First E30 - 316i Touring Rescue - (Update: Now MOT'd!)
Moderator: martauto
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- Old Skooler
- Posts: 8024
- Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 11:00 pm
- Location: zummerzet
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Suspension arms: £105.84 from CP4L any time. Same company, same parts from same shelves.
Little round hole is the filler for the rear screenwash bottle.
Plastic tank IS the screenwash bottle.
Sunroof tilts up at the back or slides completely, depending on which end of the switch you push. Removal of hardened grease and adding new bringsd them back to working as new.
Little round hole is the filler for the rear screenwash bottle.
Plastic tank IS the screenwash bottle.
Sunroof tilts up at the back or slides completely, depending on which end of the switch you push. Removal of hardened grease and adding new bringsd them back to working as new.
When you say which end of the switch... mine is a manual hand winding one, so I'm guessing it just moves up and down?
The Lemforder arms appear to be £120 delivered from CP4L, so a slight saving, where'd you get £105 from, or is that using non-Lemforder?
Need to find some M3 bushes for the lollipops now, probably an eBay job as I can't see them on ECP/CP4L etc.
The Lemforder arms appear to be £120 delivered from CP4L, so a slight saving, where'd you get £105 from, or is that using non-Lemforder?
Need to find some M3 bushes for the lollipops now, probably an eBay job as I can't see them on ECP/CP4L etc.
manual sunroof slides back aswell as up/down.
if rotating the handle clockwise raises the roof,try turning the handle anti-clockwise to slide roof back.
seatbelt-mount rust- a dose of really thin oil ie. wd40,applied from the reverse side,so it can flow inbetween the layers of sheetmetal should stop that localised rust from spreading.
if rotating the handle clockwise raises the roof,try turning the handle anti-clockwise to slide roof back.
seatbelt-mount rust- a dose of really thin oil ie. wd40,applied from the reverse side,so it can flow inbetween the layers of sheetmetal should stop that localised rust from spreading.
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
CP4L have a discount code for orders of over £100 that gives you another £15 off. Find it on their home page.
to make the best of it on large orders, you have to divide your total order up into separate orders of just over £50, £75 and £100.
If the sunroof is stiff, don't force it and break the mechanism. Assist the rear end to drop down first with your hand as you try to turn the handle.
to make the best of it on large orders, you have to divide your total order up into separate orders of just over £50, £75 and £100.
If the sunroof is stiff, don't force it and break the mechanism. Assist the rear end to drop down first with your hand as you try to turn the handle.
Good tip, cheersBrianmoooore wrote:CP4L have a discount code for orders of over £100 that gives you another £15 off. Find it on their home page.
to make the best of it on large orders, you have to divide your total order up into separate orders of just over £50, £75 and £100.
If the sunroof is stiff, don't force it and break the mechanism. Assist the rear end to drop down first with your hand as you try to turn the handle.

It's been a while, almost a year since my last update.
Work offshored part of my job which took a nice chunk of my salary away, and the track bike took priority, so the BMW hasn't had any progress at all, until today.
Stripped out the seats, carpets and other interior bits to see what I have to deal with...
Seats out!

Carpet out!

Found this lurking underneath the centre console, no idea how it could have got there...

Along with this mystery cable...

Drivers side didn't look too bad...

A bit of digging later

Overall, not too bad really, expected worse

On to the passenger side

Again, not that bad in the grand scheme of things...


So it definitely needs new corners welding in, and both sills will definitely be rotten, I can't get one of the boot pockets out (the right one) which is wet, so expecting rot there too.
I know most might have scrapped it by now, but I kinda bought this car to learn to weld on - and I now have a welder. I need to spend the next few weekends finishing the track bike (and then riding it), then I'll pick up some gas and start learning to weld on some spare metal!
Next update hopefully I'll have tried out my new angle grinder with a wire brush to clean those areas up, then I'll know exactly how much metal is going to need replacing. The bulkhead looks ok on the bottom half, but I need to remove the glovebox and bits to take a proper look. Also need to read up on sills too and cut them off at some point, bit nerve wracking! I had to put new inner + outer sills on my classic mini but I ended up paying a neighbour to tackle that!
Onwards and upwards...
Work offshored part of my job which took a nice chunk of my salary away, and the track bike took priority, so the BMW hasn't had any progress at all, until today.
Stripped out the seats, carpets and other interior bits to see what I have to deal with...
Seats out!

