Problem with fitting WMS brakes

[BMracing]

Started on fitting my WMS brakes yesterday, but found the caliper carrier is just touching the inside of the brake disc, it rubs if you spin the disc.
Has anyone else come across this, how do I get round it?
I really need these on for the coming week!

Cheers

[BadDave]

Barry

Do you have the thin spacer between the hub and the disk.

I seem to remember that the disks supplied in the kit have a slight difference in offset from the OEM disks

[BMracing]

I didn't realise you had to fit spacers on the inside of the discs, the spacers I have don't fit on the inside.

This picture suggests they're meant to be on the outside!

http://s279.photobucket.com/albums/kk15 ... 5-001b.jpg

[BadDave]

Keri's post in the 1st page of this thread suggest's they are for fixing the disk offset.

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... c&t=113229

I'd try with the spacer between the hub and disk,then fitting the caliper and bolting on a wheel to check that the wheel turns without fouling.

Otherwise, wait till Keri get's in touch with the solution.

HTH

[DanThe]

If its the 280mm kit the spacer fits on the outside of the disk as normal

[BadDave]

That rules the spacer out then.

[Bob_S]

I think you have the washers in wrong mate. I had this and played around with the washers and got it sitting right I can't remember how I got it now as it was months ago

[DanThe]

Never had any issues with mine, went together easy, bracket against lug, washer behind head of the bolt, simples!

[bimanut]

Sorry to hijack but can any one tell me where i can look to see how much they cost and places to get them from.
Looked on tinternet but can only find links to e3024v and such like.

[BadDave]

Sorry to hijack but can any one tell me where i can look to see how much they cost and places to get them from.
Looked on tinternet but can only find links to e3024v and such like.

http://www.e30zone.net/modules.php?name ... c&t=113229

PM Keri for current price and availability

[bimanut]

Thanks

[BMracing]

Thanks everyone, it is a 280mm kit.
I'm pretty sure I had it how Dan says he put his together, and the disc seemed nicely aligned with the caliper.
Well I must have done something wrong!
I'll have a look tomorrow evening when i'm back with the car.

[keri-WMS]

Sorry for not noticing this one earlier! Here's how the bracket goes:




...and the spacer goes on the outside of the disc (between the wheel and disc) and is to correct the thickness of the mounting flange on the disc if needed. The "offset" that's affected is the wheel, not the disc, and the spacers put it back to BMW-spec.

Hope that helps!

[E30_Crazy]

Hey there, Keri,

At work at the moment, and can't get the PDF file to load. Do you know off hand if the 300mm kit will fit with 17" alpina reps?

Also, I was wondering (sounds silly even to me) From the pictures of the 300mm kit, I can't tell if the caliper/pads are enlarged contact surface-wise to match the larger disc surface?.... I would imagine they are; that's what gives you stopping power. I just couldn't tell from the pics.

Thanks!

[keri-WMS]

Hey there, Keri,

At work at the moment, and can't get the PDF file to load.

Does the PDF work when you're at your home PC etc?

Do you know off hand if the 300mm kit will fit with 17" alpina reps?

Not off the top of my head I'm afraid, although I am pretty sure they will - maybe a 2mm spacer or similar. The 280mm kit fitted inside a 16" Alpina replica Gareth had with a thin spacer (the newer kits might clear now).

Also, I was wondering (sounds silly even to me) From the pictures of the 300mm kit, I can't tell if the caliper/pads are enlarged contact surface-wise to match the larger disc surface?.... I would imagine they are; that's what gives you stopping power. I just couldn't tell from the pics.

Thanks!

I'm afraid that's a common misconception - in fact a big pad is good at absorbing heat, but gives you less torque. This is because a smaller pad actually has more leverage on the disc as it's "centre" is further out for the hub on the same diameter disc!!!

So back in the day (or on production setups where weight is less of an issue) the aim was to get a big pad footprint to lower the temperatures - but modern pads (like EBC Reds etc) are far better at dealing with heat so can be smaller.

However, it just so happens that the 300x24 4P028 kit's disc is a perfect match with the WMS pads anyway so it's ideal!

Hope that helps!

[E30_Crazy]

Awesome, thanks. Will definitely be looking into these soon. Get the pdf file and check clearances etc. Best to have the brakes to handle the speed/power before I go all out on the motor and end up in a ditch! I've got good suspesion, so that's taken care of.

[keri-WMS]

Awesome, thanks. Will definitely be looking into these soon. Get the pdf file and check clearances etc. Best to have the brakes to handle the speed/power before I go all out on the motor and end up in a ditch! I've got good suspesion, so that's taken care of.

Great stuff, let me know how you get on with the PDF etc!

I'm expecting the (rather overdue.... ) sold-out-in-advance batch of calipers to arrive in the next few days, and will be ordering the next batch straight away.

[BMracing]

Sorry for the late comeback, i've had a manic week!

Eventually got the brakes sorted, but with the carriers the other way round to how they are in Keri's pics!

They're awesome though, can't recommend them enough.
I destroyed the standard brakes in about 20 mins at Mallory, but the WMS items were powerful and faultless throughout the evening at Cadwell the other day.

In fact they were about the only reliable thing on my car!
After being as quick as pretty much anyone out there for the first 45 mins, a coolant hose exploded, had been rubbing on the viscous fan. I span on my coolant and just missed the tyre wall!
We spent a good 45 mins fixing that, but didn't lost too much time as they were clearing up my mess, and an crashed e36 soon after the restart, fortunately they were ok.

