white smoke???

[robmpulse]

well, after spending almost a grand on my car and only having it back for about 4 days, she starting smoking. It is pure white smoke and is constantly coming through the exhaust. I also noticed a coolant smell while the car is running. (which has me worried it is the head gasket)

this is what I had done at the shop before this happened.....

timing belt, water pump, all belts, all hoses, fan clutch, plugs, wires, cap, rotor, fuel filter, air filter, and had the valves adjusted.

When I went to pick up the car, I immediately noticed a very loud ticking noise that I had never heard before. The valves did make some chatter before it went in (hence the valve adjustment) but I know my car and EVERY niose that it makes. This was a new noise. I was assured by the shop that this was a ticking injector and nothing to worry about.

the car did not smoke when I picked it up. I have only had the car for about 4 or 5 days and the car has maybe been driven 40 miles since picked up. The smoke started about 1 or 2 mins after starting the car and did not go away. I shut off the car immediately.

The shop has told me to bring it to them so they can look at it.

My question...... should this had been something they should have caught at the shop? Is it possible that an axhaust valve not being adjusted properly could cause the smoke? or is this almost a fur sure sign of a bad head gasket?

[cliffybabe]

It sounds like a head gasket to me, White smoke to me would say condensation in the exhaust vapour hence it being the head gasket

What work did u have done in the garage??

[robmpulse]

What work did u have done in the garage??

it's all stated in my first post.....

[cliffybabe]

What work did u have done in the garage??

it's all stated in my first post.....

do u know what i totaly missed that bit

[orangecurry]

another kwality post from Cliffybabe

is there any gunk/mayonaise under the oil-cap?

[jon_pure_british]

im having the same problem, as soon as it started to get cold i think.

how much is a new head gasket = labour?

grr doesnt sound good for me either.

will this mayonaise be on the cap itself on the underside? cos ima have a check later

[cliffybabe]

another kwality post from Cliffybabe

im going back to bed now

[orangecurry]

Yes - on the underside of the cap...

What happens is the water that is escaping through the damaged gasket goes from the high pressure (cooling circuit) to the low pressure (but oiled) top of the engine; as the engine is switched off and slowly cools, the water vapour condenses on the coolest part of the engine first - the top of the rocker-cover. This includes the underside of the oil-cap.

You can notice this before there is any damaging amount of water-loss from the cooling system/circuit.

Don't forget there is always a bit of water vapour in an engine, so don't panic if there is a bit of mayonaise (this mayo is the result of water and oil being mixed BTW)

[jon_pure_british]

so small amounts are not uncommon then?

(sorry for hijacking the thread i was just searching for a thread about this !!)

[GDBN]

Sure it's not just a bit more condensation in the colder weather?
You'll have to see if the car is losing coolant. Coolant smell could be because you have all new hoses and they will give off a smell the first few times they are heated.

And I would not want any mayo under the filler cap .....

[robmpulse]

well, I had my girlfriend start the car a few mins ago. She said ther eis no smoke and car is running fine with no misfire or sputtering........

someone in a thread on another board said that might be because the head is cracked and it let coolant in the cylider when warm, sat overnight..... cooled off causing the crack to seal itself back up....then when I started it....it burned up all the coolant that collected.......

because of the loud ticking noise, I can't get passed the idea that this might be because of a bad exhaust lifter or something........

any other idea's?

[DaveD]

Sure it's not just a bit more condensation in the colder weather?
Y....

he is in Florida..cold is not known

how about an injector ? they have been known to tick
try this thread

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/viewtopic. ... ht=ticking
d

[robmpulse]

yea, this is FL....but it has gotten into the 50's lately....... still not cold by my North GA standards.....

anyhoot.....

this ticking noise is not normal. I have two E30's and am very aware of normal valve train ticking..... I am also VERY aware of the sounds my cars make. It was NOT making this noise when it went in for service....

Bottom line is that I guess it could be a bad injector......but then why is it still running fine........

::shrugs::

[DaveD]

i dare you to ask jordan!

[dobbey1]

are you sure they havent put the valve timing out when they did the water pump and the ticking noise is the vavle just kissing the piston, i had a similar noise when i had my head skimmed once and they took to much off. just another thought!!!