Carpet out!

Found this lurking underneath the centre console, no idea how it could have got there...

Along with this mystery cable...

Drivers side didn't look too bad...

A bit of digging later

Overall, not too bad really, expected worse

On to the passenger side

Again, not that bad in the grand scheme of things...


So it definitely needs new corners welding in, and both sills will definitely be rotten, I can't get one of the boot pockets out (the right one) which is wet, so expecting rot there too.
I know most might have scrapped it by now, but I kinda bought this car to learn to weld on - and I now have a welder. I need to spend the next few weekends finishing the track bike (and then riding it), then I'll pick up some gas and start learning to weld on some spare metal!
Next update hopefully I'll have tried out my new angle grinder with a wire brush to clean those areas up, then I'll know exactly how much metal is going to need replacing. The bulkhead looks ok on the bottom half, but I need to remove the glovebox and bits to take a proper look. Also need to read up on sills too and cut them off at some point, bit nerve wracking! I had to put new inner + outer sills on my classic mini but I ended up paying a neighbour to tackle that!
Onwards and upwards...
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
What makes you think the sills are rotten? E30 sills aren't like Mini sills, and rarely need changing in my experience.
I reckon that about half the E30s I've worked on have had a torch under the centre console.
I reckon that about half the E30s I've worked on have had a torch under the centre console.
Ha, how do they get under there? Very odd.Brianmoooore wrote:What makes you think the sills are rotten? E30 sills aren't like Mini sills, and rarely need changing in my experience.
I reckon that about half the E30s I've worked on have had a torch under the centre console.
The sills are showing signs of rust on the outside so I've very little hope about the inside! I'll wire wheel everything before I start cutting away though just in case it's not as bad as it seems.
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Torches slip down into the centre console when they work loose from their charging socket in the glovebox. There's a space there they can just fit through.
Sunlight was still out after work and I had a spare hour, bit more digging, and trying out my new toy - Bosch angle grinder! Never used one before, ear defenders on order...
Turns out I have the optional extra of 'removable plates':
Drivers side


Started stripping the sill to see how bad it was externally, found holes, so it's rotted:

The minimum I'll need to cut out:

Moving over to the passenger side:

At least the mudguard came off easily, or more like fell off:

Gulp...

Both wings are like this, will probably try find replacement panels instead of patching:

More sill holes:


Help needed, what's the best way to remove the glovebox without screwing up positioning?
Also, what's the spring and mechanism top right for?
Hopefully there will be some car left at the end of this...

On the bright side, I've never had an angle grinder, got to love making sparks, my inner 5 year old is fully embracing it.
Turns out I have the optional extra of 'removable plates':
Drivers side


Started stripping the sill to see how bad it was externally, found holes, so it's rotted:

The minimum I'll need to cut out:

Moving over to the passenger side:

At least the mudguard came off easily, or more like fell off:

Gulp...

Both wings are like this, will probably try find replacement panels instead of patching:

More sill holes:


Help needed, what's the best way to remove the glovebox without screwing up positioning?
Also, what's the spring and mechanism top right for?

Hopefully there will be some car left at the end of this...

On the bright side, I've never had an angle grinder, got to love making sparks, my inner 5 year old is fully embracing it.
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Perhaps you were right about the sills after all!iDemonix wrote:Oh also, I'm guessing I don't need to replicate these bits when replacing?
The bit in the pic is a jacking point, and is welded to a substantial bracket inside the sills. Drill out the spot welds to remove it, and reattach after replacing the sills.
Undo the two nuts on the bulkhead to remove the glovebox, and leave the hinge to box joint undisturbed.
"Spring and mechanism" are the brake linkage, converting from LH drive to RH drive. Rather important that you keep it.
what's the spring and mechanism top right for?
that operates your brakes, via the servo into the master cylinder.
press the brake pedal and watch it move. i,m guess original german e30 were left hand drive , when they converted for right hand drive market, left all the brake pipes etc the same just used a push rod assembly mechanism to connect to brake pedal the other side of the car.
that thing in last photo is the jacking point, where the factory supplied jack fits in.
I had to lol at you comment B
Rather important that you keep it.
that operates your brakes, via the servo into the master cylinder.
press the brake pedal and watch it move. i,m guess original german e30 were left hand drive , when they converted for right hand drive market, left all the brake pipes etc the same just used a push rod assembly mechanism to connect to brake pedal the other side of the car.
that thing in last photo is the jacking point, where the factory supplied jack fits in.
I had to lol at you comment B
Rather important that you keep it.
Cheers for the help guys, I thought that might have been the brake, if I wasn't lazy and looked under the bonnet I'd have realised!
Ah ok, so if I replace the sills I can just spot weld those brackets back on in place, not that I ever plan on using the factory jack as it looks like it came out a christmas cracker.
I think I'll keep the brake linkage, sounds potentially important
Need to strip the fuel line off the passenger side before I do much more cutting/grinding otherwise the car might end up as a burnt out shell...
Ah ok, so if I replace the sills I can just spot weld those brackets back on in place, not that I ever plan on using the factory jack as it looks like it came out a christmas cracker.
I think I'll keep the brake linkage, sounds potentially important

