Why does everyone seem to think 320i's a rubbish

[Andy_magic]

cause the owners of 1.6's know and accept they are pants

Fair play

I think to put things in context that the 325i is a superb car, the 320 isn't AS good as the 325 but it is still a vastly superior car to it's competition.

Sierra 2 litre
Cavalier 2 litre
ETC etc.

[tomstickland]

Err what would you expect from a 15-20 year old car 25mpg for a 2.0 six is bloody good for a car from that era.

I keep reading about people managing 35mpg from them.
318IS is much better on fuel consumption and feels more eager.

I still like the 320 though.

[Simon]

I think the main problem being because BMW made such a wide range of models, obviously there's going to be the top of the range, and a bottom of the range for people who want economy and cheap insurance i.e. the 316i, then there's always going to be a middle of the range car in this case the 320i.

At the end of the day though it's still an E30, and that's what were here for! I've got a 320i, and they do sound much nicer than a 2.5 due to the smaller ports, and they go OK, but I am really p1ssed with the fuel consumption though compared to my old sport, maybe I've got a fuelling problem causing this though, but BMW's official figures do show the 2.0 as having worse MPG than the 2.5!

[Richy325iTouring]

is true si
my old 320 was far worse than any of my 325 the 328 (m10 wasnt bad though)

i like the sound on the 320 i actualy like the 320 its smooth and classy and they do go well.

get a 320 on bottle tops and they just drift forever

[Guest]

I've got a 1990 320i SE and i for one love it.

It's quite rusty, but it's in good hands...it will look really nice soon.

I've just started to put my de-chrome kit that I bought from FAB on it and started to strip it out, hopefully getting some subframes from a 'zoner soon, I've modded an aftermarket aerial to take a VW 16V Mark 2 Golf aerial (quite proud of that as I'm bloody hopeless) and hopefully putting the DTM Cup mirrors on tonight (thanks to bmwgirlie who sprayed them for me).

Then it's gonna have new front wings fitted (they were awfully rusty by the mudflaps...they almost completely fell to bits once I took the flaps off) and my Lumma Design front bumper.

Plan is to do the styling this year, and then upgrade the mechanical stuff next year (still looking everyday at E34 M5, E36 M3 and E46 M3 engines and drooling in anticipation), but I will miss the M20, its been really good to me as I bought the car really cheap and did two months worth of 200 miles a day to work (bear in mind its got 160K on the clock). It's a shame the previous owner didn't look after the bodywork as much as the mechanical side (fully bmw stamped up) but it has got me back to where I belong, modifying a base model bmw to become something that hopefully i get to the point where it's good enough for a feature in PBMW (again!)

[Borderbmw]

My first E30 was a zinnober red 316 on an e plate,which was mint ...i paid Ԛ£1000 for it off my ex-bosses girlfriend,she hadnt long spent Ԛ£800 on it having a replacement engine fitted,i spent a week taking it out and fitting it properly....and then i found out it was actually an M10 2 litre lump ,but after a 406 turbo diesel ive now got a 320 and its great i love it...!

[Simon13]

WOW!

Cheers Karan!

I'm sorry i do this on every 320 thread, and beacuse of all the new folks on here recently i knew someone would bite! and i couldn't help myself he he

I've done my time like Karan,Wil etc and gone from 318 to 318is to 325.

One thing i will say is the cleanest E30's are those 320's kept by old people in their garages with reams of dealer stamps. Ripe for those big lump conversions, plus late 320's came in nice colours with loads of toys too

[johnl320]

I've just read this whole thread, I've got a 316 (carb,auto) and a 320i manual. so I'm just off to kill myself . I have driven a lot of cars and have owned 12 beemers ,and in my opinion the 325 is a little bit lacking in power in its standard form. Just my opinion,you can argue with me if you want . But its what you want out of your car thats important.
P.S. The 316 is slowly growing up and is turning into a 335!!

