a piggyback >?

[Karan]

im sure i remember Ian saying it isnt too difficult to remove the MAF unit.
Maybe a piggyback >?

ud have to fit a map sensor somehow to measure load etc....

[ian332isport]

You basically have 3 options:

Remove the brake servo and run without it. This is a quick solution, but far from ideal. The brakes would be incredibly heavy, and not really practical for everyday use. I guess you could get used to it...

Fit a remote vacuum servo somewhere else in the engine bay. This is probably the easiest solution. You still have servo assisted brakes, but it does not look very original. If you are not bothered by this, then go for it.

Fit the hydraulic servo system from the E23 7 series. This uses pressure from the power steering pump to assist the brakes. It works very well, but is a royal pain in the arse to install nicely. There are quite a lot of parts to find homes for, and some modification of parts are required. Even with this option, I had to modify the intake plenum to gain clearance between the rubber intake boot, and the end of the master cylinder. I am however very happy with the results. It looks like a factory install, and works very well.

One of my main requirements of this conversion was to keep everything looking standard, and more importantly, not to modify the body of the car in ANY way. If you are happy to cut, drill and weld your bulkhead etc, then you have more options for the brakes.

As Brian mentioned, it's possible to move the servo outwards. This will gain some clearance, but I don't believe there is enough space for the plenum unless you take a chunk out of the corner. It's also possible to move the servo downwards, but still probably not going to get enough space.

Assuming your battery is in the boot, then the remote servo is going to be the best option if you don't mind it sitting under the bonnet.
You basically have a master cylinder fitted on the bulkhead where the servo would normally be fitted. This sends fluid across to the remote servo, and this then provides the boosted pressure to the brakes. You can see a small picture here:

http://www.bmauto.iinet.net.au/perf_con16b.html

Cheers,

Ian.

[Karan]

i will [post pics of my e23 brake setp so far lkater on today so people can see how it is laid out.......requires a lot of custom brackets and bodging as space is at a premium.....but u know ure keeping bmw parts which are top notch...

pipes will also need to be modded or made from scratch...this is the bit i am getting to now....

its a setup which is neat and solid.....only downside is that the brake spheres do eventually go tits up.... bt these are only Ԛ£30 from euros

may also be worth hooking up a pressure gauge to the valve block so u know if ure losing pressure---there are sensors already on the valve block ( i think there are 2....not sure what does what though) do u know Ian??

dont let this scare u off the conversion as its not that big a deal.....especially if u r good at fabricating brackets etc..

Karan

[ian332isport]

may also be worth hooking up a pressure gauge to the valve block so u know if ure losing pressure---there are sensors already on the valve block ( i think there are 2....not sure what does what though) do u know Ian??

Karan,

They are both pressure switches. One switches when pressure is below 22 Bar, and the other below 2 Bar.

Not sure why you need two switches either. I believe the sphere holds around 1000 psi (around 68 Bar), so 22 is quite low and could be used as a warning light switch.

Ian.

[Jhonno]

You basically have 3 options:

Remove the brake servo and run without it. This is a quick solution, but far from ideal. The brakes would be incredibly heavy, and not really practical for everyday use. I guess you could get used to it...

Fit a remote vacuum servo somewhere else in the engine bay. This is probably the easiest solution. You still have servo assisted brakes, but it does not look very original. If you are not bothered by this, then go for it.

Fit the hydraulic servo system from the E23 7 series. This uses pressure from the power steering pump to assist the brakes. It works very well, but is a royal pain in the arse to install nicely. There are quite a lot of parts to find homes for, and some modification of parts are required. Even with this option, I had to modify the intake plenum to gain clearance between the rubber intake boot, and the end of the master cylinder. I am however very happy with the results. It looks like a factory install, and works very well.

One of my main requirements of this conversion was to keep everything looking standard, and more importantly, not to modify the body of the car in ANY way. If you are happy to cut, drill and weld your bulkhead etc, then you have more options for the brakes.

As Brian mentioned, it's possible to move the servo outwards. This will gain some clearance, but I don't believe there is enough space for the plenum unless you take a chunk out of the corner. It's also possible to move the servo downwards, but still probably not going to get enough space.

Assuming your battery is in the boot, then the remote servo is going to be the best option if you don't mind it sitting under the bonnet.
You basically have a master cylinder fitted on the bulkhead where the servo would normally be fitted. This sends fluid across to the remote servo, and this then provides the boosted pressure to the brakes. You can see a small picture here:

http://www.bmauto.iinet.net.au/perf_con16b.html

Cheers,

Ian.

i think i'll go for the remote option then. I'd like to keep it looking like it came out the factory...

any pics of your engine bay/setup?

[Karan]

i think u r confused dan...

the remote option does not look out the factory, i think u r confusing it with the e23 hydraulic setup

[Karan]

Dan, Ian was kind enough to write me an essay on the brake subject a while ago..... whats ure email and i'll email it to u.... it will explain all!!!!!

Karan

[buster]

could you email it to me also please karan.

cheers
andy

v8capri@msn.com

[Karan]

sent!

ive added u to msn if thats ure msn addy

[buster]

cool,yeah thats my msn,cheers karan

[Jhonno]

i think u r confused dan...

Most probably - it happens alot

[Karan]

well u have the thingy i sent u over msn...any probs lemme know!

Karan