Need to strip the fuel line off the passenger side before I do much more cutting/grinding otherwise the car might end up as a burnt out shell...
- aimlessrock
- E30 Zone Squatter
- Posts: 1821
- Joined: Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:00 pm
- Location: Manchester
loving this- keep up the good work.
E30 320i Convertible (1989)
190 Mercedes (1988)
"there is nothing more expensive than a cheap E30"
190 Mercedes (1988)
"there is nothing more expensive than a cheap E30"
Cheers
As I imagine there's going to be lots of it, should I buy a proper spot weld cutter? One of the little mini circular cutters? Or just stick with regular drill bits?
There's a ToolStation and Screwfix 2 mins from my house, and a EuroCP 10 mins away, Machine Mart is quite a journey.

As I imagine there's going to be lots of it, should I buy a proper spot weld cutter? One of the little mini circular cutters? Or just stick with regular drill bits?
There's a ToolStation and Screwfix 2 mins from my house, and a EuroCP 10 mins away, Machine Mart is quite a journey.
- mineralblue
- Rocking Horse Poo
- Posts: 729
- Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:00 pm
- Location: Nottingham
Patched original wings will fit better than replacement pattern ones, mine looked similar to yours and have been patched with the bottom section of a new pattern one, rather than replacing the whole thing. Unless of course they are too far gone.
Ah do the pattern ones not fit nicely? That's a shame.
I'll have to wait until they're off to see, but I'm guessing they're too far gone as the lip around the arch is very crusty, I'll be amazed if they're saveable.
Going to try find a cheap waterproof car cover that will fit over the touring whilst I take the wings and possibly front doors off.
I'll have to wait until they're off to see, but I'm guessing they're too far gone as the lip around the arch is very crusty, I'll be amazed if they're saveable.
Going to try find a cheap waterproof car cover that will fit over the touring whilst I take the wings and possibly front doors off.
Another spare hour, decided to see how bad the drivers side wing is:

Same as the other side really. The rot ends wear the ridge is, so might be possible (as someone mentioned) to buy pattern wings and just cut + weld the bottom sections. It will depend on how bad the arches are, and they look bad.
Started expanding the operation...

The sills look awful because they're a mix of flaking bubbled underseal and moss. I presumed they would be pure rust underneath so decided as I was started now to just carry on:


It's horrible to wire wheel off, the yellow layer underneath is like glue, takes ages to properly remove and gets everywhere:

The sills are actually surprisingly solid it seems, it's just around the jacking points there are holes, so maybe it can be patched instead of sills replaced? It's clearly been badly jacked as the lip of the sills is bent around both jacking points where the holes are.
It was pissing it down at this point, so decided to quickly whip the rust off the drivers door:

It's deeply pitted but I can't force a hole through, maybe this could just be filled and painted.
I don't really like the black stripes going along the sills and lower of the doors, but it covers most of the problem areas and it's easier to repaint than silver, so I reckon for now I'll keep the lines the original owner did - even the little swoop bit at the back
Have left bare metal for now, will do some more in the coming sunshine evenings and chuck some anti-rust primer on to protect whilst I figure out next steps!

Same as the other side really. The rot ends wear the ridge is, so might be possible (as someone mentioned) to buy pattern wings and just cut + weld the bottom sections. It will depend on how bad the arches are, and they look bad.
Started expanding the operation...

