Steering linkage/shaft options

[HJ1981]

Good morning,

I noticed some play in the steering shaft/linkage in my E30. I am not a fan of purchasing a used one (anywhere from €80 to €250 in Germany) only to have play eventually become an issue again.

This part is NLA from BMW, and being in Germany i can not use some aftermarket piece (TÜV regulations).

Is there a shop/company that you know of that rebuilds them? The steering shaft/linkage is basically a driveshaft, with two u-joints and a rubber guibo in the center.

Or if anyone has any options/alternatives i would appreciate it.

[reggid]

Contact DanThe and get a solid shaft with new joints no rubber deterioration ever again

[HJ1981]

Contact DanThe and get a solid shaft with new joints no rubber deterioration ever again

To be honest, i could not tell if it is the rubber Guido that was giving, or one (or both) of the u-joints that had play.

If i get a solid shaft, i could have issues with local German TÜV inspection, since we have modified the steering system from the factory.

[Brianmoooore]

Only part I've ever seen fail in an E30 steering shaft is the flexible disc, which is easily replaceable. Regid's point about never having to change it again is hardly relevant on a part that lasts 20+ years!
Are you saying this is no longer available from BMW? It's definitely available from Autodoc.

[HJ1981]

Only part I've ever seen fail in an E30 steering shaft is the flexible disc, which is easily replaceable. Regid's point about never having to change it again is hardly relevant on a part that lasts 20+ years!
Are you saying this is no longer available from BMW? It's definitely available from Autodoc.

I was referring to the whole shaft, as a unit not just the flex disc, that is NLA from BMW.

The flex disc installed in my E30 has rivets instead of bolts and screws. I found several threads (US, UK and German) where users just grinded the rivets off and used BMW bolts and nuts with a new flex disc.

Question is not about the flex disc, but the u-join(s) themselves, if there is play there, what options are there?

[Brianmoooore]

The options in the unlikely event of a worn u joint would be to get a second hand shaft, and fit a new flex. disc to it if necessary. The chances of experiencing a second u joint failure would be negligible.
The special bolts replacing the rivets is BMW approved, and shouldn't fall foul of your TUV.

[HJ1981]

The options in the unlikely event of a worn u joint would be to get a second hand shaft, and fit a new flex. disc to it if necessary. The chances of experiencing a second u joint failure would be negligible.
The special bolts replacing the rivets is BMW approved, and shouldn't fall foul of your TUV.

It is always with TÜV that i need to be careful with any "changes" done, especially when i am going for the H (Historic/Old Timer) plates.

But thank you, seems like the only real option is a used shaft, then replace the flex disc is really the only option available for me anyways.

[HJ1981]

Small update.

I re-sealed the steering rack last week, and removed the steering shaft to inspect it. I placed it in a bench grip and started testing play, the U-joints (both upper and lower) are moving very freely, no binding or tightness. No matter what i did, i could not get any play from the U-joints.

The rubber guibo in the middle looks in excellent condition, no cracks, no sign of deterioration of any kind. No matter how i twisted and pulled on it, i could not get any play.

So i reinstalled the rack and shaft, making sure that the bottom U-joint lined up with the marking on the steering shaft pinion (top) cover and the marking on the shaft. The front end of my E30 is seriously planted and responds instantly.

Yesterday i was at the DIY to check the system for leaks, play, etc. Nice and dry and the wheels respond instantly to any steering input, i grabbed the steering shaft and started to check for lateral (side to side play) there was none. Ironically, there is a small click and tiny play when checking for vertical (up and down) play on the shaft. It comes and goes, very inconsistent and i could not pin point if it is coming from the u-joint or the guibo. I did not see any movement from the steering rack pinion (the top part where the shaft clamps onto) so i am sure it is the steering shaft.

It is strange, that on the bench, everything was tight on that shaft, and no matter what i did, i could not detect any play. It looks like at a certain angle (when installed) the shaft has some minor vertical play. The front end vibrations i am experiencing does support this, meaning it does feel as if something is vibrating vertically or hopping (not side to side). There is also a plastic bushing sitting inside the shaft, maybe that is failing or failed.

Not sure if i should pull the shaft out and grind down the rivets and replace the guibo or not now, they are a pain to remove but i have all the OE BMW bolts, washers, guibo and bushing. Or maybe find another shop and try the balance the wheels again.

[DanThe]

What speed do you get the vibration? If its around 50 - 70mph it will most likely be the wheels, its not just the balance of them either, you need to be checking for flat spots in the wheel rim

[HJ1981]

What speed do you get the vibration? If its around 50 - 70mph it will most likely be the wheels, its not just the balance of them either, you need to be checking for flat spots in the wheel rim

At 160kph (100mph) on the autobahn it starts and very clearly the front end, the steering shakes...more like vibrates and so does the dash a bit. At 170-180kph it is virtually gone, maybe very minor.

When i took the car to a shop for balancing, i told them to inspect the tires for cupping or flat spots, as well as the wheels for any bends, defects etc....they gave me a green light.

I do NOT get any vibrations when braking, i actually drove for 2 hours a couple of days ago testing this. Regardless of speed (50kph, 100kph, 120kph, 140kph and 160kph) light braking has no effect on vibrations, i tried medium braking and still no vibrations, then did several "emergency" brake tests at 100kph to near full stop, no vibrations, car does not "squabble" or move around under braking etc. I even tried a 140kph "emergency" brake test, since the roads were clear, and no vibrations and the car is completely under control, i actually do not need to correct the wheel when performing such tests. The entire front end is literally new, only the steering shaft and the actual front cross member are the originals.

