M20 Individual Throtle Bodies

[Widge]

I plan on doing ITB's with a phlenum AFM and all the original Motronic stuff, and see how it goes. I'll get a 2.7 chip off Ant too. I recon with some tweaking it could work really well, think I may have to find a bigger AFM though. If that's not too good I'm torn between a MAF conversion or just going to Mega Squirt so I can map it my self, dunno it's a long way off as it is though

[E30BeemerLad]

I think it's only worth going so far with the M20 normally aspirated, for the cost of all this grief we can have a 3.5 M30 poking out 220 bhp and similar torque

Can't wait to see Toby's tomorrow

[Widge]

Yeah but there is an originality cost.....sort of. I don't think I would bother with a 3.5 M30 swap. If I'm gonna swap I'll do it properly and go M5 V8 like Karan, or a V12. But at the mo I can't so I'd rather develop the M20 -> 2.7 and then ITB's -> who knows what

[E327UKL]

i done this using porcshe individual 48mm throttle bodies. what you need to do to make this work easily and with the most amount of flow and power is find some bodies that are tubular at both ends, this way you can cut the alloy plate that mates with the head and weld the same diameter tubes as the throttle bodies on to it and get welding and grinding to smooth out the different shapes. to mate the manifold and throttle bodies i used 65mm lengths of samco. i used socks and a omex ecu. the noise is outa this world!! throw away the turbos and get the noise of 3 webers and no lag!!!

i have a set of 38mm individual tubalr shaped bike carbs i was goin to use on a e36 318 with a aldon! Ԛ£100 if any wan em.

[Widge]

Post a pic mate, what are they from? GSXR 600 Tb's are 38mm - have you got 6 of them?

[E327UKL]

these are carbs not throttle bodies they are of a yamaha750 race rep. i also have a airbox for them and the joining rubbers! but unfortanetly there are only 4 as like i say i was gona put em on me 318. ( dont ask me y i bought a 318 ) easy project to do get a aldon dizzy sorted and a manifold and awy you go to the rolling road!!!!!!!

[Widge]

I'm looking at TB's off a GSXR, and it's a 325 so I need 6!

[E327UKL]

to be honest with ya y are you choosing bike throttle bodies? you can get a 6 tbs which will work out cheaper in the long run and give more power! thats y i abandoned but if thats what you want go for it!!

[Widge]

What do you mean "6tb's" surely that's what I'm getting six throttle bodies from a bike?

[E327UKL]

yeh 3 pairs of webcons!

[Widge]

Sorry mate I'm not up on this stuff what are "webcons"?
Thanks for being patient I'm not normally this dappy

[E327UKL]

they make throttle bodies that are very similar to webers(use webers mountings). i think bexley has a cheap weber manifold for a m20.

check out motoring news every thursday for cheap throttle bodies. looks like a newspaper

[Widge]

Bike Tb's are quite cheap, and why would "webcons" give more power any way?

[E327UKL]

well bikes are nearly all short stroke and to explain shorty well they are for bikes and webcons are for cars!

woudnt be expecting a great lot of power gains from bike tbs but i can be proved wrong. just what i think

[Widge]

I don't expect a huge power gain, but I am wanting improved throttle response. And even though they are for short stroke bikes, I shouldn't think that makes a huge differance, I am not going to use the bike's injection ports anyway but the original BMW ones so they are only inlet ducts and throttles.

[Stevin]

One thing u guys are all talking about running plenium chambers. U know how much science goes into a plenuim ? to make sure that all the cylinders get equal amounts of air, and not the first one getting loads and the last one getting nothing cause all the air is getting sucked in at the firts cylinder.

BTW there is a MK1 Golf over here, running a 2.0lt with a 20v Audi head, and Jenvey Throttles... making 141kw otw ... N/A

[Turbo-Brown]

What's that about 192bhp or so? Not bad, but not exceptional!

Know what you mean about the plenum design, but look at the E36 M3 Evo plenum and it really is just a big aluminium box!

[jmc330i]

Know what you mean about the plenum design, but look at the E36 M3 Evo plenum and it really is just a big aluminium box!

Youre not wrong there. Although, it is shaped at the back and some work has gone into it to make sure equal amounts of air get to each cylinder.

By comparison - Glenns E39 M5 V8.....