The sills look awful because they're a mix of flaking bubbled underseal and moss. I presumed they would be pure rust underneath so decided as I was started now to just carry on:


It's horrible to wire wheel off, the yellow layer underneath is like glue, takes ages to properly remove and gets everywhere:

The sills are actually surprisingly solid it seems, it's just around the jacking points there are holes, so maybe it can be patched instead of sills replaced? It's clearly been badly jacked as the lip of the sills is bent around both jacking points where the holes are.
It was pissing it down at this point, so decided to quickly whip the rust off the drivers door:

It's deeply pitted but I can't force a hole through, maybe this could just be filled and painted.
I don't really like the black stripes going along the sills and lower of the doors, but it covers most of the problem areas and it's easier to repaint than silver, so I reckon for now I'll keep the lines the original owner did - even the little swoop bit at the back

Have left bare metal for now, will do some more in the coming sunshine evenings and chuck some anti-rust primer on to protect whilst I figure out next steps!
Bit more:

Can't find much more rust on the sill other than the ends, so think patching might be the answer.


Someone has badly jacked it at some point and split the seam:

I reckon a patch would look like this:

Still not even turned the welder on yet, lots to learn first, but trying to get the rot cut and treated as an interim...

Can't find much more rust on the sill other than the ends, so think patching might be the answer.


Someone has badly jacked it at some point and split the seam:

I reckon a patch would look like this:

Still not even turned the welder on yet, lots to learn first, but trying to get the rot cut and treated as an interim...
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Sills look savable to me, and the sections at the bottom of the front wings aren't difficult to fabricate yourself to a standard every bit as good as those on pattern wings.
Finnish the sills with stone chip, and paint body colour. Not much paint spraying skill required to coat that.
Finnish the sills with stone chip, and paint body colour. Not much paint spraying skill required to coat that.
Suppose I could have a go at replicating it with sheet metal! Maybe I'll give that a whirl first when the time comes.
Will either paint body colour over stonechip, or just stick to black as the look doesn't bother me much, it's very tatty all round and I won't be respraying it (unless I end up keeping it for ages).
Going to pick up some gas for the welder and try and get that going soon, really need to start practicing on sheet metal and making sure I'm actually able to weld well enough to sort it. The floor pan corner is quite awkward to get the angle grinder in so might have to go through a few dremel discs. I'm going to aim to cut the floor behind the throttle pedal bracket, so I won't have to replace/replicate it.
Next job is find a car cover so I can safely start taking the wings, grill and bumper off.
Will either paint body colour over stonechip, or just stick to black as the look doesn't bother me much, it's very tatty all round and I won't be respraying it (unless I end up keeping it for ages).
Going to pick up some gas for the welder and try and get that going soon, really need to start practicing on sheet metal and making sure I'm actually able to weld well enough to sort it. The floor pan corner is quite awkward to get the angle grinder in so might have to go through a few dremel discs. I'm going to aim to cut the floor behind the throttle pedal bracket, so I won't have to replace/replicate it.
Next job is find a car cover so I can safely start taking the wings, grill and bumper off.
Cheers 
I generally buy project cars to learn on, I had worse on the mini but got help with the welding of the floor pans and sills!
Is the bottom half of the front bumper easily removable? Mine is painted solid black (look in thread for pics) below the bumper. I was thinking I could remove it, strip it of rust and paint it in the garage - can I buy rattle can silver that's close to the car colour? It's the sterling silver colour. I'm getting ahead of myself but eventually I'd like the front to look like this:


I generally buy project cars to learn on, I had worse on the mini but got help with the welding of the floor pans and sills!
Is the bottom half of the front bumper easily removable? Mine is painted solid black (look in thread for pics) below the bumper. I was thinking I could remove it, strip it of rust and paint it in the garage - can I buy rattle can silver that's close to the car colour? It's the sterling silver colour. I'm getting ahead of myself but eventually I'd like the front to look like this:

I just re-read the thread to jog my memory of what I've done and remembered my genius update I forgot to post.
How did I get the locking wheel nuts off that were seized without destroying them? Took a while to think of something, but then remembered I had a box of old detailing clay and used it to make some moulds:

Hopped on the CBR and headed to the local BMW dealership and took the moulds in to the parts desk. The guy was a bit bewildered at first, but he disappeared with another guy for ages whilst I checked out an i8 (it's not possible to get in one wearing leathers it turns out) and eventually he came back with what looked closest. Bought it, rode home, worked a treat.