[Simon13]

thats because the 325 from the factory was more geared up for economy, the standard cam is as flat as a witches tit for a start

[Andy335Touring]

Anouther 335 !

[tomstickland]

I took my 320 out for a drive tonight and, actually, it's a great car. Feels more solid and comfortable than the 318IS.

[Simon13]

I took my 320 out for a drive tonight and, actually, it's a great car. Feels more solid and comfortable than the 318IS.

behave? 320 heavier over the front end so feels bigger and stronger and slower than an iS. Does 320 have sport seats?

[Demlotcrew]

I took my 320 out for a drive tonight and, actually, it's a great car. Feels more solid and comfortable than the 318IS.

behave? 320 heavier over the front end so feels bigger and stronger and slower than an iS. Does 320 have sport seats?

Yeah That!

A

[Borderbmw]

Well i tried not to get drawn further into this discussion but........Id love a 325 sport,but i needed a car and my mate gave me a D plate (solid but scruffy) 320i for the cost of 6 months tax and im enjoying it for what it is..........There all E30's are they not so lets just enjoy what we've got

[bryang]

Id rather have a 320 in great nick than a scrappy 325 , that would be my first consideration..

one of the new smart fourfour things has 177BHP, so beware!

[Widge]

Id rather have a 320 in great nick than a scrappy 325 , that would be my first consideration..

Yeah but thats true of just about any car!
I'd rather have a 998 mini in great nick than a 1300 i sh1t order.

[Gromit]

Most two liter engines don't have six cylinders, so in that sense the Bmw motor is a peculiarity. Having owned E30's with both M20B20 and M20B25 engines, I can say they are from different planets. As mentioned, same mpg, with a tremendous difference in performance. The only positive things about the M20B20 I can think of are the Bmw straight six sound and bigger water canals in the head.

This just to compare the two without any bias, of course an E30 with either engine is lightyears ahead of its contemporaries from other manufacturers. I am a believer

[tomstickland]

Well looks like I'm going to be driving the 320 for a while until I sort the tax out on the 318.

I love the 318. But I also like the 320 a lot. For different reasons really. Mainly because mine cost me Ԛ£450 and after cleaning it out it is a tidy car that's enjoyable to drive. It's only the low 20s on mpg that bugs me about it really.

Give me a twisty road and I'll want to be in the 318IS every time though.

[Andyboy1]

It's when people start talking about modding 320s that it gets silly.
What's the point of sticking a 325 throttle body on a 320, when you'll get far better returns by leaving the throttle body still attached to it's parent engine.

Clearly someone here is talking out of their arse/has never driven a 320i with chip and bigger throttle body.

But as someone who's had an M3 Sport Evo 111 and a 2.7 Alpina I'd know what a decently quick E30 feels like. How about you?

[Andy325i]

My dolphin 320 is smooth, but as you guys suggest, a little under-powered compared to my daily drive 525 24v.

Mmmmm if I could transplant the M50 lump .

What are you waiting for

[Brianmoooore]

Clearly someone here is talking out of their arse/has never driven a 320i with chip and bigger throttle body.

But as someone who's had an M3 Sport Evo 111 and a 2.7 Alpina I'd know what a decently quick E30 feels like. How about you? [/quote]

Theres a M50 engined E30 and a Mitsibushi Evo 8 sitting outside the door, so I know what a reasonably quick E30 feels like, and what a seriously quick car feels like. The fact still remains, that whatever you do to a 2.0 M20, you'll get far better results by doing the same to a 2.5 M20

[tomstickland]

Well seeing as the 2.0 and 2.5 engines are the same block (?) then there's no weight disadvantage in going for the larger engine. First rule of tuning, start with the largest capacity you can have without being silly.

[Andy325i]

Well seeing as the 2.0 and 2.5 engines are the same block (?) then there's no weight disadvantage in going for the larger engine. First rule of tuning, start with the largest capacity you can have without being silly.

As JC said, to make a really fast car, you need to start with a fast one in the first place

[Brianmoooore]

Id rather have a 320 in great nick than a scrappy 325 , !