[dazleeds]

jmc that looks gorgeous mate

hope to see her in the flesh oneday

just plain old m30 3l for mine

[Kos]

REGAL AUTOSPORT DO A COMPLETE THROTTLE BODY KIT, ITS ABOUT Ԛ£1700, NICE KIT THOUGH, THEY RECON A 30bhp INCREACE ON ASTANDARD ENGINE

[Jhonno]

Regal :snigger:

[Kos]

HERE IS THE LINK
http://www.regal-shop.co.uk/asps/ShowDe ... sp?id=1893
THEY ALSO DO INLET MANIFOLDS FOR CARBS AND MOST ENGINES
ITS 20BHP INCREACE, NOT 30BHP

[Rearwheel_nick]

REGAL AUTOSPORT DO A COMPLETE THROTTLE BODY KIT, ITS ABOUT Ԛ£1700, NICE KIT THOUGH, THEY RECON A 30bhp INCREACE ON ASTANDARD ENGINE

wow Ԛ£1700 for 30bhp... i could sure as hell think of better ways to spend Ԛ£1700...

[E30BeemerLad]

wow Ԛ£1700 for 30bhp... i could sure as hell think of better ways to spend Ԛ£1700...

Yeah, junk the M20 and go for M30 3.5 power instead, could do the conversion for about Ԛ£700 I reckon

hmmmmmmm I so want to!

[Stevin]

Not M30... got M50/M52... S50. Got a buddy with a S50... runs 12 secs

[dazleeds]

u got the bug Beemerlad

feel free to come and give me a hand doing mine if you want some extra experience of the conversion what ya like at welding etc?

mite have another 730i in the pipeline soon????

[Jhonno]

Regal = Crap..

[jmc330i]

jmc that looks gorgeous mate

hope to see her in the flesh oneday

just plain old m30 3l for mine

Mate, thats Glenns V8 E30 and youre right, totally gorgeous
Puts my conversion to shame Just an S50 for me

[dazleeds]

awwww sorry to wind ya up mate

ws reading glenns thread lastnite and its fookin awesome read the whole thread without moving a muscle

thats true devotion to the project hope we can all learn from him

who knows in a few years the zone could be full of 3l 3.5l and some 4l maybe
dnt know much bout the s50 but will look into it as when my m30s done im after a touring to put a 3.5 or bigger in

yorkshire e30 dominance will be mine

[Kos]

its a proper kit!! i can think of a better way to spent in too buy a NOS kit, but most people hate that. playing with engines is a bottomless pit financially.
why mess about with bike trottle boddies, desighed for a totaly different engine, different compression, peak delivery at a high RPM, you then need management and mapping so a few months later after stress agro skinned knucles you may get it working!!!! but whatever rocks your boat.
3.5 conversion....been there done that with turbo and nos
s50 conversion....been there done that 2 years ago
m20 tripple carbs....doing it now for the hell of it
and it all costs money
some times its easier to bite the bullit and pay and leave it to the pros
i learnt the hard way, then i learnt it for my self and willing to share my knoledge

[Widge]

That's a lot of cash for 20 bhp, but there will be a huge improvement in throttle response. Having said that they can't even put the correct picture above the ad, M20's have 6 TB's guys

[Kos]

thanx for the support on this one widge,
it is a lot of money for 20bhp but add a cam and manifold you are lookin at nearer 50bhp a very responsive engine and if you bolt all together youself, maybe you can skim your fly wheel a touch and lose the vicous fan.
in total i recon Ԛ£2500, how much is a 2.7 with maf and what you get for that conversion 210bhp if your lucky.yes you get more torque but hey it will still spank it round a track or racing cause your reves are at 6000rpm where your peak power is. and as it so smooth in power delivary it'll match it at the bottom end grunt.

[jmc330i]

It is a lot of cash for 20bhp, but like Kos said, once added to other mods it all starts to add up.
I did actually look at buying those a while back, but its one of the reasons I went for the S50 conversion instead - my engine cost less than those TBs.

Still, I think for the guys going the bike TB route, its more about the work and achievement of doing something like that, rather than just paying out for a kit or for someone else to do the work. Thats how I think about mine anyway.

Kos - got any pics of your S50 conversion?

[jmc330i]

awwww sorry to wind ya up mate

who knows in a few years the zone could be full of 3l 3.5l and some 4l maybe

I might put mine back to standard soon - it might be the only one left

[Widge]

Still, I think for the guys going the bike TB route, its more about the work and achievement of doing something like that, rather than just paying out for a kit or for someone else to do the work. Thats how I think about mine anyway.

That's why I want to do mine. I don't expect any power increases, just improved throttle response, and I'm going to try and use a BMW phlenum chamber.