How did I get the locking wheel nuts off that were seized without destroying them? Took a while to think of something, but then remembered I had a box of old detailing clay and used it to make some moulds:

Hopped on the CBR and headed to the local BMW dealership and took the moulds in to the parts desk. The guy was a bit bewildered at first, but he disappeared with another guy for ages whilst I checked out an i8 (it's not possible to get in one wearing leathers it turns out) and eventually he came back with what looked closest. Bought it, rode home, worked a treat.


Small update, cover arrived!

Can start removing bumper, valance and wings this week.
For those wondering, it's this cover: https://amzn.to/2rUA2BS
Fits pretty much bang on, if the roof bars weren't on it'd be perfect.

Can start removing bumper, valance and wings this week.
For those wondering, it's this cover: https://amzn.to/2rUA2BS
Fits pretty much bang on, if the roof bars weren't on it'd be perfect.
Another small rust coloured update.
Decided that now I know the extent of the sill rust, I need to dig around the front end to find all of it.
Pulled the lip off the valance


Some of the bolts are a pain in the arse to reach and obviously all of them just have round rusted blobs for a head. Took a lot of patience, awkward angles and plus gas to get these out with wall-drive sockets...

Some brackets just ended up getting snapped out...

Bumper off.

Hey, that's not too bad!

...ah shit.

Dig dig dig....

Spent about an hour trying to get the rusty bolts out, then lost my patience and got them off in 10 seconds

Valance isn't looking too clever either...

Missus pulled up with a takeaway, so the wings can come off another evening.

As she stands:

Decided that now I know the extent of the sill rust, I need to dig around the front end to find all of it.
Pulled the lip off the valance


Some of the bolts are a pain in the arse to reach and obviously all of them just have round rusted blobs for a head. Took a lot of patience, awkward angles and plus gas to get these out with wall-drive sockets...

Some brackets just ended up getting snapped out...

Bumper off.

Hey, that's not too bad!

...ah shit.

Dig dig dig....

Spent about an hour trying to get the rusty bolts out, then lost my patience and got them off in 10 seconds

Valance isn't looking too clever either...

Missus pulled up with a takeaway, so the wings can come off another evening.

As she stands:

- aimlessrock
- E30 Zone Squatter
- Posts: 1821
- Joined: Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:00 pm
- Location: Manchester
keep at it mate.
E30 320i Convertible (1989)
190 Mercedes (1988)
"there is nothing more expensive than a cheap E30"
190 Mercedes (1988)
"there is nothing more expensive than a cheap E30"
Brace yourselves for this one, ugh...
Started wire wheeling the front:

Wing off, not many pics doing it, not very interesting:

Started removing the inner liner, bolts are made of wet tissue at this point:

Starting to see a pattern...

Removed the inner arch liner, and the plastic under tray from under the engine/rad.
Started inspecting for rust.
Bit of rust here...

Bit more rust here...

Oh dear.


Eek.

The extent.

Optimist: Well at least behind the wings and out of sight is a good place to practice welding.
Pessimist: Fuck.
Started wire wheeling the front:

Wing off, not many pics doing it, not very interesting:

Started removing the inner liner, bolts are made of wet tissue at this point:

Starting to see a pattern...

Removed the inner arch liner, and the plastic under tray from under the engine/rad.
Started inspecting for rust.
Bit of rust here...

Bit more rust here...

Oh dear.


Eek.

The extent.

Optimist: Well at least behind the wings and out of sight is a good place to practice welding.
Pessimist: Fuck.
- Brianmoooore
- E30 Zone Team Member
- Posts: 49358
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:00 pm
Try not to break off too many of those coarse studs welded to the shell. They're quite fiddly to weld back on. Destroy the plastic nut with heat or a grinder, rather than break the stud.
Similarly, all the spire clips and the small self tapping hex. screws that screw into them should be removed by destroying them, rather than damaging what they're holding in place, if they're reluctant to undo. Replace the spire clips every time you dismantle the car (dirt cheap in packs of 100 on ebay), and buy stainless hex. self tappers if you can find them.
Rust in the last series of pics., apart from the severity of it at the sides of the front panel is pretty much the going rate for unrestored E30s.
Similarly, all the spire clips and the small self tapping hex. screws that screw into them should be removed by destroying them, rather than damaging what they're holding in place, if they're reluctant to undo. Replace the spire clips every time you dismantle the car (dirt cheap in packs of 100 on ebay), and buy stainless hex. self tappers if you can find them.
Rust in the last series of pics., apart from the severity of it at the sides of the front panel is pretty much the going rate for unrestored E30s.