But it could be the tires/wheels needing a "good" balancing shop, it does feel like a wheel is bouncing (up and down not side to side) at those speeds. In this small town of mine, it is difficult.

I drive at those speeds due to my new job in Munich, need to drive back and fourth twice a week, for now i keep it at 130kph (80?mph) and it sits just fine.

Sounds like a wheel/tire problem to you?

PS: I visually inspected the tires yesterday for cupping or flat spots when at the DIY, with my hand i could not feel any dips or changes in the thread pattern(s) on all 4 corners. I am no tire expert, but still visually and by hand i could not see any defects. The shoulders have no signs of excessive wear or signs of alignment issues, tire pressure(s) are 2.2 bar up front and 2.4 bar in the rears (bone cold).

[paultv]

Did you do a simple test of rotating the tyres? Put the rears on the front ...any changes to the feel of the drive? At least this tells you if its wheels / tyres or suspension related.

Paul:-)

Happy New Year!

[paultv]

and you need to check with a Hunter machine which measures road force.

http://www.reifen-center.net/?campaignId=202141

one of these in Munchen just off the ring?

Paul

[HJ1981]

Did you do a simple test of rotating the tyres? Put the rears on the front ...any changes to the feel of the drive? At least this tells you if its wheels / tyres or suspension related.

Paul:-)

Happy New Year!

Hi Paul, happy new year!

Last shop rotated the wheels and balanced them. To be fair i was over due for balancing, it was vibrating at 100kph and getting worse with speed. After the rotation and balancing it has significantly improved.

[HJ1981]

and you need to check with a Hunter machine which measures road force.

http://www.reifen-center.net/?campaignId=202141

one of these in Munchen just off the ring?

Paul

I can try them, i travel to Munich on Monday and Fridays. I guess i can leave home early for Munich and hit them up, then go to work.

Actually i can do that right now, thanks to the online booking, much appreciated, will visit them on Friday and report back.

[ChrisHC]

I had strange effects on an E36 years ago which turned out to be the tyres deteriorating internally, while they seemed perfectly good on the outside. If your tyres are old it might be worthwhile changing them earlier than you might otherwise to see if that solves it.

[HJ1981]

I had strange effects on an E36 years ago which turned out to be the tyres deteriorating internally, while they seemed perfectly good on the outside. If your tyres are old it might be worthwhile changing them earlier than you might otherwise to see if that solves it.

At this point, i am not going to rule out anything honestly.

The tires are practically new, got them last winter, Bridgestone Blizzaks LM005. Around 10.000 kms on them.

Will have the wheels and tires checked and force balanced first.

[HJ1981]

I was able to visit the shop yesterday before work, they informed me that no booking is required so i passed by.

They checked the wheels/tires with the current weights on them and found no issues, they then did a road force test, everything was fine. Checked the tire(s) and wheels for cupping, bends, issues, everything was fine. They assured me, any vibrations i encounter are not caused by the wheels and tires.

The manager is also an E30 cabrio owner, so we went through a "checklist" on what i have done to the car. After all said and done, he recommended that i change the strut mounts again. He said, in his experience and E30s the last 2-3 years have nothing but issues with these strut mounts in Germany. OE, or premium brands (Sachs, Meyle etc) all have issues. He advised me to purchase 4-5 Sachs or Meyle mounts and to test each one when installed on the strut and choose/keep the good two and return the rest.

He said some people get lucky and get good ones, but there is a known issue with E30 strut mounts, cheap or expensive brands it does not matter. He also mentioned how on his E30 the original mounts were made by SKF and not Sachs like some people (could be a second supplier, who knows).

Ironically, since yesterday and only yesterday, i have been getting a front end clicking, which definitely is coming from the upper mounts, which is ironic since i was just there and we talked about it and they have less than 1.000 kms on them.

I currently have Sachs mounts installed, not sure if i sure what to do now in terms of which brand to go for. I have experienced issues with Sachs, Meyle, Lemförder and Febi and yes, i made sure that the big washer sits between the spring plate and the mount as well as new grease cap on the underside of the mount (they are actually new from BMW).

So...my brain is just fried with whats going on at the moment, any advice is appreciated.

[DanThe]

I would be surprised if it was a strut top mount but then this guy has obviously experienced it so you need to take it into account, new mounts from BMW are about £60 each so not out the way at all, but I would still change the wheels first purely because its an easy test to do unlike changing the top mounts

[HJ1981]

I would be surprised if it was a strut top mount but then this guy has obviously experienced it so you need to take it into account, new mounts from BMW are about £60 each so not out the way at all, but I would still change the wheels first purely because its an easy test to do unlike changing the top mounts

One more small detail i forgot to mention, that gentleman in the workshop also said to me, if i am 100% sure that everything is nice and tight and torqued to spec, then change the brake discs as a "last resort".

I experienced the same issue on summer wheels (15" BMW BBS standards) and tires as well.

If i have time tomorrow, i shall take out the struts and go over each part individually carefully and take photos of every part installed and upload them here, maybe you guys can spot something i missed.