I'd rather have both. Then I'd take the engine out of the scrappy 325 and put it in the 320.
Have done, a few times.

[Widge]

It's when people start talking about modding 320s that it gets silly.
What's the point of sticking a 325 throttle body on a 320, when you'll get far better returns by leaving the throttle body still attached to it's parent engine.

Clearly someone here is talking out of their arse/has never driven a 320i with chip and bigger throttle body.

To be fair Brian tends to know what he's talking about.
And if you're going to mod an engine it makes sence to start with the more efficient combustion chamber.

[johnono]

It's when people start talking about modding 320s that it gets silly.
What's the point of sticking a 325 throttle body on a 320, when you'll get far better returns by leaving the throttle body still attached to it's parent engine.

Clearly someone here is talking out of their arse/has never driven a 320i with chip and bigger throttle body.

But as someone who's had an M3 Sport Evo 111 and a 2.7 Alpina I'd know what a decently quick E30 feels like. How about you?

This is not the place for comments like this. Brian is a respected member of the E30zone, as are we all and do not take kindly to those who make comments of this kind.

[Widge]

To be honest he has a point
But then why the fcuk would brian ever want to have driven a 320 with a chip and a BBTB

[johnono]

[Widge]

2.5------->2.7 you know it make sense

Don't you have 320 wrongness Johnono?

[Zayyan]

Slightly but what's the difference between a 2.0 ---> 2.7 and a 2.5 ---> 2.7?

Have wondered for a while now...

[johnono]

320 "wrongness" until i blow it up

[Widge]

That's the attitude Johnono the bitch up then get a 2.5


As for 2.0--->2.7 Zayyan IMO it depends weather it's a 2.0 based or 2.5 based 2.7. At least you have the right attitude and aren't sticking with the 2.0 .

[johnono]

3.5 big six but its not that easy over here to change up motors, so i may go for a s50? the 2.5 for a e36

[Ziggy]

This is not the place for comments like this. Brian is a respected member of the E30zone, as are we all and do not take kindly to those who make comments of this kind.

Well I guess some people respect Andy... wouldn't catch me admitting that though!

I'm sure Brain's not gonna be offended by anything anyone says on a forum, particularly a bit of light hearted banter like this!

Aaaanyway; so 320s are cheap as chips, sound great, smooth as you like, are cheaper to insure (by however much), easy to find, can get very decent power gains for hardly any money, less reliability probs... yeah I give up; they're $hit.

[StuBeeDoo]

I have my own theory about the M20 engine, and it's all to do with the law of deminishing returns.
M20 originally was designed as a 2.0 litre. Everyone knows that when you increase the power and/or capacity of an engine, the more mods you make, every following mod will make slightly less difference.
As an example, this is why fitting a BBTB to a '20 gives better gains than doing the same to a '25.
Therefore, when BMW "stretched" the M20 to 2.5 (and beyond), it became harder and more expensive to get even more power from the big capacity variants. Had they not radically re-designed the 'head (which brought about its own set of issues), they probably wouldn't have got very much more power from the '25 than they already had in the '23.
This is why 150bhp from a '20 and 160+bhp from a '23 are easily and cheaply achieveable (sp?). To get the same percentage gain from the '25 and '27 costs a lot more in terms of finance and hard graft.

On a purely personal level, I will be more than happy if I get somewhere near 150bhp out of my '20. It's about all the power I need (and I have had 200bhp+ cars), particularly for the type of use my Touring gets. When I bought mine, I was really looking for a '25 and couldn't find a decent one that wasn't over-priced, but had I known what I do now I probably would have gone straight for a '20.
At the end of the day, it's down to personal choice, most of us that drive 320i's do so for our own reasons. Those of you that want big power from your M20 can throw all the money and effort you want at your '25's and ETA's, but don't keep dissing those of us that either can't afford to go down that road, or - like me - don't want to.
For some of us, power isn't the be all and end all!
Stuart.