Then after I went out my crank sensor started failing (pretty sure it's this), so my engine was cutting out whilst on track!

Then my front wheel bolts came loose! Not sure if this is to do with the spacers? They were only torqued up that morning.

Then I drove home 110 miles without her missing a beat.
All the dramas just added to the fun really!

[keri-WMS]

Sounds like a pretty epic trip!!!! Glad the brakes did the business...

I'd be pretty interested in a close-up photo of your brackets, I can't figure out what you're been up to, to be honest!

Also, remind me which spacers you are running, "where" you are running them, and what wheels you have? Again photos would be perfect to prevent crossed wires.

Your wheel bolts should "idealy" (!) remain tight so I'm curious.

[stonesie]

Sorry for the late comeback, i've had a manic week!

Eventually got the brakes sorted, but with the carriers the other way round to how they are in Keri's pics!

They're awesome though, can't recommend them enough.
I destroyed the standard brakes in about 20 mins at Mallory, but the WMS items were powerful and faultless throughout the evening at Cadwell the other day.

In fact they were about the only reliable thing on my car!
After being as quick as pretty much anyone out there for the first 45 mins, a coolant hose exploded, had been rubbing on the viscous fan. I span on my coolant and just missed the tyre wall!
We spent a good 45 mins fixing that, but didn't lost too much time as they were clearing up my mess, and an crashed e36 soon after the restart, fortunately they were ok.

Then after I went out my crank sensor started failing (pretty sure it's this), so my engine was cutting out whilst on track!

Then my front wheel bolts came loose! Not sure if this is to do with the spacers? They were only torqued up that morning.

Then I drove home 110 miles without her missing a beat.
All the dramas just added to the fun really!

Oh that was you then in the red touring? I was in the white 320I that's not a 320 with the X on the back

It was a good evening and even my standard size brakes coped well, but i was running with the restriction in (lpg mixer plate) next time it shal be removed and re-installed for a cheap drive home

[daimlerman]

Max,you have been to Cadwell and not called in at mine? Shame on you!
I have a CPS in the bits box we could have tried as well...

[BMracing]

Sounds like a pretty epic trip!!!! Glad the brakes did the business...

I'd be pretty interested in a close-up photo of your brackets, I can't figure out what you're been up to, to be honest!

Also, remind me which spacers you are running, "where" you are running them, and what wheels you have? Again photos would be perfect to prevent crossed wires.

Your wheel bolts should "idealy" (!) remain tight so I'm curious.

Hi Keri,

Here's a pic of the bracket mounted in the same way as the pic you posted up (as far as I can see!). I know my mate isn't holding the disc flat against the hub here but I can assure you they were rubbing!


Like I say it's all been fine with them mounted the other way around, not sure what to make of it?!

Oh that was you then in the red touring? I was in the white 320I that's not a 320 with the X on the back

It was a good evening and even my standard size brakes coped well, but i was running with the restriction in (lpg mixer plate) next time it shal be removed and re-installed for a cheap drive home

Hi mate,

Yes I had a quick peek at your car off the track, didn't realise it was a bit of a sleeper! (I was limping back to the pits by the way when you passed me on track! ).
Hope I didn't spoil your evening too much with my coolant dumping!

Max,you have been to Cadwell and not called in at mine? Shame on you!
I have a CPS in the bits box we could have tried as well...

Sorry Malcolm, I completely forgot how nearby you were!
I certainly intend to go there again so will have to pop by and say hello next time!
I'm trialling the CPS from my old white 4 door, it's a very intermittent fault though so it needs to be a long term test!

[BMracing]

Sounds like a pretty epic trip!!!! Glad the brakes did the business...

I'd be pretty interested in a close-up photo of your brackets, I can't figure out what you're been up to, to be honest!

Also, remind me which spacers you are running, "where" you are running them, and what wheels you have? Again photos would be perfect to prevent crossed wires.

Your wheel bolts should "idealy" (!) remain tight so I'm curious.

Sorry Keri, I barely answered your questions!
At the moment i'm running 3mm hubcentric spacers just on the front wheels.

I have 15'' BBS all round.

Since the track day they seem to be holding tight, so it may be down to some dodgy work by the tyre centre that balanced my wheels, it's not like they tighten up wheel bolts very often!

[keri-WMS]

The plot thickens!!!!

Right, here are my initial thoughts:

Wheel spacers - a 3mm proper hub-centric wheel spacers isn't possible on an E30 (if you mean it has a protrusion to locate the wheel), and if you mean than it's a "flat spacer" with a bore that's tight on the wheel-location bore then you have a major safety problem! The G60/WMS(and Wilwood) 280x22 disc is 2mm-ish thinner, so the wheel spacer will be clamping up on the "step" on the hub, with some very nasty forces involved. Can I have an urgent photo of the disc+spacer on the hub please to confirm? (I'm worried about wheel bolt fatigue....)

Brackets - In the photo you have the bracket the correct way round, and the gap to the disc should be 1mm. I would suggest two things to check, (1) that the caliper mounting lugs on your strut are not bent (pointing the bracket towards the disc) and (2) that the wheel bearings in the hub are to spec and not damaged etc. Also make sure that the heat shield isn't getting "pinched" where the bracket mounts the strut, and that there is NO rust or crud on any of the mating faces, specifically the strut lug caliper-mount faces.

Sorry to be a pain but this needs nailing down really, the wheel spacer being the one that worries me more!