[mrLEE30]

this sounds like you lot have cowboys in USA too by that i mean mechanics who are full of sh!t and come up with every excuse under the sun if the car is not right after they have played with it.

so
1. if it is quite humid as florida can get, and as it is 50 (F not C i presume) then there is a good chance that you have condensation in your exhaust pipe for what ever reason. plus BMW's due to their Bosch injection system do tend to give out white smoke, due to condensation in the exhaust and water content in the fuel, this can be normal in the right atmospheric conditions (i.e high humidity or high reliative humidity common when the weather cools down.) so if your white smoke problem has stopped then it could be this.
2. it could also be your head gasket blown/blowing. only real way to check is to remove the head and inspect. but you can try the above as suggested by orangecurry, and you can remove the sparkplugs, five brown/black ones and one very clean on is a good indication that head geasket has blown. this should be followed up with a compression check, you are looking for all cylinders to be within 5-10% of each other (depending on how old your engine is)
3 if all is good and the smoke has stopped then dont worry, keep an eye on your temp guage as blown head gasket normally leads to VERY rapid overheating i.e within a minute or two from starting the engine. keep an eye on your coolant level, (you should do this as you had the hoses changed and small leaks can occur as they expand)
4. the noise.... two things a: either in your head (in which case the injector)or b: a problem with the valves/cam belt
use a length of wood(such as a wooden broom handle cut to a 2 foot length), put one end against your ear the other end you use to ''listen'' to specific parts of the engine, with the engine running and idling have one end of the wood in your ear, the other you touch above each cylinder area on the rocker cover, if one specific area sounds obviously loud suspect a valve problem, do the same on the injectors and one may be loud, but note it is normal for some ticking especially after adjustment. (note be very carefull when ''listening'' stay away from the fan area!!!

if the noise is still quite loud then suggest the garage remove the rocket cover (better have them do it so they are responsible) and you should be able to check for a sticking valve/misadjusted valve, run the engine with no cover for minute is not a problem (although it may idle funny). if that dont fix it have them remove the timiing belt and verify the timing marks are correct (you will need to put a new belt and tensioner on if you do this., do not re-use a belt once its been stretched)

check all that and come back to us

mrlee

[Martinaston]

Being the pessimist i am, i'd say they've shagged the timing when fitting the belt and hit a valve thats then fractured the head. They've then tried to put it right and hope to get away with it.
As mentioned check the colour of the plugs first, but thats no guarantee that the heads not cracked between the water jacket and exhaust port. It will only steam clean a plug if its leaking into the combustion chamber but when that happens it pressurises the cooling system and boils over fairly quick.
Either way it went wrong after they worked on it so there liable, best of luck.

[mrLEE30]

yes correct about the steam cleaning the plugs, only was giving it as an indication of a problem, even a good compression check is not a guarentee of a good head gasket, only way to be sure is to remove head.

hope martin is not right as really any mechanic worth his salt would turn the crank by hand to ensure no interference between valve and piston once the belt is fitted, a problem would be apparent, but if he is a guy used to working on pushrod engines and does not understand the concept of interference engines he may have built it up one tooth out, again remove the plugs and look for fine splinters of metal on the plugs.

mate if i were you i would monitor the smoke, if it stops during warm weather then its only condensation, if the engine is running fine and power is as before then its unlikely the timing is out as that would affect performance of engine. if the power is down insist they remove the head to check, worth noting the work they have carried out would not result in a head gasket failure unless they did something stupid like didn't bleed the air out of coolant system, ran the engine and overheated it, this could cause head gasket failure and possible warped head (thet MAY aslo contribute to the ticking noise but i am not sure about this possibilty)

but you did say they are willing to look at it, do they know about M20 engines? get his opinion and combine with the above advice form all and make a decision to remove head or not, that will give an answer to all the above problems!! (but you will need to replace gaskets,belt + tensioner but they should be made to do that if its their fault - picture posted here and we will help!


oh yeah just a though before you pull the engine apart...... do you have the correct amount of oil in there?? low oil causes tapping noise!!!!
mrlee

[orangecurry]

worth noting the work they have carried out would not result in a head gasket failure unless they did something stupid like didn't bleed the air out of coolant system, ran the engine and overheated it, this could cause head gasket failure and possible warped head (thet MAY aslo contribute to the ticking noise but i am not sure about this possibilty)

mrlee

very good point; this engines cooling system is difficult to bleed... if you don't know what you are doing

[Brianmoooore]

unless they did something stupid like didn't bleed the air out of coolant system, ran the engine and overheated it,

mrlee

very good point; this engines cooling system is difficult to bleed... if you don't know what you are doing

If the head does turn out to be cracked, then this is almost certainly how it happened.
Wouldn't panic just yet though. Just monitor the coolant level, and the colour of the oil.