Auto grade hardware - where to stock up?

Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:00 pm

Ordering every little nut and bolt from BMW takes ages.

I bought engine mounts and control arms from BMW and they didn't even supply the fixing hardware!

If someone wanted to stock up on hi-grade hardware for any future job, nuts, bolts, clips etc - where could you get a large 'order' in one go?

I know that different parts have different strangth grades, heat treatings etc.

Anyone?

Sat Dec 16, 2006 5:20 pm

Most nut and bolt suppliers will be able to supply what you need. The majority of BMW fasteners are basic 8.8 high tensile stuff, but you do occasionally find 10.9 or even higher. Just have a look at the bolt heads of the fasteners you are replacing, and it should be marked accordingly.

The only problem getting non genuine fasteners is the corrosion resistance. BMW fasteners are generally plated to help stop corrosion, but this is not generally the case when buying non automotive stuff. You could always go for stainless steel stuff. I use a lot of this on my car.

Ian.

Sat Dec 16, 2006 5:53 pm

Yeah but WHERE would I get this stuff Ian!:)

Is stainless steel the same strength as heat treated / zinc plated etc?

Can you list in order of critical strength what areas you should not skimp?

I know that brakes and suspension parts need to be proper, but where else?

Cheers too.

Sat Dec 16, 2006 8:56 pm

Royalratch wrote:Yeah but WHERE would I get this stuff Ian!:)

Is stainless steel the same strength as heat treated / zinc plated etc?

Can you list in order of critical strength what areas you should not skimp?

I know that brakes and suspension parts need to be proper, but where else?

Cheers too.

Most towns have at least one Nut, Bolt and Fasteners place. You would have to check the Yellow pages, but you will probably have one fairly close. I'm lucky that my local place does not have minimum order quantities, and will sell a single bolt if that's all I want. A lot of places will only sell in larger amounts, but this may be cheaper if you are stocking up anyway.

Regardless of the material or finish, they will all be graded. Have a look at the head of pretty much any bolt and it will have some numbers on it. If it doesn't then it's probably cheap crap and best avoided anyway. The first step into High Tensile bolts is 8.8 grade (most bolts are 8.

. This is what most bolts will be on an E30. Once you get down to the brake caliper mounting bolts, propshaft bolts or any other high torque application, you may find 10.9 grade which is the next grade up. It's unlikely you will find anything higher grade than this on a car. 8.8 grade is actually quite strong, so is more than adequate for most things. You just need to make sure that any bolts you do replace are of a suitable grade (i.e the same as you took off)

Ian.

Sat Dec 16, 2006 9:22 pm

Cool.

I read somwhere that automotive grade hardware is tough to find. Long a as I check the quality I can use hardrwae from any store. Cool.

Do you know if any bolts/nuts on an E30 are proprietary BMW only hardware?

Some really useful info- cheers.

Sat Dec 16, 2006 9:34 pm

A lot of BMW fasteners come with washers attached in some form or other. I can't get these from my local fasteners specialist, so have to use seperate washers.
There are also fasteners on BMWs that have non standard sized heads for the size of the thread, sometimes for a good reason (to allow a socket to go on), and other times for no reason that I can see at all.

Sat Dec 16, 2006 10:32 pm

Stainless steel bolts are weaker than mild steel so dont go putting any in your seat belt anchors etc

Sat Dec 16, 2006 10:36 pm

Stainless 8.8 are the same strength as 8.8 Steel......

Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:17 pm

The graded are, but there are a lot of non graded bolts that are just crap

Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:04 am

So never buy bolts that don't have a strength grade etched/stamped on it?

I've always assumed that non-standard size nuts and bolts on any car/appliance are to stop unauthorised messing about by home 'mechanics.'

I'll do an internet search and find out a bit more.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:51 am

Royalratch wrote:So never buy bolts that don't have a strength grade etched/stamped on it?

.

Definitely.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:54 am

Royalratch wrote: I've always assumed that non-standard size nuts and bolts on any car/appliance are to stop unauthorised messing about by home 'mechanics.'
.

BMW toolkit in the boot has the unusual sizes in it.
They're not "non standard", just a different size head (usually one mm smaller) than you'd expect to find.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:29 am

Royalratch wrote:Do you know if any bolts/nuts on an E30 are proprietary BMW only hardware?

As mentioned above by Brian, there are some BMW specials. Some needed, and others can be replaced. Some bolts will have special lengths that you won't be able to get, and some even have non standard threads (size or pitch). You will also find the odd bolt with a special sized shoulder that cannot be replaced with a standard bolt (steering coupling for example).

If you are at all unsure if you can replace it with a non genuine bolt, then don't risk it. BMW are not that expensive for this sort of stuff anyway, so there really is no excuse if safety is involved.

Ian.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 3:55 pm

Don't mind expense.

It's just that they are painfully slow.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 4:05 pm

answer is to order all corisponding bols etc when you order the part

quite simple in a simple way really

Sun Dec 17, 2006 4:36 pm

I usually do - but sometimes shit happens that you ain't prepared for and you find yourself short of some stuff.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 4:53 pm

not had a problem myself but i keep most things from breakers anyway so perhaps thats why

Sun Dec 17, 2006 5:59 pm

When I harvest E30 bits from my favourite scrappy, unless it's a virgin car, fresh in, then there is always all sorts of fasteners left lying around it by those who have been there before me.
Every nut, bolt and clip that I have to remove goes into my toolbox, along with any of those that are already off if they are clean and shiny.

Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:24 pm

I thought reusing fastening hardware was a no no...?

Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:51 pm

Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:08 pm

Royalratch wrote:I thought reusing fastening hardware was a no no...?

Depends entirely what the fasteners are for.
Stretch bolts are obviously single use only, locknuts are good for a couple of uses normally, in spite of what Haynes says, and ordinary fasteners can be used as many times as you like if they're undamaged.
Having said that, anything showing signs of corrosion gets binned as a matter of course.

Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:41 am

I don't even know what a stretch bolt is - where would that get used?

Going to check out my local hardware store and see what they got.

Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:05 pm

Royalratch wrote:I don't even know what a stretch bolt is - where would that get used?

Stretch bolts are used for bolting down a cylinder head to the engine block.

Mon Dec 18, 2006 1:16 pm

Ah. Bolts that are used in high heat areas etc.

Roger.

Cheers.

Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:10 pm

Royalratch wrote:Ah. Bolts that are used in high heat areas etc.

Roger.

Cheers.

Not specifically heat. They are used where an even/accurate clamping force is required (i.e. Head gasket).

Stretch bolts are mainly used inside the engine, but you would be foolish to replace any internal engine fasteners with non genuine ones due to the potential damage it could do if they failed. Using non genuine to bolt a manifolds or timing cover on is generally fine, but not the internal stuff really (unless you really know what you are doing).

It's also important to consider the plating on the bolts as well. If you fit a non plated bolt in an alloy casting, you can get bad corrosion due to the dissimilar metals. Plating the bolts correctly can help to avoid this.

Ian.